Need Moar Crit Chance?

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vulpixel

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Senior Member

04-09-2010

Right now I am running a crit damage tristana. I have armor pen and crit damage runes and a 21 offensive mastery tree. This build is a glass cannon to shred the 4 squishies on the other team while staying out of their range.

I build greaves, IE, then phantom dancer.
After this 8000 gold, i have over a 60% crit chance, and my crits are doing triple damage.

My question is, where to go next? Attack speed, to hit more often with massive damage? Attack damage, to be tripled 60% of the time? Or crit chance, to get crit 9/10 hits?

So what should item #4 be? And of course, tell me why i shouldnt get the greaves. Thanks =P


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Saberin

Senior Member

04-09-2010

Berserker Greaves are generally considered terrible boots because they bring a very common stat to the table, attack speed. And not even a substantial amount of it.

By comparison, the Ninja Tabi and Sorcerers both bring uncommon stats (dodge and magic penetration) for a cheap price.
Mercury Treads brings an amazing unique ability you can't get anywhere else.
Mobility gives you huge amounts of speed which lets you zoom around maps.
And Swiftness gives you chasing and running ability.

Also, get rid of your crit damage runes. Just combine them and hope you get something good, armor penetration is considered better in pretty much every way.

As for the item, Phantom Dancers do stack so you could consider that, Executioners Calling is also a nice choice, it'll give you lifesteal and okay critical chance on its own, ontop of letting you gimp over healers. You could go for it before the IE and PD for sustainability early game.


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DCode

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Senior Member

04-09-2010

Loose the phantom dancer, after you got greaves \ infinity edge, buy a last whisper,
get at least 9 armor pen marks. buy green or red pot accordingly to your needs.

After those three core items (boots are interchangeable), you can get anything from
damage or survivability, that means phage \ banshees or bloodthirster.


Either ways, if you go last whisper, dont get a black cleaver, because these two
dont interact very well, armor pen is applied this way

debuffs (cleaver, starks) -> percentile (whisper) -> flat (brutalizer, runes, masteries)

So the armor debuff from cleaver is going to make the last whisper less good at what
it does, and whisper is > cleaver when you want your first few hits to pen a ton
of armor and you wont be relying as much on on hit effects (cleaver, like for a warwick).

hope this helps


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Saberin

Senior Member

04-09-2010

Wouldn't a Black Cleaver be better on Tristana assuming he's grabbing Berserker Greaves? She has a buttload of attack speed on her own right and can easily apply every stack of Black Cleaver quickly with her range and slow. It seems like Last Whisper's attack speed bonus will end up going to waste.


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vulpixel

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Senior Member

04-09-2010

I don't want to skip the phantom dancer, the crit chance is what brings this build to usefulness. I suppose that if i went with merc treads or tabi i could just get a second PD to make up for the AS loss (this would almost max out my crit chance and attack speed, a damage item would come next). I could choose black cleaver as an attack boost with armor pen, but in this set I'm not trying to shred the tanks armor, i want to do a buttload of damage to their other four chars; this is also why I feel crit damage runes outdo additional armor pun runes ( I already have 30 armor pen from runes/masteries...enough to pen most attack item only squishies).

I like being able to take out their Ashe/TF/mage in 2 seconds (4 700 damage crits) in team battles before they can do much damage.


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DCode

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Senior Member

04-10-2010

Sorry, I cant help you, I try to make things work with 5000 gold before the game ends,
but you're talking about stacking two phantom dancers and then starting to get
damage items >_>

We play 2 different games, though find what works best for you, for me, its rushing
an infinity edge by 15:00-18:00, get a green pot, melt faces, get a whisper, buy another
green pot and a vamp sceptre, then either phage or BT and so on.

Also, 'squishies' have just about 80 armor for most cases (base, with no items), with
your 30 armor pen, they end up with 50 armor, thats 33% damage reduction.

Now i dont remember tristanas base attack but lets assume its 100, i.e. sets you at
180, lets assume you have +20% crit damage from runes

Your build (i.e. + PD)

180 damage
280% critical damage (2.00 + 0.5 (i.e.) + 0.1 (masteries) + 0.2 (runes)

total damage on critical = 180 * 2.8 = 504 damage

against 50 armor = 337 damage

My build (i.e. + LW) (additional left over gold for green or red pots or both)

200 damage
280% critical damage (2.00 + 0.5 (i.e.) + 0.1 (masteries) + 0.2 (runes)

total damage on critical = 200 * 2.8 = 560

against (80*0.6)-30 = 18 armor (15% reduction) = 476 damage





My tristana would melt your tristana, hope this helps. we're both squishie but
that tiny armor mitigates big


edit.

a couple more things, altough your build has dodge, mine still does have +40 damage,
probably 30% more attack speed, i can get more health, and i can get a vamp sceptre with
the left over gold if i want, too.
However in the numbers i made i didnt take in account the eventual red pot damage.

convinced yet?


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vulpixel

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Senior Member

04-10-2010

DCode-

Thanks for the stats, I didnt realize how much base armor casters had. Although your build had ~25% crit chance (whereas mine would have 60), you make up for it mostly with a green pot. I think this is a good idea and could be an excuse to go for more damage/armor pen sooner. This build would work better than mine in a short (common) game. Thanks for caring enough to reply so carefully.

Quick question...is the LW 40% armor pen taken into account before the -30 from runes/masteries? (Although in this situation even if the -30 was taken first, it would only result in ~8 less armor pen than you said, your point would still be valid)