Rengar Thread of Bolas and Roaring

First Riot Post
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Omega Painus

Junior Member

04-04-2014

I don't even play Rengar and I think this rework for him is absolutely horrid.
Any hopes of buying him now have been destroyed.

Good job Riot.

You've made playing the game against him easy as all hell now though. Thanks.


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Lilz Twisted

Senior Member

04-04-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by RiotScruffy View Post
There are a few people suggesting that the warning from his ult should be global. We thought about this idea actually but it was actually too punishing for Rengar because it gave his opponents too much time to react, and essentially removed all of his ganking power. Enemies would all just back up to their tower before he could engage, so we went with a much shorter warning time frame.

I'm much more keen on the idea that if he wouldn't be visible, the warning will not appear. This rewards clever paths and approaches when ulting.

Okay so if you're keen why not do it? You essentially told us something you've ALREADY said.. why not actually be productive and tell us WHY or WHY NOT you want to implement this feature?

Quote:
Originally Posted by RiotScruffy View Post
Just fixed this, will be in the next patch for sure.
Next patch? This is a detrimental bug to Rengar and must be hot fixed ASAP. Scruffy, there is a difference between the functionality of a spell and whether or not we think it's for the good of a champion and a bug. This is ridiculous.

I've posted this many times and seen no acknowledgement.


The current topics at hand.

Clunkyness

I think the changes you said you were gonna make so it doesn't feel weird and clunky with his Q sounds great. Do it.

The Q on structures

You said you don't want rengar to be able to be able to split push as effectively anymore with such a safe escape. You made his ultimate a little less safe due to the functionality of it now and the alert, so I think the best solution is to allow Rengar to use the Q on structures for reduced damage and no ferocity stacks being accumulated

EDIT: The alternative is to allow the q to do no bonus damage but allow it to gain a ferocity stack, and then give the empowered Q a speed buff again.

The Ultimate Alert

The idea that was suggested that the alert should only happen is rengar is within 1000 range and would be normally seen by enemies is perfect.


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Charrend

Senior Member

04-04-2014

Can rengars w have a base damage increase or have it do 125% damage to minions, his wave clear is just that little tiny bit short and it bugs me.


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DeathByWaffle

Senior Member

04-04-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by RiotScruffy View Post
Just fixed this, will be in the next patch for sure.
And when is next patch? Because this is something that really ruins the gameplay for Rengar and should be hotfixed as soon as possible.


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Clubbems

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Senior Member

04-04-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by RiotScruffy View Post
There are a few people suggesting that the warning from his ult should be global. We thought about this idea actually but it was actually too punishing for Rengar because it gave his opponents too much time to react, and essentially removed all of his ganking power. Enemies would all just back up to their tower before he could engage, so we went with a much shorter warning time frame.

I'm much more keen on the idea that if he wouldn't be visible, the warning will not appear. This rewards clever paths and approaches when ulting.
Maybe make it global... Once it's in 1000 range? I'd be okay with that.


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dankStabz

Senior Member

04-04-2014

@RiotScruffy, next patch? No thank you. Server maintenance or something to fix this now would be delightful. Why would I want to play a champion that is going to be bugged for another month? Obviously, the message I got from your post was saying that a bug can wait to be fixed, and this is a very important bug on his main damage ability...and you want us to wait till NEXT patch? lmfao really?


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Canstainer

Senior Member

04-04-2014

The Ultimate on rengar and his new "waring Feature" made rengar, just generic Champ.
And gives no clue at all, with his theme design. Is a awful hunter, with no damage, no speed, and of course his ultimate don't complete his purpose.

How mad need to be the forum, the fan base to revert this irresponsible patch ?
What is riot waiting for ?


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DeadAxl

Junior Member

04-04-2014

I have to say, I do not like the direction Riot is going with Rengar. His previous role as an assassin was great, and it fit thematically with his lore of being the ultimate hunter, but now he's a bruiser at best, and absolutly worthless at worst.

