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Release Notes v1.0.0.111

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FABIOForever

Senior Member

02-17-2011

Ryze really didn't need that change. Annie was superior early to mid but Ryze scaled better after that.

The new IP points thing is terrible. Not because I care how fast I farm IP, but because no one is going to surrender now. Everyone is going to want to draw out games to 60 minutes.

Please don't listen to the "never surrender" e-honor people. Some of us aren't in grade school anymore and have actual jobs or school to work on and like to squeeze in a game or two for fun before our lunch break is over and the real life grind begins again. We really don't want to be stuck in a hopeless game for 30 minutes longer than necessary just so Little Johnnie gets an extra 20 imaginary internet fun points.

Can you at least change the surrender minimum to 3 votes instead of 4? That's a change that's long overdue. Regardless of what you think about surrendering, if more than half the team wants to there is absolutely no reason the game should have to continue.


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Warshock

Junior Member

02-17-2011

I don't know what you guys were trying to accomplish with the IP reward system changes, but I have to say it's a little insulting for you guys to make the changes you did and then try to pass it off like you're improving it for us. This is far from an improvement. We all appreciate the IP boost that you're giving us for yesterday, but I just played another game and the IP reward is seriously pretty pitiful now. It wouldn't have bothered me so bad if you would have just said you're taking away a bunch of our IP, but to explain it like it would benefit us is pretty #$%&ed up....


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LAWLrruss

Junior Member

02-17-2011

Hi riot, i would just like to say, that this new IP change is very bad. I just played a good game for 25 minutes. only to win 71 IP points with a 2-0-3 score as fiddlesticks.

If this was prepatch i most definitely would have won over 100 IP points. I would like to make a suggestion to make it more fair and less annoying to players. If the game lasts long enough to surrender, people should be able to get a minimum IP of 100, and as for winners. Just a max of 250 without boosts.

Thanks for taking the time to read my suggestion. Hope this will be changed and or fixed in the near future.


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Mísanthropic

Member

02-17-2011

I'd have to agree with the notion from several posters on this thread that rewarding players for drawing out matches is a HUGE drawback. Most players deny surrender out of malice because it causes other players grief. I can understand that generally we want players to continue a game despite all odds, but not every player derives pleasure in losing especially if the loss is both foreseen and inevitable.

The only way I see Riot countering this issue without completely ripping their implementation out is if they were to scale this "time-based" bonus IP to the point where the rewards are minimal, and almost negligible. Either that, or change the condition from time-based to input-based.The current implementation now empowers all surrender-denying grievers, so that on top of causing grief as they've been doing, they're now also getting rewarded for it.

I vote that Riot actually reward more IP to players based on their output in-game as opposed to just "time". That way players won't just stand at the base doing nothing and get paid for it.

Reward players based on things like:

how much damage they dealt overall [turrets, champions, minions, etc.],
how little damage they recieved,
how much healing and protection they used on other players [not themselves],
how many fully-developed items they bought [including consumables],
...and so on.

That's just my two cents. Reward players that deserve it based on their positive input in the game.


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napkinator

Junior Member

02-17-2011

Dear Riot (if you read these),

First off this post is way too long so I apologize but I went into some details:

I've played a lot of Anivia games (600+) and experimented with a ton of different items and strategies as well as runes.. Recently, I switched to Morgana as a main because 75% of my Anivia games were going 10/3/15 (this is an average) and it's about time I learned new heroes so I can eventually try my hand at ranked games.. Even though she was tough to play, I had reached a point where I could use her well in just about every scenario possible..

While I admit that against some heroes she is extremely powerful, there are heroes that she is quite useless against.. Stuns or taunts on Anivia have the very same effect they do on Kassadin.. Pretty much means you die a quick death.. It's not uncommon for a full health Anivia (with egg) to get dropped 6k health in 3 seconds by an angry enemy team after she's done her burst combo and her allies have moved out of good positioning.. It's also not uncommon for Anivia to come out of her egg with 2/5ths of her health and help get a double or triple kill with allies that have maintained good positioning and team play.. Nevertheless, the old Anivia had balanced offense as well as defense.. All of her skills could be used defensively with the most important one being her ult to slow chasing enemies that wanted a free kill on no mana Anivia or 50 health carry etc..

