Advocating for Flat Armor Runes

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realgirl

Senior Member

03-28-2011

A full set of flat armor runes gives you +40 armor at level 1.
Without quints, +28.

I know the standard set up for most champions is

-Flat health quints
-mpen/arpen marks
-dodge seals or mana regen seals
-CD glyphs / mana regen glyphs / whatever (let's face it, glyphs suck)

But I would like to suggest flat armor runes be considered as a serious staple for general use (and not just specialized use).

The benefits of full flat armor:

40 armor, without a single point of investment in the defensive tree, gives complete protection against minions and jungle creeps at level 1, this means you are totally free to go 21 in offense or utility without sacrificing jungling or harassing power in a lane. Minion focus fire is especially obnoxious early game when harassing. Having almost a chain mail at level 1 is extremely advantageous when you like to play aggressive early.

40 armor completely negates any flat armorpen runes/masteries and wards against any shenanigans enemies try to pull with full flat AD runes (allowing you to possibly start with +22 damage at level 1 without items), crit damage runes, and attack speed runes; especially players who try to rush first blood with champions like tryndamere, shaco, twitch, gangplank, and to a lesser extent, Ashe.

From personal experience, my flat armor runes have completely screwed over twitches who've tried to gank me and have allowed me to counter-jungle champions like tryndamere, udyr and olaf with ease.

40 armor works well on any champion regardless of role or energy resource or attack type

40 flat armor is better than scaling armor because for the first 6 levels of play, the majority of damage dealt by enemies is physical, this drops off significantly as enemy champions obtain their ults and get +AP items

40 armor makes you deceptively tanky, you may have only 4 bars of health at level 1, but you'll be able to tank opponents as ryze or annie much longer than what one might think, this is especially true at level 1, when enemies only have one skill for damage. This means you can stay in melee range longer and the cooldowns on your spells will have more time to refresh (being able to cast two spells is like increasing your damage output by 100%, when having 27 flat ap and being only able to cast one spell before dying increases your damage by about 15-20% (if we assume most base damage on spells is between 80-100).

40 armor, even after Riot's tower change, provides life-saving protection when tower diving early game (and is quite useful when being tower-doven, your sliver of health will last you that much longer, especially as Anivia or Poppy early game)

40 armor, with a specialized set up, allows any champion to solo blue/red buffs at level 1 without any assistance and still have useful health leftover (Twitch retains 20% of his maximum HP, Evelynn retains 40% of her maximum HP, Caitlyn/Teemo can even solo red/blue buff at level 1)

40 armor, with cloth armor and defensive mastery +6 armor, gives most champions 85+ armor, this is especially strong on fiddlesticks, who is godly early game with this much armor in a lane, he can drain targets faster than they can damage him, even in 2v1 situations (just hope they don't have a silence/stun/ignite :x). A level 3 doublebuff shaco tries to gank you while you're jungling? Let him try.

40 armor scales (or used to, curse you riot!) beautifully with Rammus and Malphite, giving them large boosts of damage early game; scaling might be considered better for this, but consider the early game benefit against the late game benefit scaling gives you - early game you will be doing more damage because later game enemy champions have more magic resist and health; it is generally better to have a high armor count early to get the most out of it. Also, Rammus/Malphite generally stack armor anyway, so the small difference of percent mitigation or damage lost late game between flat and scaling is minor. Flat armor is quite useful on Soraka and Galio, champions that are generally quite vulnerable to physical damage early game.

40 armor is also amazing in 3v3, where teamfights last longer (and staying alive longer can mean the difference in a fight) and tanky AD champions are more prevalent

40 armor also makes you more heal-efficient. If you're Vlad, Soraka, Sona, Janna, or any champion with a heal/shield ability, 40 armor early game means you will be a beastly tank, able to survive long enough for your support skill to refresh. If enemies try to target you, they better have lots of magic damage.

If you try to use mana regen runes on Soraka, you might find yourself going OOM quickly, as Soraka is quite vulnerable to harass, and with her low initial armor count, her health is not very efficient to heal (when running mana regen runes on her, I tend to use HP pots to restore health on her early game and save my mana for my allies).

So if you've got the spare IP lying around (yeah right, I know. It's tough.) give them a shot. Building glass cannon isn't always the best idea and adding 40 armor to your build, even if you intend to build glass cannon the rest of the game, may make a large bit of difference even late game (when a measly bit of mana regen, AP, HP or penetration may not).


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declawd

Senior Member

03-28-2011

+1 for detailed analysis that's actually true. GJ!


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Lordarcane

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Senior Member

03-28-2011

+1 for food for thought.


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Lizto

Senior Member

03-28-2011

40 armour will also make you seemingly runeless against Mr Fiddlesticks, Malzahar, Lil Miss Annie, Anivia. Im not saying getting armour runes is bad, but I think you should get other stuff like Arm Pen or M. pen.


