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So I found out why I was banned for 12 days.

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Ulanopo

Recruiter

10-04-2014

Quote:
shadowmark2013:
I am certain that crosses an individuals mind when they're chastising the accused.


Don't you think it's a little presumptuous to ascribe such awful motives to people you don't even know?


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shadowmark2013

Recruiter

10-04-2014

Quote:
Ulanopo:
Funny, I read that as "shadowmark2013 is going to dismiss facts that he doesn't understand."



Yes, Riot makes a lot of money. Isn't that an argument in favor of their corporate philosophies? I mean, they must be doing something right.


No, not necessarily; because those philosophies seemed to have take a turn recently, and I still stand by my previous statement, that free-to-play games with certain premium features turn a much larger annual profit than the average game that would have you pay an initial fee to have access to it.


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shadowmark2013

Recruiter

10-04-2014

Quote:
Ulanopo:
Don't you think it's a little presumptuous to ascribe such awful motives to people you don't even know?



Do you have some sort of philosophy, where everyone and enyone in existance is always out to help one another; and to make each other feel as though they were walking on sunshine and rainbows? This isn't the world we live in pal, sorry for the rude awakening.


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Shelzin

Senior Member

10-04-2014

Quote:
shadowmark2013:
Do you have some sort of philosophy, where everyone and enyone in existance is always out to help one another; and to make each other feel as though they were walking on sunshine and rainbows? This isn't the world we live in pal, sorry for the rude awakening.

I agree with what you are saying. Unfortunately that isn't what he was saying either. So it really doesn't mean anything.

And for the record... I'm on the side I'm always on... MINE. More often than not I agree with Riot policies and all the decisions they make. But I'm more than happy to let Riot know where I disagree with them in the same fashion as I would anyone else here.

Example: I disagree with the format on the new boards. My displeasure is known, and I will not be moving over to the new boards. They think that's worth it for the new boards... I don't blame them at all for thinking that. But it is what it is.


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Ulanopo

Recruiter

10-04-2014

Quote:
shadowmark2013:
No, not necessarily; because those philosophies seemed to have take a turn recently


How so? My experience is that Riot's values have been highly consistent over the last four years.

Quote:
I still stand by my previous statement, that free-to-play games with certain premium features turn a much larger annual profit than the average game that would have you pay an initial fee to have access to it.


That may be true, but it doesn't address my question. You claimed that Riot had grown "too large to care." Both Jubbinaut and I pointed out that Riot's position in the F2P market is largely unique. Having such a low buy-in rate necessitates maintaining a massive player base, which in turn shapes their policies.


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Only Katarina NA

Recruiter

10-04-2014

This is why we have the mute button, for toxic people on either side of the team, this is why I use it, I can't respond to something I don't see.


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Ulanopo

Recruiter

10-04-2014

Quote:
shadowmark2013:
Do you have some sort of philosophy, where everyone and enyone in existance is always out to help one another; and to make each other feel as though they were walking on sunshine and rainbows? This isn't the world we live in pal, sorry for the rude awakening.


No, but I don't feel like I live in some burnt-out dystopia, either. I make it a policy to not accuse people of the worst without good cause.


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shadowmark2013

Recruiter

10-04-2014

Quote:
Ulanopo:
Again, I didn't downvote you.



How dare we use a logical and reasonable basis for argument? Yes, League is Riot's IP, but they can't just trash the property for no good reason. They moderate the community because they believe it's best for their bottom line.



This is a ridiculous and insulting way to portray us. No one is saying that you're trash. We're saying we disagree with your philosophy. Have you considered that you might receive fewer downvotes if you could manage to be less rude?



I do empathize with the frustration that people feel when they are suspended. That doesn't mean that I feel that the punishment was unwarranted.



Yes, it such an awful thing for me to largely agree with Riot's policies. The shame! Let me ask you this, if it's okay for you to effectively label us "fanbois" is it okay for me to label you "a rebel without a clue"?



I think you mean ethics, but that's an easy mistake to make. "Morals" are personal rules of conduct while "social mores" are synonymous with "ethics", which refer to the rules of a society or community. So, yes, I believe that Riot has the right to set the rules on their property. If people don't like those rules, they can always go elsewhere. I hear Call of Duty has an open and friendly community.