With this most recent update, while I can see the need for a slight nerf to her dps, she also got a pretty huge nerf to survivability.. She's slow to begin with, her items are all expensive, and she's team dependent (meaning a good Anivia always gets focused hard and if the team runs away, aka noobs, when she's in egg form, it means free food for the enemy)..

She used to be able to solo lane well with her ult, now that's fairly impossible unless the jungler ALWAYS helps you with blue buff soon as you hit 6 and lets you take it.. Never gonna happen since jungler needs blue.. So as far as her functionality as a solo, it's near impossible to do it effectively against equally skilled enemies.. You can do it for a while with the help of your tower but eventually enemies are strong enough to dive you and take the turret..

Her mid utility got hurt pretty badly as well.. It's not possible anymore to get first blood at level 6 (assuming equal player skill and that first blood hasn't happened), and then immediately run off to top or bot and help allies get a couple more kills with the mana you have left before going b.. You show up and start auto attacking and people point and laugh at your petty 60 damage..

Good Anivia players started to shine around level 8 but now that's been pushed back due to mana and inability to farm well and stay in your lane at earlier levels.. Sure you could just use Q+E but landing Q is a constant guessing game against a skilled opponent.. Anivia gets kited all day and getting close enough to damage puts her in vulnerable gank territory.. When enemy rushes you to deal damage, you have two options: punish them or run.. If you run, it's not worth it.. If you punish them, with the current patch, you have to damage enough to make them think twice.. Q+E is not enough and God forbid you miss your Q due to their flash.. R used to be a good skill to use defensively when rushed to ensure that you dealt proper punishment by using your E and then landing your Q due to the slow effect.. While that same punishment ability is still there, it places you in a vulnerable position where you have no more mana to do it again.. Teemo and Twitch just have to come back at you once more and you're easy bait.. And forget about laning against a mid Morde.. It was tough before and now it's tougher..

Some suggestions I have based on the different ways I've played Anivia that I think could accomplish what you guys are aiming for while still allowing her to survive:

1. Keep the current mana costs intact for her R (maybe make it a tad cheaper) but make it so that when she has under 90 mana, her R costs the same as it previously did.. This will prevent her from taking a cheap R+E shot but also allow her to save herself and any running allies with low health.. I know the Wall accomplishes the same thing but there are times you have to use it offensively to pick off an enemy before a fight starts or to save an ally early on and it's on cooldown..

2. Keep current mana costs but reduce the cooldown on her Wall by 1-2 seconds..

3. Revert to previous mana costs but make it so that if 1 or more enemy heroes is or walks into the glacial storm an extra 75/115/155 mana is deducted.. This will at least allow for some farming ability but will also create some strategic play for enemies.. They could walk in to "hurt" your mana pool while at the same time suffering the vulnerability of your E should you have enough to use it..

4. Increase the speed and range to her Q to a bit less than the speed and range of Morgana's so that kiters can't dodge it every single time making you useless due to the inability to use R..

5. Increase the range of E a little and lower the cooldown by .5 to make it a little more worth using it without the chill effect. Or better yet keep it the same but increase its regular damage output and decrease its chill effect damage output (aka not double damage)..

6. Her Break Even points on R mana are as follows:
New - 380 mana used after 7 sec
Old - 375 mana used after 7 sec

New - 450 mana used after 6 sec
Old - 455 mana used after 6 sec

New - 500 mana used after 5 sec
Old - 495 mana used after 5 sec

Reduce them to 5,4,3 or to 4,3,2 ratios so that she's not such a mana hog.. She's already one if not the most mana intensive hero in the game (I guess Kass beats her).. With no mana, you have to head back or use clarity which is a waste of a spell slot.. Her auto attack is not the best farming tool (my record Anivia farming by 11 mins was 74 minions) and she really needs either kills or gold early to build RoA for survivability.. Without RoA by 14-16 minutes she's gonna suffer and she needs boots too once towers start going down..

Apologies for the long read, just my thoughts.. Hope something in here is useful

P.S. - I played a couple games after patch and pre server reboot but didn't get any reward like the "unavailable" server status message posted by udyr had stated.. Was I just on at the wrong time and didn't get it?


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JailBait4Life

Junior Member

02-17-2011

I dont actually like getting 81IP


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Caziban

Senior Member

02-17-2011

Quote:
napkinator:
Dear Riot (if you read these),

First off this post is way too long so I apologize but I went into some details:


I completely agree with you. The old Anivia was completely balanced.

