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Guinsoo is working on Fiora

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NullDragon

Senior Member

04-05-2014

A few suggestions, having played Fiora quite a bit(mid fiora secret OP)

First off, I'd like it if she could stay mid, although being able to survive top as well would be nice.

Second: Playing Yasou, her Riposte and the idea behind it seems to be similar to Yasou's windwall. Specifically, being able to slice projectiles(and ranged attacks) out of the air with the instant cast windwall. I would LOVE if Riposte became something like that, even if it only worked against one ability and was supershort duration. If you eventually rework the current riposte in testing(which sounds similar to that).

Playing against Fiora: Not being able to escape from her is one of her primary frustrations, especially with the triple dash + untargetability(counting her ult as a dash). It would be nice for any lunges or dashes she has to have counterplay to escape. Something like a cooldown reduction on hitting an enemy. Same for disengages: Maybe something like having a buff for 5-10 seconds to lower the disengage cooldown if you damage an enemy champion with an attack or ability?

The fun of Blade Waltz right now isn't the untargetability, it's mainly the zooming around and stabbing people with swords in a nice rhythm. E is... not important to her concept, I think. It's just a stat ball, only helps a little with disengages.


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YourSpaceDad

Recruiter

04-05-2014

Sooo happy! I have always loved Fiora. Unfortunately she is easily bullied out of the game and then she becomes a burden. I will be so excited when she is a champ that people don't groan at in champ select again.


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Lexi BeIIe

Senior Member

04-05-2014

why is every assassin getting reworked into bruiser????????????


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SaltyTeemo4Life

Senior Member

04-05-2014

Imagine what would happen if CertainlyT and Guinsoo had a baby :O


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LiveYiOrDieHard

Senior Member

04-05-2014

Quote:
Fizz Senpai:
why is every assassin getting reworked into bruiser????????????


Seriously THIS


Look at the ****ing proposed changes Guinsoo is talking about people

Adding an escape to her?
An ult that gives her unreal mobility?

And you people think she's going to be a grand duelist? She CAN'T be a duelist if she ALSO gets escapes and this mobility. It would be straight up OP. She can't be a high DPS champion either, again, if a high DPS build is viable on someone with that kind of mobility AND safety it's simply going to be OP. She's going to end up as another tanky bruiser that acts as a meat shield with some damage.

Why the **** would you rework Fiora when she's in a good spot right now. HELL. URGOT AND SION EXIST, IF YOU HADN'T FORGOTTEN RIOT. WHY ARE YOU REWORKING FIORA!?


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Wings of Divine

Member

04-05-2014

Quote:
Guinsoo:
Hi guys. I'd just like to weigh in on what some of the Fiora goals are. The main problems we see with Fiora's current kit are that thematically, she doesn't deliver on the fantasy of being a skilled duelist/fencer, and mechanically, her game presence / play pattern / role doesn't line up with being a skilled duelist/fencer.

As far as the duelist fantasy goes, at least when I think of Fiora, I expect her to be extremely mobile but not just going in, she needs to be good at dancing in, out of, around and about combat. She should be about finding weaknesses in the opponent's play and finding the proper occasion to go on the attack. She shouldn't be about running in and bursting enemies down, she should be dealing high, steady DPS over time that is relatively target agnostic.

Mechanically speaking, I'd expect a duelist type champion to be mechanically intense. I expect opportunities to use my abilities at optimal times to counter out the enemy's champion. I want to have a lot to keep track of, but with clear success cases when I do well.

At the end of the day, live Fiora is a ball of stats with some untargetability thrown in; she pushes her buttons pretty much as fast as she can without a second thought, and she's also extremely snowballey. In short, she's bland with no cool opportunities to exchange gameplay between her and her lane opponent.

Some of the current goals including switching Fiora from an assassin to a melee DPS, and moving her lane from top to mid/jungle, and adding tons of 'outplay' functionality on her kit, as well as more mobility especially in terms of being able to disengage and re-engage at optimal times.

I can't share too much of exactly what the plans are for her kit, as I'm sure it's going to change tons during development, but I'll leave this here to hopefully stir up some excitement for our favorite rapier wielder. Also bear in mind this is an early, experimental Blade Waltz, and could certainly change drastically between now and remake launch time.

I also understand it's hard to understand exactly what this sample Blade Waltz does, given the lack of context on her basic spells... but rest assured, there are significant tweaks (or more) to all 4 of the other abilities, so hopefully your imaginations run wild




OMG DEAR GUINSOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
LOL nice to see you around ,can you give us some info about tf rework?


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Bacon

Junior Member

04-05-2014

Guinsoo, your champs aren't necessarily the most mechanically complex. But they definitely have unique mechanics. I do prefer more complex champs. But I still respect simple ones with clearly defined abilities. More is not always better. Rather than put in a cumbersome information load of scalings and interactions, you focus more on making intuitive abilities and thematically accurate kits. And I think you do that better than anyone else. So I'm interested to see where you take Fiora. From the sound of it you're really focused on making her kit reflect a true duelist and I really like that. But I'm interested in knowing what your plans are in terms of complexity. Because literally every champion you designed was over 3 years ago. So I'd like to know, has your approach to designing champs changed significantly? Does Riot have new "standards" that require you to change your process?


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lojician

Senior Member

04-05-2014

Quote:
Guinsoo:
and moving her lane from top to mid/jungle


Ahhh, see, I was wondering what you were doing differently this time to make her not suck or be declared to have 'no counterplay' then get nerfed until she sucks since riot has a history of being blatantly incompetent at balancing top lane melees.

But I see you've found the solution! Remove all the melee champions from top lane!


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Critmaster Garen

Senior Member

04-05-2014

Quote:
Fizz Senpai:
why is every assassin getting reworked into bruiser????????????


what are you talking about?

he said reworked with more emphasis on being a "light fighter" aka melee carry. because thats what she was supposed to be originally. the problem is, that it didnt really work out and she turned out to play more like an assassin without escape.


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LiveYiOrDieHard

Senior Member

04-05-2014

Quote:
Critmaster Garen:
what are you talking about?

he said reworked with more emphasis on being a "light fighter" aka melee carry. because thats what she was supposed to be originally. the problem is, that it didnt really work out and she turned out to play more like an assassin without escape.


She plays like an assassin/carry hybrid. And she's in a good spot. I don't understand why we have to remove her unique playstyle just because most league players don't understand it and decide to follow the "fiora sucks" bandwagon like sheep. There's 115 other champions. WHY do we have to ruin Fiora!?