A "conglomerate" is an aggregation of companies. I believe you mean monopolies or near-monopolies.



Well, that's a silly assertion to make. Not only do you lack source material, but none of those companies were directly responsible for managing a large online gaming community. You would be better off comparing Riot to Valve or Blizzard.

Even if you do, however, you can't make the argument that there is some industry standard that Riot is violating. The truth is, Riot is doing cutting-edge research in the psychology of community management. No one else is publishing (and inspiring)



This segment reveals your ignorance. Riot has one of the lowest pay-for rates among F2P games. It's only about 3% of the player base. They get some of their income from elsewhere, but they rely on being as popular as possible.



I can't even...



I guess Forbes doesn't know what they're talking about (http://www.forbes.com/sites/insertcoin/2014/01/27/riots-league-of-legends-reveals-astonishing-27-million-daily-players-67-million-monthly/).



*sigh* This is going to be another long... long night.

To your first response:
You don't get it, that argument is so exhausted, and overused; it's almost the typical copy/paste "I win", argument; which has been used on so many occasions, I'd say it pretty much invalidates your argument almost INSTANTLY, also, my message was; that Riot wouldn't have any property of significant value if it wasn't for the consumer, and if their ENTIRE consumer base was considered "toxic", they would either be forced to deal with it and continue to collect profits, sell their company to someone who doesn't necessarily care as much as they do, or just end all of their services as is; but I don't know anyone who wouldn't turn down a large some of money, so it's most likely NOT going to be the latter.


To your second response:
Insulting way to portray you? It is how you are perceived my dear friend, to a few people; maybe not many, but certainly a few, I am here to advocate for those persons who weren't very well-equipped or prepard enough to meet the specifications required to deal with an individual such as yourself.

To your third response:

If you were capable of empathizing with anyone, you'd understand the pretence at which my comments have been laid, and my little sympathy for major corporations who collect large sums of money over a short period of time, but usually have nothing to show for it.

To your fourth response:

Not awful to agree with Riot's policies, but social ethics and morality in most cases go hand in-hand, they are both very similar and there is little-to-no variation between the two, nearly indiscriminate; such attention to detail isn't exactly necessary, and the majority of persons will not have the same social ethics/standards as you do, and people such as yourself, whoa re in the minority; are the primary reason why Riot abides by such broad and strict policies, to avoid PERSISTENT harsssment from the few that their "Oh so fragile ego", was damaged severely by a group of adolescents.(Whoever makes the most noise often represents their group, which is why ideologies such as Atheism, Feminism, and other secular based denominations have such a bad rep amongst the religious community, you are the minority that "Makes the noise&quot (yes I know this is from later in your response)

Hmm, an aggregation of companies... where have I seen an example of that before... Dell, HP, Toshiba, Gateway, all companies bought by Microsoft, and Google having acquired a few seperate companies through mergers as well, and with Apple being a similar story, they are the text-book definitions of conglomerates. All companies of similar financial status react and deal with situations

To your fifth response:

I should require you to do the math yourself, I was using the information provided by Jubbinaut, in order to calculate Riot's annual income, claiming that 3.5% of the player-base actually pays for premium services, times the average daily active players(27 mill), times my idea of what the average player would spend annually, 50-150$ per month, per player, clearly you aren't a "math person", if you couldn't figure this out on your own.


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shadowmark2013

Recruiter

10-04-2014

I am done here for the night, this is my perspective, and I am certain there is little to nothing you could say as a person to change it.


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shadowmark2013

Recruiter

10-04-2014

Quote:
Ulanopo:
How so? My experience is that Riot's values have been highly consistent over the last four years.



That may be true, but it doesn't address my question. You claimed that Riot had grown "too large to care." Both Jubbinaut and I pointed out that Riot's position in the F2P market is largely unique. Having such a low buy-in rate necessitates maintaining a massive player base, which in turn shapes their policies.



(One last comment)


About ninety-five-million a month, in-terms of income; is no small feat, I'd say that's more than enough to maintain Riot, maybe have several million left to spare after all expenses had been paid, sever maintainence, employee salaries (Assuming they are in the 100-300k bracket range), maintainence of facilities, utilities, and maybe a few other odds and ends as well.