I've played over 300 games with Anivia and I honestly thought, "Eh, whatever, this patch shouldn't hurt the bird TOO hard."

Oh man was I wrong. I find myself out of mana CONSTANTLY with the only solution to constantly grab Blue Buff, but at the same time, I can't do that or else I'll screw my jungler over. Am I just to assume that Anivia doesn't work well with a jungling team? If that's the case, then Anivia belongs on no decent team as a jungler is a must in this meta-game. In any case, Egg form doesn't even matter anymore. I die at such an incredible rate in egg form that it's quite unbelievable. I've never felt so useless before, especially how champions can just prance out of my Ult.

Really Riot? What the hell is up with the nerfs on things by over 50%?
A 2.5 second slow to a 1 second slow? Can't you just increment it by .5 decrease inbetween patches? It's so discouraging to even play a champion that's hit that hard.

As if it wasn't bad enough that Anivia has manna problems and pricey items to be useful, but now, I can't even burn all of my mana for an ENTIRE fight. My mana usually lasts HALF the teamfight, or less. Then, perhaps I should get a Phantom Dancer to fix this problem, right? 60 attack damage for the win? In either case, I tried to go for more mana, but then I realized how little damage I do.

Either way, I feel useless now.

I understand you'd like us to move on to new champions, but god**** it, this isn't the way you should do it.

Anivia wasn't overpowered, nor did I find that many users (If any) complaining about her recently.


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Stillborn Joy

Member

02-17-2011

Quote:
napkinator:
Dear Riot (if you read these),

First off this post is way too long so I apologize but I went into some details:

I've played a lot of Anivia games (600+) and experimented with a ton of different items and strategies as well as runes.. Recently, I switched to Morgana as a main because 75% of my Anivia games were going 10/3/15 (this is an average) and it's about time I learned new heroes so I can eventually try my hand at ranked games.. Even though she was tough to play, I had reached a point where I could use her well in just about every scenario possible..

While I admit that against some heroes she is extremely powerful, there are heroes that she is quite useless against.. Stuns or taunts on Anivia have the very same effect they do on Kassadin.. Pretty much means you die a quick death.. It's not uncommon for a full health Anivia (with egg) to get dropped 6k health in 3 seconds by an angry enemy team after she's done her burst combo and her allies have moved out of good positioning.. It's also not uncommon for Anivia to come out of her egg with 2/5ths of her health and help get a double or triple kill with allies that have maintained good positioning and team play.. Nevertheless, the old Anivia had balanced offense as well as defense.. All of her skills could be used defensively with the most important one being her ult to slow chasing enemies that wanted a free kill on no mana Anivia or 50 health carry etc..

With this most recent update, while I can see the need for a slight nerf to her dps, she also got a pretty huge nerf to survivability.. She's slow to begin with, her items are all expensive, and she's team dependent (meaning a good Anivia always gets focused hard and if the team runs away, aka noobs, when she's in egg form, it means free food for the enemy)..

She used to be able to solo lane well with her ult, now that's fairly impossible unless the jungler ALWAYS helps you with blue buff soon as you hit 6 and lets you take it.. Never gonna happen since jungler needs blue.. So as far as her functionality as a solo, it's near impossible to do it effectively against equally skilled enemies.. You can do it for a while with the help of your tower but eventually enemies are strong enough to dive you and take the turret..

Her mid utility got hurt pretty badly as well.. It's not possible anymore to get first blood at level 6 (assuming equal player skill and that first blood hasn't happened), and then immediately run off to top or bot and help allies get a couple more kills with the mana you have left before going b.. You show up and start auto attacking and people point and laugh at your petty 60 damage..

Good Anivia players started to shine around level 8 but now that's been pushed back due to mana and inability to farm well and stay in your lane at earlier levels.. Sure you could just use Q+E but landing Q is a constant guessing game against a skilled opponent.. Anivia gets kited all day and getting close enough to damage puts her in vulnerable gank territory.. When enemy rushes you to deal damage, you have two options: punish them or run.. If you run, it's not worth it.. If you punish them, with the current patch, you have to damage enough to make them think twice.. Q+E is not enough and God forbid you miss your Q due to their flash.. R used to be a good skill to use defensively when rushed to ensure that you dealt proper punishment by using your E and then landing your Q due to the slow effect.. While that same punishment ability is still there, it places you in a vulnerable position where you have no more mana to do it again.. Teemo and Twitch just have to come back at you once more and you're easy bait.. And forget about laning against a mid Morde.. It was tough before and now it's tougher..

