Rengar Thread of Bolas and Roaring

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Ololoshev

Member

04-24-2014

Lol these random 1 or 2 downvotes on posts which critique the rework make me think it's just scruffy silently avenging us for disliking his work.


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CaptnJakSparrow

Senior Member

04-24-2014

It's kind of depressing considering I offered and explained a perfectly viable way to make him efficient, require some skill, and also offers counter play, and it's probably not even going to be read. Oh well, I guess.


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Hawkefire

Senior Member

04-24-2014

still no splitpushing discussion.

And still completely unviable in high elo.

And Skarner still hasn't been touched.

I am scared for Darius and Yorick......


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Noric

Senior Member

04-24-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hawkefire View Post
And still completely unviable in high elo.
Ummmmmm - if he had a 53% winrate in diamond first day after this patch - why is he completely unviable in high elo?


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Hawkefire

Senior Member

04-24-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by Noric View Post
Ummmmmm - if he had a 53% winrate in diamond first day after this patch - why is he completely unviable in high elo?
Sites that have statistics like winrate take a LONG time to update.
Now then, allow me to explain how high elo ****s on him.

First and foremost, here are the reasons why old Rengar was picked in high elo:

1) He was one of the best splitpushers in the game due to the rate that he could take down towers and he could do it safely
(**DISCLAIMER**I personally felt his splitpushing was too strong, but having it removed was really a bad move and removed an important part of his old playstyle. They should have just made his Q deal reduced damage to towers or something, wouldn't be that hard to program...then again considering he was released with so many bugs that were even pointed out on the PBE, some of those bugs that he STILL has......you get the point)

2) Could delete a squishy EXTREMELY quickly if the enemy is unable to peel him, or failed to properly ward their jungle.
(He was almost never built full tank in high elo, however they would sometimes build him bruiser)

Now then, why is Rengar picked in high elo now?

1) He excels at nothing compared to any other champion and as such is only picked by diehard Rengar fans, or as a trollpick.


Why?

First and foremost, his splitpushing ability was removed. Boom, he was now replaced by his primary competitor Shyvanna on nearly every splitpushing teamcomp (which were the only teamcomps that would even consider running Rengar).

Second: He can no longer reliably delete an ADC very quickly. If he his built full assassin, the ADC WILL win the duel...every....single...time.
Why? Rengar cannot engage on the ADC with his ult, because the moment he gets within warning range of the ADC, the ADC will place a pink ward down and begin chunking his HP (which will KILL Assassin Rengar, and it will bring bruiser Rengar down to at least 3/4 HP if they are on equal terms). Now then the moment Rengar jumps on the ADC, the ADC will use a self-peel move (such as Caitlyns net shot) and continue kiting Rengar, and eventually killing him because Rengar has no true gap close.

Third: One of his semi-viable builds (aka: Full Tank) was absolutely ruined by this rework simply because he doesn't deal enough damage to make it considerable. Not only that but he cannot initiate the fight with his ult either because the warning will cause the entire enemy team to disengage (or worse, place a pink ward down and simply kill him)).


To break this down further:

Assassin Rengar:

Outclassed by every other true assassin. Not only do they have a better chance of coming back than Rengar does, but they also often have backup roles that they can fall back to. Not only that, but the ones that have a hard time coming back are also a lot safer then Rengar at all stages of play.

Bruiser Rengar:

Outclassed by every other true bruiser. Need damage, engage, early control? Take Lee. Need splitpush, tank, and damage? Take Shyvanna.
These are just a few of the more common examples.
However: The recent buffs MIGHT make this build semi-viable, but at the complete cost of all other playstyles....

Tank Rengar:

Outclassed by every other true tank. They all have better initiate than he does, and they all have more CC than he does and thus can fulfill the role. Not only that, but they can often deal more damage than Rengar can...which is downright amusing if you think about it.


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Nothappys

Junior Member

04-25-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hawkefire View Post
Sites that have statistics like winrate take a LONG time to update.
Now then, allow me to explain how high elo ****s on him.

First and foremost, here are the reasons why old Rengar was picked in high elo:

1) He was one of the best splitpushers in the game due to the rate that he could take down towers and he could do it safely
(**DISCLAIMER**I personally felt his splitpushing was too strong, but having it removed was really a bad move and removed an important part of his old playstyle. They should have just made his Q deal reduced damage to towers or something, wouldn't be that hard to program...then again considering he was released with so many bugs that were even pointed out on the PBE, some of those bugs that he STILL has......you get the point)

2) Could delete a squishy EXTREMELY quickly if the enemy is unable to peel him, or failed to properly ward their jungle.
(He was almost never built full tank in high elo, however they would sometimes build him bruiser)

Now then, why is Rengar picked in high elo now?