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Something Snazzy

Senior Member

03-28-2011

Solid points but I'd agree more if you advocated for armor quints and yellows.

Most of those points are situational. How often are you laning with a Sor or Sona? How often are you counter jungling? How often do you take serious damage from a level 1 Annie auto attack?

The other thing is, even with 60 armor at the beginning, if you only have 400 hp, your physical eHP will be 640. If you had 20 armor and bought flat HP yellows/quints (roughly 220 hp), your physical eHP would be 745. And your magical eHP would also be around 745, instead of near 480. The biggest thing about this argument? It also frees up your blue and reds.

And the armor value from reds/blues aren't very good. Yellow + quints + cloth armor = 3 more armor than full armor runes. So basically, you are saving 300 gold for the loss of 15 armor pen, 14 mr and 3 armor. That's not really worth it in my opinion, especially if you end up laning against a Nunu/Ryze combo on a low health character. *Edit* Actually, since you end up with more armor, that isn't worth it no matter who you are playing unless 300 gold is super important for rushing something.


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Crazyflames

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Senior Member

03-28-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by realgirl View Post
A full set of flat armor runes gives you +40 armor at level 1.
Without quints, +28.

I know the standard set up for most champions is

-Flat health quints
-mpen/arpen marks
-dodge seals or mana regen seals
-CD glyphs / mana regen glyphs / whatever (let's face it, glyphs suck)

But I would like to suggest flat armor runes be considered as a serious staple for general use (and not just specialized use).

The benefits of full flat armor:

40 armor, without a single point of investment in the defensive tree, gives complete protection against minions and jungle creeps at level 1, this means you are totally free to go 21 in offense or utility without sacrificing jungling or harassing power in a lane. Minion focus fire is especially obnoxious early game when harassing. Having almost a chain mail at level 1 is extremely advantageous when you like to play aggressive early.

40 armor completely negates any flat armorpen runes/masteries and wards against any shenanigans enemies try to pull with full flat AD runes (allowing you to possibly start with +22 damage at level 1 without items), crit damage runes, and attack speed runes; especially players who try to rush first blood with champions like tryndamere, shaco, twitch, gangplank, and to a lesser extent, Ashe.

From personal experience, my flat armor runes have completely screwed over twitches who've tried to gank me and have allowed me to counter-jungle champions like tryndamere, udyr and olaf with ease.

40 armor works well on any champion regardless of role or energy resource or attack type

40 flat armor is better than scaling armor because for the first 6 levels of play, the majority of damage dealt by enemies is physical, this drops off significantly as enemy champions obtain their ults and get +AP items

40 armor makes you deceptively tanky, you may have only 4 bars of health at level 1, but you'll be able to tank opponents as ryze or annie much longer than what one might think, this is especially true at level 1, when enemies only have one skill for damage. This means you can stay in melee range longer and the cooldowns on your spells will have more time to refresh (being able to cast two spells is like increasing your damage output by 100%, when having 27 flat ap and being only able to cast one spell before dying increases your damage by about 15-20% (if we assume most base damage on spells is between 80-100).

40 armor, even after Riot's tower change, provides life-saving protection when tower diving early game (and is quite useful when being tower-doven, your sliver of health will last you that much longer, especially as Anivia or Poppy early game)

40 armor, with a specialized set up, allows any champion to solo blue/red buffs at level 1 without any assistance and still have useful health leftover (Twitch retains 20% of his maximum HP, Evelynn retains 40% of her maximum HP, Caitlyn/Teemo can even solo red/blue buff at level 1)

40 armor, with cloth armor and defensive mastery +6 armor, gives most champions 85+ armor, this is especially strong on fiddlesticks, who is godly early game with this much armor in a lane, he can drain targets faster than they can damage him, even in 2v1 situations (just hope they don't have a silence/stun/ignite :x). A level 3 doublebuff shaco tries to gank you while you're jungling? Let him try.

40 armor scales (or used to, curse you riot!) beautifully with Rammus and Malphite, giving them large boosts of damage early game; scaling might be considered better for this, but consider the early game benefit against the late game benefit scaling gives you - early game you will be doing more damage because later game enemy champions have more magic resist and health; it is generally better to have a high armor count early to get the most out of it. Also, Rammus/Malphite generally stack armor anyway, so the small difference of percent mitigation or damage lost late game between flat and scaling is minor. Flat armor is quite useful on Soraka and Galio, champions that are generally quite vulnerable to physical damage early game.

40 armor is also amazing in 3v3, where teamfights last longer (and staying alive longer can mean the difference in a fight) and tanky AD champions are more prevalent

40 armor also makes you more heal-efficient. If you're Vlad, Soraka, Sona, Janna, or any champion with a heal/shield ability, 40 armor early game means you will be a beastly tank, able to survive long enough for your support skill to refresh. If enemies try to target you, they better have lots of magic damage.