His Q doesn't feel like his primary damage ability anymore, just for the reason that it doesn't deal damage like it used to/should. Empowered Q feels like it's in the same place, but it won't matter, because you'll probably be using empowered e's or w's instead, due to the fact that you can't put down enough damage.
His W feels fine, and I don't have complaints other than the missing health portion feeling wierd (but that may be because I'm not so used to it)
His E is in an odd place for me, because it's not only his only ranged harass, but it's also his only ganking tool, and making it a skillshot makes it so you have a chance of missing completely, either through odd model placement or entity blocking (such as minions, because hitboxes are a pain like that), but otherwise, it's alright.
I enjoy the changes to Bonetooth, because now it's not just situational, it's a viable item, and it works in taking him into a support lane (which doesn't work at all anymore, due to the aforementioned damage loss on Q, it used to be quite fun).
And now his ult.
Oh man his ult.
Riot did almost as much good for his ult as they did bad, but the bad parts are just absolutely awful.
First the good: I like the ferocity generation coming after the destealth, it allows you to throw down an empowered bola, and then put down your (nonexistent) damage, and then either throw another empowered bola, or an empowered Q, and this makes it versatile for ganks.
But the cons easily outweigh the pros, and here's what I think makes it worthless:
1. The detection. What hunter lets himself get detected by his prey? Only the bad ones, and Rengar isn't supposed to BE a bad hunter, he's supposed to be the best, around, so that no one can ever get him down. It also allows his opponents to hunt HIM when he's stealthed and trying to make an escape, which just feels awful as a hunter.
2. The lowered movement speed. This nerf doesn't feel justified at all. I get making it so that it only applies when moving towards enemy champions, but making the bonus that low, only for the promise of a higher speed boost after 20 stacks? No.

I used to shake in my boots if there was a fed rengar on the enemy team, because I never knew where he was until my team was dying, and that felt GREAT. But now with him being a worthless bruiser, a bad hunter, and not terrifying or fun to play with, as, or against. Please revert everything but the Bonetooth changes, and I'm sure the entire community will be glad.

Or at least the Q changes, sans the tower pushing.


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Fishywtf

Member

04-04-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by RiotScruffy View Post
There are a few people suggesting that the warning from his ult should be global. We thought about this idea actually but it was actually too punishing for Rengar because it gave his opponents too much time to react, and essentially removed all of his ganking power. Enemies would all just back up to their tower before he could engage, so we went with a much shorter warning time frame.

I'm much more keen on the idea that if he wouldn't be visible, the warning will not appear. This rewards clever paths and approaches when ulting.
I suggest to remove the stealth entirely that's the most toxic part about Rengar. It was not the Q burst rather being nuked from nowhere. Increase his movement speed, remove the stealth, deplete ferocity meter when used, and generate ferocity during activation, include leap.


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ZamielVanWeber

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Senior Member

04-04-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheNoodleNinja View Post
You could start by changing him being listed as an assassin and a fighter and change it to tank. I suppose you could also offer anyone who spent RP on him a refund too.
They didn't offer refunds the time they blatantly lied to us about Swain. (All we got was Guinsoo explaining about how their deceit was justified, followed up by a quickly deleted apology for Guinsoo's comment). They won't offer refunds for an incompetently done rework.

Problems with the Rango:
His Q does virtually no damage compared to old (and to be clear, his damage as a team fight goes on is markedly lower). It is useless for pushing because it neither hits turrets nor gives him a meaningful buff. It leaves me feeling unwell using it, because I have no idea why it exists beyond +1 Ferocity.

His W is slightly better. Yay?

His E is better for chasing opponents who have ms >= to yours and are between 576 units and 1000 units away, while they have no skills to pull back/push you away. In all scenarios, it is comparable (better slow for a miss chance) or worse (because it is very weak for poking now). The gains you get (better at chasing in the above parameters) are NOT worth the uselessness is gets on lane. It needs to be adjusted to either give more for the poke loss or restore its poke capacity. As it sits Rengar is vulnerable to zoning by melees more than ever before.

His R is utter jank right now. I know why you did the warning, but because of it there are a good number of champs who have a lot less to worry about, Vayne has a knockback and a dodge, Malz can puddle himself and ult as soon as you land on him, etc. More annoying is the fact that is will only gives 2-3 Ferocity unless you whiff entirely*; my ult should not function properly only when I screw up (it just feels patronizing). I believe the intention was for the player to be able to go in with full/near full ferocity, burst, and have it up soon What it works out to practically is it being useless if he has low ferocity and useless if he fails to assassinate the target (where he will not need the ferocity anymore).

Things to fix: Make his Q a skill again, and not just a +1 Ferocity button; make his E change so the loss of poke has a trade off outside a narrow band and; fix his ult like crazy; and for heavens sake give him ANY laning power. He is still easily kited but now cannot safely stand toe-to-toe with most melees.