Some suggestions I have based on the different ways I've played Anivia that I think could accomplish what you guys are aiming for while still allowing her to survive:

1. Keep the current mana costs intact for her R (maybe make it a tad cheaper) but make it so that when she has under 90 mana, her R costs the same as it previously did.. This will prevent her from taking a cheap R+E shot but also allow her to save herself and any running allies with low health.. I know the Wall accomplishes the same thing but there are times you have to use it offensively to pick off an enemy before a fight starts or to save an ally early on and it's on cooldown..

2. Keep current mana costs but reduce the cooldown on her Wall by 1-2 seconds..

3. Revert to previous mana costs but make it so that if 1 or more enemy heroes is or walks into the glacial storm an extra 75/115/155 mana is deducted.. This will at least allow for some farming ability but will also create some strategic play for enemies.. They could walk in to "hurt" your mana pool while at the same time suffering the vulnerability of your E should you have enough to use it..

4. Increase the speed and range to her Q to a bit less than the speed and range of Morgana's so that kiters can't dodge it every single time making you useless due to the inability to use R..

5. Increase the range of E a little and lower the cooldown by .5 to make it a little more worth using it without the chill effect. Or better yet keep it the same but increase its regular damage output and decrease its chill effect damage output (aka not double damage)..

6. Her Break Even points on R mana are as follows:
New - 380 mana used after 7 sec
Old - 375 mana used after 7 sec

New - 450 mana used after 6 sec
Old - 455 mana used after 6 sec

New - 500 mana used after 5 sec
Old - 495 mana used after 5 sec

Reduce them to 5,4,3 or to 4,3,2 ratios so that she's not such a mana hog.. She's already one if not the most mana intensive hero in the game (I guess Kass beats her).. With no mana, you have to head back or use clarity which is a waste of a spell slot.. Her auto attack is not the best farming tool (my record Anivia farming by 11 mins was 74 minions) and she really needs either kills or gold early to build RoA for survivability.. Without RoA by 14-16 minutes she's gonna suffer and she needs boots too once towers start going down..

Apologies for the long read, just my thoughts.. Hope something in here is useful

P.S. - I played a couple games after patch and pre server reboot but didn't get any reward like the "unavailable" server status message posted by udyr had stated.. Was I just on at the wrong time and didn't get it?


Please don't take this the wrong way but you're ******ed. Anivia is the best pick in the game. She def does not need this sort of buff.


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Caziban

Senior Member

02-17-2011

Quote:
Demonicous:
OMGSTFU...... Aniva is one of the big pain in the arse champs to face against.... if you play Aniva the way Phreak plays her you wont have any issues.... in fact you can carry the entire game..... youtube Aniva played by Phreak

Her ulti is so powerful it pains me when i see it. one of the best ultimates for team fights by far. I have seen phreak play Aniva. Here is my sudgestion based on his playstyle. Catalyst the Protector is an amazing item to level up the game with plus it builds into 2 very usefull items. Banshee's Veil for facing those naughty CC + Bursty DPS champs. Rod of Ages for the games where you are consistantly out there in the field not recalling back.

The other item..... an early Tear of the Goddess that builds into Archangel's Staff later on is very helpfull if you want to talk about MANA ISSUES.

Sigh....... go Q.Q more it wont change the fact that Aniva is still going to be a high priority target for smart teams. You paint the target on yourself by picking her. Just like Ashe. The most feared champs usually have the highest death toll in the end.



I think it's ignorant users like you that fail to realize:


The community should not revolve/model/idol the playstyles of Professional players.

YOU SUCK AT HALO 3?

OMFG, JUST LEARN HOW TO PLAY LIKE FINAL BOSS OYU FKING NOOB THEN MAYBE OYU'LL WIN EVERY GAME. Q TO THE FREAKING Q.


Please. Get on the level of the normal player. Your head is in the clouds.


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Kieldor

Recruiter

02-17-2011

I think that supress should stop tryndamere's ult. Serious, it was the only option to do so.