If you try to use mana regen runes on Soraka, you might find yourself going OOM quickly, as Soraka is quite vulnerable to harass, and with her low initial armor count, her health is not very efficient to heal (when running mana regen runes on her, I tend to use HP pots to restore health on her early game and save my mana for my allies).

So if you've got the spare IP lying around (yeah right, I know. It's tough.) give them a shot. Building glass cannon isn't always the best idea and adding 40 armor to your build, even if you intend to build glass cannon the rest of the game, may make a large bit of difference even late game (when a measly bit of mana regen, AP, HP or penetration may not).
Karthus with ignite makes this deceptively dead. But thats only one of a few situations where this isn't a great idea, just that some champs that have sustained magic damage or low CD magic damage would do so much damage agains't you. Pure HP might be beter but it wouldn't make you as deceptivly tanky vs people who don't look at your armor/magic resist and jusst your HP bars.


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realgirl

Senior Member

03-30-2011

Armor's effectiveness does dwindle as you pump it, certainly you could use HP quints in conjunction with seals/glyphs if you only wanted a limited increase in defense (well, the EHP is probably greater at level 1, but once you have a health crystal or two or three levels, I think the full 40 armor is going to be better than the flat HP). You could also use full flat armor except for seals, using dodge seals instead (since dodge is a rare stat, this works out better for the late game, especially if you're going to be stacking armor regardless).

But the thing I like about going full flat armor is the psychological impact. If someone sees you with 81 armor at level 1 - they might just back off and let you jungle/lane instead of harassing. I've had that happen a few times before. It's not quite the same with health or attack damage, or at least, I've never been cowed by a high early HP/AD count myself.

Yes Fiddlesticks/Annie/Ryze/Vlad/Karthus could take advantage of your lack of HP quints (but that's it right? Unless everyone uses MR runes and they aren't telling me) but as I'm trying to allude here - aren't you vulnerable to these things in most games? I don't try to plan ahead for them. Early game, I'm honestly more concerned with bulky champions like Renekton, Nasus, and Olaf or heavy hitting ranged carries like Ashe or even Caitlyn. Armor makes these early game threats much easier to deal with as you can approach them (tank them) without taking as nearly as much damage as you normally would, and once you're in the perfect position to take them out, they'll die instead of you. Mage enemies? Just whittle them down like normal, avoiding their spells and take them out when they're vulnerable.

Of course if everyone used flat armor most of my points would be moot, I'm just advocating that some people use it over their normal builds, since I've found it highly effective. It's honestly better than going 21 in defensive mastery - I notice 40 armor, not a 4% damage decrease.


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Mr Threepwood

Senior Member

03-30-2011

Defensive people tend to go dodge seals. Dodge seals are pretty much fail by comparison to flat armor seals in EVERY way. The only advantage is for champs who gain an effect on dodge, or if you're pointing that mastery. Dodge reduces auto attack damage, even magic damage that ends up tacked onto auto attacks, but armor reduces the physical portion even more than the dodge, and also reduces physical damage skills.

The only reason dodge could be handy on someone who doesn't get a bonus for dodging is if you just happened to dodge that ONE attack that was going to slow you and allow the enemy to keep up. Just mathematically, armor shaves off much more damage.


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Eddy01741

Senior Member

03-30-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Something Snazzy View Post
Solid points but I'd agree more if you advocated for armor quints and yellows.

Most of those points are situational. How often are you laning with a Sor or Sona? How often are you counter jungling? How often do you take serious damage from a level 1 Annie auto attack?

The other thing is, even with 60 armor at the beginning, if you only have 400 hp, your physical eHP will be 640. If you had 20 armor and bought flat HP yellows/quints (roughly 220 hp), your physical eHP would be 745. And your magical eHP would also be around 745, instead of near 480. The biggest thing about this argument? It also frees up your blue and reds.

And the armor value from reds/blues aren't very good. Yellow + quints + cloth armor = 3 more armor than full armor runes. So basically, you are saving 300 gold for the loss of 15 armor pen, 14 mr and 3 armor. That's not really worth it in my opinion, especially if you end up laning against a Nunu/Ryze combo on a low health character. *Edit* Actually, since you end up with more armor, that isn't worth it no matter who you are playing unless 300 gold is super important for rushing something.
This.

Don't use secondary or tertiary runes for the most part. Use runes that give good stat benefits for their type.


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Hotdogs

Senior Member

03-31-2011

i think its bad
but you should decide for yourself

having more armor adds to your effective health more because you heal via regen/pots as long as you have time to use them

depending on the lane you might not even get hit during laning


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