@Morello/Xypherous: Can we get an update on the stealth remake please?

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Traitornator

Junior Member

07-12-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xypherous View Post
1. There's a pretty big problem with the concept known as Oracle-Sweeping. We'd want to replace Oracle's elixir with someone that doesn't cause such weird gameplay but as to what would be a *good* replacement is a little up in the air.
I know it's probably been said, and I know people would cry about it copying DoTA, but why not add Dust of Appearance, or something similar?

Also what happens with wards when/if Oracles comes out of the item list?


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PixelPoet

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Junior Member

07-12-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Thivus View Post
the gem part sounds outrageous
Truly, truly outrageous? I wonder if Taric gets a pink one?


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malphismia

Senior Member

07-12-2011

Um...eve with stun and forever stealth now?

..........u trollin


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rTv StalkeR

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Member

07-12-2011

add a metal gear solid sound when you turn red, that would be pretty hilarious


! <--


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LaFreeze

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Senior Member

07-12-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xypherous View Post
It will not initially. Only long term stealth abilities will be changed.

The others will probably be reworded as "invisiblity" to distinct the two. Short term tactical stealths are in a much better place currently.

However, items that reveal stealth may be broadened a tad and Oracles may be on the block for being removed, so that will tangentially affect him.
I really like the idea of breaking stealth and invisibility into two different abilities. I think stealth will open up some nice new game play and possibly some awesome new champions. I'm really excited to hear this is in the works even if a ways off yet.


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Powerstoned

Member

07-12-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xypherous View Post

Sight wards as being partial motion sensors - Sight wards signalling when a hostile is moving nearby?
If sight wards implemented this now (and the animation flashed on/off when approached by stealthed champions), and your champ had to be alive/there to see it, that might be the best single way to fix stealth mostly and make everyone who uses it "happiest/content".

Vision wards/Oracle would work the same, revealing enemy stealthed on the minimap(while the sightward wouldn't, they just flashed on/off for individuals when close).


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HealingAura

Member

07-12-2011

As a player who plays a lot of games with Twitch and Evelynn, I would like to thank you for not leaving them the way they are right now. Twitch and Evelynn have always been very good against low ELO, but they are considered to be awful in mid/high ELO. I hope these changes will allow us to play as our favorite sneaky champions, outside of low ELO, while not being classified as "the worst champion in the game". I was not surprised that nobody took Evelynn or Twitch during Dreamhack, I just hope we'll see some top competitive players playing them after the change.

I have a few concerns about the stealth changes:

Shortly after I started playing Eve/Twitch, I found out that Flash spell was amazingly useful for them. Flash was used defensively as it gave them time to turn invisible while not attacked, and it was used offensively as it allowed you to jump on the enemy champion and finish him off (especially as Evelynn with her ultimate heal). With the new changes to stealth, Flash will turn from useful to absolutely necessary as it will give your champion the ability to immediately enter/leave the threatened area. Sure, some other champions rely on Flash, but they usually don't have a special gameplay mechanic to relies on Flash as much as stealth champions. If Flash is going to be removed from the game it will immensely affect Evelynn and Twitch much more than other champions, and is the equivalent of removing Smite for junglers.

As all players will be able to see you while you are near them, making stealth ineffective as an escaping tool, Twitch and Evelynn will not be able to escape from many champions. For example: Kassadin, Ashe, Akali, Gragas, Katarina, Jax, Master Yi, Nasus and Xin Zhao all have excellent chasing abilities that can prevent the stealth champions from leaving the threatened area. Will Twitch and Evelynn be given a boost to their movement speed as a result?

What are your general plans for Evelynn and Twitch? Do you intend for them to be buffed and nerfed so they will be hard to master and become useful even in high ELO? Or do you prefer to have these two champions become easily countered? (thus making them terrible for high ELO games) When I first started playing League of Legends, I felt that stealth champions had a huge learning curve and whenever I encountered such a champion, he was either totally useless or just way too good. There are some champions that are being played less often than others because they require an experienced player with them. Blitzcrank is a good example of such a champion where it takes some time to master his grab. Do you expect Evelynn and Twitch to be as challenging to a new player or do you feel that they will both be easy to learn?


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FallacyTL

Senior Member

07-12-2011

Here is my idea for a fun, fair, and balanced stealth system. I understand if reds can’t comment (when I played Magic:TG, wizards wouldn’t respond to card ideas because of intellectual property something, idk if it’s the same at riot).


BASIC CHANGES (I’ll elaborate more on their intended affects in the next section):


- Stealth champs cannot see enemies w/out vision from allied champs, or wards.

- Oracles allows you to see stealthed things AND be seen by stealthed champs.

- Give Oracles a duration and make it cheaper.




What This Means:


- Stealth champs cannot see enemies w/out vision from allied champs, or wards.

-The main antifun patterns for the current stealth mechanic are 1. Scouting and 2. promoting passive defensive gameplay/Limiting options.

1. Scouting: removed because the stealth champ cannot gain info w/out a ward or ally.
2. Passive gameplay: Easily countered by grabing a vision ward for your lane, oracles (especially if cheaper),



-Oracles allows you to see stealthed things AND be seen by stealthed champs

1. This makes it fair. So people “hunting” with oracles can’t have information on the location of a stealthed champ, without them being aware of it.




- Give Oracles a duration and make it cheaper.

1. Oracles cause people to be focused. Meaning the less squishy champs usually take it. The problem is that they usually have the least farm (support and tanks). If it worked like the other potions and was cheaper, it’d be more accessible to the others.
2. because it has a duration, it’ll have to be more invested in over time… think about how annoying it is that 1 support getting oracles early, and building tankier support items, can sit in the back of teamfights all game can be the hardest person to kill. Meaning for a relatively low investment, she can have oracles all game and constantly clear your team’s wards all game. IT’S FKING ANNOYING!!!



I know u already got your system working the way u want. I started writing this a while ago (http://www.leagueoflegends.com/board...18#post6370318), but i thought maybe some of these ideas might help.

Edit: LOL@downvote that came quicker than possible to read the whole thing.


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Fredgerd

Senior Member

07-12-2011

How does this effect Shaco and Akali if at all?

If the effect is negative will they get a compensation buff? Shaco is already kinda weak and I would hate to see him fall from viability entirely. Hes one of the most fun champs in this game.


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TheChaosKing

Recruiter

07-12-2011

You could implement an option while playing Stealth characters that places a circle around them displaying stealth distances