"Matchmaking"

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tumultuoustempus

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Senior Member

03-09-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by BladeofLight View Post
Eh, only thing they'd have an advantage over you is runes and masteries which both have pretty small impacts. It's not that big of a deal.
While I agree that the impact of runes and masteries does not have a tremendous impact, the level of experience, wisdom, and practice that a level 30 player (often with several hundred wins) has vs. a lower level player is EXTREMELY important. This is the problem. The masteries and runes only exacerbate it.


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Eppa

Senior Member

03-09-2011

As you level up you gain elo. Meaning that your opponents were probably worse than you but had runes to compensate.

What I see in normal games is that more wins = worse player. People with 300 wins are almost always better than people with 1000 wins.


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Sophyne

Senior Member

03-09-2011

Number of wins isn't really a reliable way to measure skill. There's too many variables that could cause a loss. At least in normal games, dunno about ranked. Leavers, feeders, bad composition compared to the other party, bad teamwork, a late game comeback that somehow wins the game for the other team even though you're winning in kills and towers. A backdooring Yi/TF/Sivir....
Far too many variables....

Basically, wins doesn't always equal skill.


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ShallowJam

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Senior Member

03-09-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by BladeofLight View Post

Basically, wins doesn't always equal skill.

no, but if you take 500 people with 500 wins and 500 people with 150 wins, and pit them against each other in 100 games. the team made up of 500 winners will win more games than the team with 150 wins each.

ON AVERAGE, more wins means a better player. obviously it doesnt always mean they are better. thats like saying "a woman should do fine against a man in a strength competition." yes, some women are stronger than some men, but on average, men are physically stronger.


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Cenerae

Senior Member

03-09-2011

Matchmaking supposedly pairs you up against people around the same Elo as you. If you're on a big winning streak then your rating is higher than usual, so you'll get paired against better players. If you're not good enough to handle that, then you start the obligatory and irritating losing streak until you get back to where you were.

With regard to summoner levels, you'll generally find that if you're being paired against lvl 30's before lvl 30, then you're either winning many games (and thus being paired against better players), or you're up against some especially poor lvl 30's. Not everyone that gets there is actually good at the game, you know. If you're up against a mostly lvl 30 team in solo queues and your team is full of lvl 20's, it means that your team is probably made up of better players.

Of course, that's only looking at your average winrate and doesn't factor in the fact that the lvl 30's may have played hundreds of games more, and therefore are more experienced. Which is where the problem with the matchmaking system kicks in.


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Best Zod NA

Senior Member

03-09-2011

Runes make a huge difference, especially when you're stacking full ArP/MrP.


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tumultuoustempus

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Senior Member

03-09-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by BladeofLight View Post
Number of wins isn't really a reliable way to measure skill. There's too many variables that could cause a loss. At least in normal games, dunno about ranked. Leavers, feeders, bad composition compared to the other party, bad teamwork, a late game comeback that somehow wins the game for the other team even though you're winning in kills and towers. A backdooring Yi/TF/Sivir....
Far too many variables....

Basically, wins doesn't always equal skill.
I agree that wins do no equal skill. More games played = more experience, though.

Wins and losses don't mean much. I'd argue that a loss is at least as valuable as a win in terms of becoming a better player.

The guy above who said the player with 1000 wins is usually worse than the one with 300 is just trolling. While I'm sure this is the case occasionally, on the average this can not be true.

Certainly there has been a time in history when someone playing their very first LoL game ever has been better than someone who is level 30. However, if you take a random sample of players, those with more games played will, on average, always be better than those with less games played. When inate skill is equal, experience wins.


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Petrouchka

Senior Member

03-09-2011

one of the big problems with matchmaking that is extremely hard to fix is that people (myself included) will tank their elo ratings by learning new champions. ten matches later they feel like playing a champ they're actually skilled with and suddenly "get better". since players are matched before champ select there isn't a way to make the elo based on individual champs.

edit: oh, and it's also true that on some champions runes can make or break them. I have a page of mana regen and magic pen runes that i use for chogath and similar champs. it let's me zone out my opponents in a 1v2 top lane unless they are a very strong laning combo.


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Cenerae

Senior Member

03-09-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by tumultuoustempus View Post
The guy above who said the player with 1000 wins is usually worse than the one with 300 is just trolling. While I'm sure this is the case occasionally, on the average this can not be true.
That's not what I said. I said that if someone has a poor rating, poor enough that they are constantly being matched with people under summoner lvl 30, then they obviously are pretty poor at the game. Someone constantly getting matched with lvl 30's at lvl 20 is obviously a fair hand at the game.

Obviously it's not going to be perfectly fair due to runes and overall number of games played for experience, but it's probably accurate to say that in terms of their actual mechanical skill, the lower levelled player is likely going to be better. That doesn't garuntee that he fully understands the technical side of things, whereas the lvl 30 with his 1000 games played is more likely to.

So really, if you're always playing against lvl 30's, the chances are that many of them will be relatively weak players. You're at an obvious disadvantage due to having less runes/masteries, but your actual skill level should be about the same. Not saying that is necessarily fair, but that's how it works.


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Ionic Breeze

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Senior Member

03-09-2011

It is a big deal when fighting against level 30 Tanks that cannot be killed! I've fought a few Mordekaiser's at level 30, 21 points into defense and tanky runes. Can't hurt him enough to do anything, eg: Ashe's ultimate dealt a measly 30 damage to him lol


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