Guinsoo is working on Fiora

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AntiSkillshot

Senior Member

04-06-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by Silver Grimalkin View Post
The OHKO moves have a locked 30% accuracy and outright fail on targets of a higher level. Furthermore, OHKO moves affect your ability to interact in league far more than they do in the standard pokemon competitive environment. OHKO in league means you're done until your death timer is over, a OHKO in pokemon means you're a sixth of the way to being done. They're incomparable.
Thus, why I said it can work in Pokemon's PvP environment. Because how they work and how they're handled.

I'm not making an argument for, or against OHKO moves. I'm just saying they can work in certain PvP environments.
The closest thing League has to a OHKO, is probably percentage attacks. That and Cho's and Darius' ults.


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AR Manimal

Senior Member

04-06-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by Guinsoo View Post
Hi guys. I'd just like to weigh in on what some of the Fiora goals are. The main problems we see with Fiora's current kit are that thematically, she doesn't deliver on the fantasy of being a skilled duelist/fencer, and mechanically, her game presence / play pattern / role doesn't line up with being a skilled duelist/fencer.

As far as the duelist fantasy goes, at least when I think of Fiora, I expect her to be extremely mobile but not just going in, she needs to be good at dancing in, out of, around and about combat. She should be about finding weaknesses in the opponent's play and finding the proper occasion to go on the attack. She shouldn't be about running in and bursting enemies down, she should be dealing high, steady DPS over time that is relatively target agnostic.

Mechanically speaking, I'd expect a duelist type champion to be mechanically intense. I expect opportunities to use my abilities at optimal times to counter out the enemy's champion. I want to have a lot to keep track of, but with clear success cases when I do well.

At the end of the day, live Fiora is a ball of stats with some untargetability thrown in; she pushes her buttons pretty much as fast as she can without a second thought, and she's also extremely snowballey. In short, she's bland with no cool opportunities to exchange gameplay between her and her lane opponent.

Some of the current goals including switching Fiora from an assassin to a melee DPS, and moving her lane from top to mid/jungle, and adding tons of 'outplay' functionality on her kit, as well as more mobility especially in terms of being able to disengage and re-engage at optimal times.

I can't share too much of exactly what the plans are for her kit, as I'm sure it's going to change tons during development, but I'll leave this here to hopefully stir up some excitement for our favorite rapier wielder. Also bear in mind this is an early, experimental Blade Waltz, and could certainly change drastically between now and remake launch time.

I also understand it's hard to understand exactly what this sample Blade Waltz does, given the lack of context on her basic spells... but rest assured, there are significant tweaks (or more) to all 4 of the other abilities, so hopefully your imaginations run wild
Omg dude, I THOUGHT YOU WERE DEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!!!!!

Nice to see you again.


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Numot

Senior Member

04-06-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by Guinsoo View Post
People don't like change. It's in our nature; if we like something we don't want it to change. But that doesn't mean it's not for the better. I'm confident we can deliver a new Fiora kit that delivers most of the same mechanics that the old one has (including the important ones like the Blade Waltz experience) but creates new gameplay and makes her actually feel like a duelist.

I prefer to focus my responses toward posts that are more constructive.

Guinsoo, lets face it Riot does not have the best track record when it comes to reworks. Seems like a lot of them end with you guys saying after the rework "we still have plans for (insert champion here) that will bring back some of what people loved about (insert champion here).


And Honestly Guinsoo, this should have stayed quiet until there was a kit you could fully show us and prove that the Fiora rework was going to be done right and not end up like others where you have to start undoing things because you went to far. Its not that we are against change, we are just against it feeling like our beloved Fiora is turning into a whole new champ. You removing things that people love about her and that made her unique. Atleast that is what it looks like from that new Ult you showed. Probably should have keep that quiet and let us think she was getting the work to her passive and W people have wanted since she came out.


P.S, whether you like it or not she is still going to be top lane, to me Duelist means 1 vs 1, those lanes are top and mid and her current kit does both, so if you are truly not killing what her current players love about her she still needs to be able to do both.


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BlackAndSilver

Senior Member

04-06-2014

Fiora obviously needs to be top or mid. Jungle Fiora is so stupid thematically, which appears to be the ONLY reason they're changing her, for her theme.

Not that jungle Fiora doesn't work, it does, I just wish it didn't.

