Rengar Thread of Bolas and Roaring

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Byebyemeowgg

Senior Member

04-04-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by RadiantWings View Post
Rengar has already been changed. He can be number tweaked yes, but unless you start reworking him *again* you're not going to solve some of his glaring thematic problems.


1)Battle Roar
Yes it's better for teamfights. Yes it makes Rengar more viable as a bruiser. It's completely wrong for a hunter who's meant to single out targets to kill to have to jump into the middle of an enemy team screaming like a banshee in order to get the most out of this.

2)That feeling of being stalked... or not.
Rengar gives a 1000 radius warning (Evelynn's passive is better) and 7 seconds is NOT enough to play mind games. That 7 seconds says to me that Rengar is being balanced around Bonetooth Necklace, that those bonuses should be read as "at 12 and 20 kills, Rengar's ultimate has been unnerfed by this much!"


I'm going to refer to Rengar's assassin and tank styles as "Hunter" and "Pride leader" respectively to explain what I want from him as a character.

A) Battle Roar should be a % damage reduction on targets hit that is reduced for each enemy it hits (to a minimum).

B) Empowered Battle Roar should grant 12(+1/lvl) armor and magic resistance (maxes out at current value) with the 50% bonus. It would not grant the damage reduction.

Hunter Rengar jumps on a target and causes them to wet their pants, destroying their retaliation ability. Pride leader Rengar with Empowered Battle Roar leads his team into the fray with unmatched bravado while demoralizing the enemy.


For Thrill of the Hunt...

C) All speed bonuses only apply while moving towards the enemy, and the stealth is 12 seconds baseline

D) The ! mark is a global warning that occurs when Rengar has moved within a certain distance of any enemy champion and turns red when he gets dangerously close to any one person.

E) If Rengar "tags" an opponent while stealthed by moving next to them, he marks them for a set time and can trigger Unseen Predator as much as he wants on that target while the mark lasts.



Basically, I want Thrill of the Hunt to be a sort of Cat and Mouse guessing game, applying intense psychological pressure. Hunter Rengar creeps up to his target while Pride leader Rengar scares them all off. If an enemy gets tagged for death, well, they had plenty of warning and had it coming. It gives a great deal of decision making as Rengar can choose whether he needs that jump now, or whether he wants to chase a Kassadin to the ends of the earth. The red mark also gives away his intent, meaning that opponents know that he's close to someone and looking for a sure kill (or he could just be messing with them.) It also means that Rengar can't run away with it as well, allowing Q to be unnerfed.
lol this would be fun


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Groxxy

Senior Member

04-04-2014

This is a random clutter of thoughts, I'll try to keep it organized.
It's disappointing because it seems like if you nab a few kills it really doesn't do anything for you if you build damage and you're forced to build tank.It just doesn't feel good. I'd also like to reiterate what was said earlier regarding pushing, not being able to Q towers, and nerfing the damage and attackspeed bonus feel like's it's just too much. I really feel like letting him attack towers with his new Q is viable. Also, cutting down the Q swing time will make him alot funner as the stabby mcstab cat that was mentioned much more when Scarizard was still working on the kit. I'm not sure if it does this on live but his E should reveal the target imo. This'll will give him cool outplay potential in the jungle with jumping from bush to a bola'd minion camp. (I mean come on, the jungle is supposed to be his home right?) Also his early game ult feels ridiculously punishing if you don't do anything with it, I felt like the cooldown was a bit too long early game. Hopefully some of this helps.


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Exodasius

Junior Member

04-04-2014

-How are the changes playing for you?
I made a post about this, but frankly I find the changes to be awful. Rengar has gone from being a fun champion whom is a pain to scale early on to becoming squashed by nearly every champion as opposed to just champions with stun and fast movement (e.g. Teemo)

-What builds are you using?
I've always built a lifesteal/attack speed+damage build that focuses on Frozen Mallet, Trinity Force, Blade of the Ruined King, and Hydra.

-What lanes are you playing him in?
Normally bottom, but middle isn't rare either

-Finding any bugs?
Not bugs parsay, but the fact that I can't use two Qs' in a rapid succession is upsetting me to no end. Three Qs' was definitely OP back when it was around, but two was a perfect balance. It forced us to choose between using the ferocity charge on a bola, or a chance to quickly get a kill.

As well, the new bola is awful since minions are the only thing getting caught in it. Any smart champion would now just hide behind two minions and attack from there to make Rengar's bola useless, and to force him to run around minions.

Please, get rid of this update to Rengar!


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Mundo

Senior Member

04-04-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by Riot Jag View Post
Since this version of Q doesn't give you AS it does feel a little slower at first, but we made some small changes to the spell to ensure it feels good. There may be an adjustment period but if it still feels clunky we'll keep an eye on it.
Make Q reset on minion or champion kill.


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CaptainWinget

Junior Member

04-04-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mundo View Post
Make Q reset on minion or champion kill.
Just give me the old Q and E back. You want my stealth fine take it, give my ult super speed and a gap closer. It's a nerfed Rengar, but at least its playable again...


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TrulyBasedGod

Junior Member

04-04-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nureya View Post
YOUR WRONG HERE. You can use that global ultimate also to apply fear/ pressure to lanes. similar to when nocturne,shen, TF, pantheon when they turn 6. Follow up the ultimate acitivation with 150% mobility boost for rengar to compensate for such activation.

And honestly, you can also make plays and baits before hand to make it such that its too late for the lane your ganking to retreat. its not junglier vs enemy players. its junglier + teammates vs. enemy players.

Finally you could give a vision effect like nocturne. This gives his ultimate a quality of REAL RENGAR and real prey feeling.
this^^


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DoctorInju

Member

04-04-2014

Guys, I managed to acquire the minutes of the Rengar Rework meeting.

Scruffy: "Okay, guys. People hate Rengar. Words of power have been invoked on GD. As you all know, if enough people utter the words 'anti-fun', 'binary', or 'toxic', we are REQUIRED to nerf the champion. People hate his splitpushing and his ability to assassinate out-of-position squishies. What should we do?"

Rioter 1: "What if we removed the AS on his Q?"

Rioter 2: "Or, we could lower its overall damage."

Rioter 3: "What if we just kept it from working on towers?"

S: "Great ideas, guys! Let's do all three!"

R3: "Uh, Scruffy...we probably only need one of those."

S: "You're fired. Security, please escort Rioter 3 from the building. What else do we have? I don't feel like gutting his Q is enough to make ADC's feel safe and sheltered. Did you ever see the King Kong remake? I want ADC's feeling like the blonde girl when she slept in that giant gorilla paw."

R1: "What if the ult gave people a totally unnecessary warning when Rengar is near, but at a range larger than his leap?"

R2: "How about if the ult didn't build any ferocity until afterwards, but then did so really slowly?"

S: "Great stuff, guys. We'll do both. Let's turn the Bonetooth into a trinket, convert the E into a skillshot, and buff the W in a way that's anathema to his overall concept."

R1 & R2: "Another successful rework, Scruffy!"


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Bad Luck Braum

Senior Member

04-04-2014

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k28-uLa1CAk


^ Get Rengar (Get Jinxed parody)


Also I like the rengar change.

He feels more bursty. (Just build trinity force)

And to everyone Complaining about Losing aspd on Q.

That stat felt wierd. Why would you need attackspeed on a burst assasin?

Just build Trinity Force.

And then you can deal Tons of Damage.


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KILLRyaan

Junior Member

04-04-2014

You can't justify the ult change of making him visible because his burst was nerfed, so he couldn't if he even wanted to. And if he had built full damage, why shouldn't he be able to 100-0 squishies who aren't paying attention. I'm sure other champions can already do what rengar can't anymore without notice and 100-0 squishies. Some can even safely escape afterwards ie. leblanc and khazix. And split push at the same time ie. zed.

I am quoting what someone else had said as well.


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TrulyBasedGod

Junior Member

04-04-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by DoctorInju View Post
Guys, I managed to acquire the minutes of the Rengar Rework meeting.

Scruffy: "Okay, guys. People hate Rengar. Words of power have been invoked on GD. As you all know, if enough people utter the words 'anti-fun', 'binary', or 'toxic', we are REQUIRED to nerf the champion. People hate his splitpushing and his ability to assassinate out-of-position squishies. What should we do?"

Rioter 1: "What if we removed the AS on his Q?"

Rioter 2: "Or, we could lower its overall damage."

Rioter 3: "What if we just kept it from working on towers?"

S: "Great ideas, guys! Let's do all three!"

R3: "Uh, Scruffy...we probably only need one of those."

S: "You're fired. Security, please escort Rioter 3 from the building. What else do we have? I don't feel like gutting his Q is enough to make ADC's feel safe and sheltered. Did you ever see the King Kong remake? I want ADC's feeling like the blonde girl when she slept in that giant gorilla paw."

R1: "What if the ult gave people a totally unnecessary warning when Rengar is near, but at a range larger than his leap?"

R2: "How about if the ult didn't build any ferocity until afterwards, but then did so really slowly?"

S: "Great stuff, guys. We'll do both. Let's turn the Bonetooth into a trinket, convert the E into a skillshot, and buff the W in a way that's anathema to his overall concept."

R1 & R2: "Another successful rework, Scruffy!"
lol