And again first someone compared the end of Fiora now to life ending, then someone compared it to the end of LoL completely. Really guys? I see no reason in playing her now that I know her current kit is a lie and will be gone in a few months. A few months is NO way comparable to years until I die or years until this game finally ends.

I'd rather not put on my nostalgia glasses early. You guys wanna scrap her entirely, screw it, now she's nonexistent.


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TenSlashTen

Senior Member

04-06-2014

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Originally Posted by Legal Loli View Post
I thought this was about the item.
lol


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Drakonitus

Senior Member

04-06-2014

WoW Guinsoo you are a legend in LoL.

Good luck with Fiora, maybe you can make she become a tier 1 champion o/


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Super Explosion

Senior Member

04-06-2014

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Originally Posted by BlackAndSilver View Post
Fiora obviously needs to be top or mid.
Thing is League in general needs to be more open in lanes. Like why can't Fiora be top or bottom or mid however she likes? Why is she almost guaranteed to be completely wrecked by a bruiser or marksman lane? That's just not fun gameplay, it's a pointless restrictiveness from poor balance.

There could be so many more strategies and playing for how players like to play if the lanes were opened up a bit!

And jungle, it's sort of a job now, a profession, rather than just something you can do. It's silly. You have "junglers", some of whom can't step in any lane or they'll die, and some who steal enemy creeps and pat themselves on the back for winning without much contest.

In Dota, jungling is something people can do, usually between the primary objective of killing enemy players. It's not like some career where you keep a golem and lizard accounting spreadsheet and try to embezzle enemy golems and lizards.


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BlackAndSilver

Senior Member

04-06-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by Super Explosion View Post
Thing is League in general needs to be more open in lanes. Like why can't Fiora be top or bottom or mid however she likes? Why is she almost guaranteed to be completely wrecked by a bruiser or marksman lane? That's just not fun gameplay, it's a pointless restrictiveness from poor balance.

There could be so many more strategies and playing for how players like to play if the lanes were opened up a bit!

And jungle, it's sort of a job now, a profession, rather than just something you can do. It's silly. You have "junglers", some of whom can't step in any lane or they'll die, and some who just steal enemy creeps and pat themselves on the back for winning without much contest.

In Dota, jungling is something people can do, usually between the primary objective of killing enemy players. It's not like some career where you keep a golem and lizard accounting spreadsheet and try to embezzle enemy golems and lizards.
I was saying top or mid based on the fact that those are 1v1 lanes and clearly she was designed for the entire theme of 1v1.

Let's not forget that Fiora's sole purpose is to counter marksmen, she straight up destroys any single one of them 1v1. Adc Fiora bot is surprisingly good and fun but good luck getting that accepted in this current meta dominated game.


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Super Explosion

Senior Member

04-06-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackAndSilver View Post
those are 1v1 lanes
No that's the problem. They're not 1v1 lanes, they're just lanes, nowhere in the game rules does it state you have to send exactly one champion to this one lane or you'll lose.

That just happens because the game is imbalanced, especially in the melee department-- Tanky DPS has perhaps been universally better than stuff like Fiora.

And then they counter that by powercreeping marksmen to deal with tanky dps and tanky dps to deal with marksmen and then someone says "but what about assassins" so they powercreep Kha'Zix alllll over without really solving the main issues caused by having one carry type in one laning arrangement.

I mean, I suppose they'd have to realize how high tower damage shuts down melee aggression and low tower health locks people in lane.

And that whole "we don't have sustain in this game, so you get to enjoy those ranged autoattacks and they're going to STICK".

But maybe one day you know~


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The King K Rool

Senior Member

04-06-2014

He is going to ruin Fiora.

She is going to be destroyed and wrecked in team fights. She is not going to have a way out like Yi, or Yasuo.

Fiora needs SOME teamfight potential and all this is doing is single target ONLY. Fiora was mainly single target with an ult that did teamfight damage.

Now she has nothing. She will be terrible in teamfights now, and this rework is un-needed.

JUST REWORK HER PASSIVE AND FIX HER W.

That it.

That's all she needs.

FIX HER PASSIVE.

Fix HER W.

And if not, If this rework goes through its a change of the champion I bought, and should be refunded the Rp and EVERY SKIN (I have them all for fiora) should also be refunded.

You are making Fiora a terrible new champ.

If this moron is trying to change an already amazing (enough) champion, Riot should compensate for the people who payed to play the real Fiora.