1) He excels at nothing compared to any other champion and as such is only picked by diehard Rengar fans, or as a trollpick.


Why?

First and foremost, his splitpushing ability was removed. Boom, he was now replaced by his primary competitor Shyvanna on nearly every splitpushing teamcomp (which were the only teamcomps that would even consider running Rengar).

Second: He can no longer reliably delete an ADC very quickly. If he his built full assassin, the ADC WILL win the duel...every....single...time.
Why? Rengar cannot engage on the ADC with his ult, because the moment he gets within warning range of the ADC, the ADC will place a pink ward down and begin chunking his HP (which will KILL Assassin Rengar, and it will bring bruiser Rengar down to at least 3/4 HP if they are on equal terms). Now then the moment Rengar jumps on the ADC, the ADC will use a self-peel move (such as Caitlyns net shot) and continue kiting Rengar, and eventually killing him because Rengar has no true gap close.

Third: One of his semi-viable builds (aka: Full Tank) was absolutely ruined by this rework simply because he doesn't deal enough damage to make it considerable. Not only that but he cannot initiate the fight with his ult either because the warning will cause the entire enemy team to disengage (or worse, place a pink ward down and simply kill him)).


To break this down further:

Assassin Rengar:

Outclassed by every other true assassin. Not only do they have a better chance of coming back than Rengar does, but they also often have backup roles that they can fall back to. Not only that, but the ones that have a hard time coming back are also a lot safer then Rengar at all stages of play.

Bruiser Rengar:

Outclassed by every other true bruiser. Need damage, engage, early control? Take Lee. Need splitpush, tank, and damage? Take Shyvanna.
These are just a few of the more common examples.
However: The recent buffs MIGHT make this build semi-viable, but at the complete cost of all other playstyles....

Tank Rengar:

Outclassed by every other true tank. They all have better initiate than he does, and they all have more CC than he does and thus can fulfill the role. Not only that, but they can often deal more damage than Rengar can...which is downright amusing if you think about it.
Could not have said it better myself

+1

Riot should read this


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abbasqamar

Senior Member

04-25-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hawkefire View Post
Sites that have statistics like winrate take a LONG time to update.
Now then, allow me to explain how high elo ****s on him.

First and foremost, here are the reasons why old Rengar was picked in high elo:

1) He was one of the best splitpushers in the game due to the rate that he could take down towers and he could do it safely
(**DISCLAIMER**I personally felt his splitpushing was too strong, but having it removed was really a bad move and removed an important part of his old playstyle. They should have just made his Q deal reduced damage to towers or something, wouldn't be that hard to program...then again considering he was released with so many bugs that were even pointed out on the PBE, some of those bugs that he STILL has......you get the point)

2) Could delete a squishy EXTREMELY quickly if the enemy is unable to peel him, or failed to properly ward their jungle.
(He was almost never built full tank in high elo, however they would sometimes build him bruiser)

Now then, why is Rengar picked in high elo now?

1) He excels at nothing compared to any other champion and as such is only picked by diehard Rengar fans, or as a trollpick.


Why?

First and foremost, his splitpushing ability was removed. Boom, he was now replaced by his primary competitor Shyvanna on nearly every splitpushing teamcomp (which were the only teamcomps that would even consider running Rengar).

Second: He can no longer reliably delete an ADC very quickly. If he his built full assassin, the ADC WILL win the duel...every....single...time.
Why? Rengar cannot engage on the ADC with his ult, because the moment he gets within warning range of the ADC, the ADC will place a pink ward down and begin chunking his HP (which will KILL Assassin Rengar, and it will bring bruiser Rengar down to at least 3/4 HP if they are on equal terms). Now then the moment Rengar jumps on the ADC, the ADC will use a self-peel move (such as Caitlyns net shot) and continue kiting Rengar, and eventually killing him because Rengar has no true gap close.

Third: One of his semi-viable builds (aka: Full Tank) was absolutely ruined by this rework simply because he doesn't deal enough damage to make it considerable. Not only that but he cannot initiate the fight with his ult either because the warning will cause the entire enemy team to disengage (or worse, place a pink ward down and simply kill him)).


To break this down further:

Assassin Rengar:

Outclassed by every other true assassin. Not only do they have a better chance of coming back than Rengar does, but they also often have backup roles that they can fall back to. Not only that, but the ones that have a hard time coming back are also a lot safer then Rengar at all stages of play.

Bruiser Rengar:

Outclassed by every other true bruiser. Need damage, engage, early control? Take Lee. Need splitpush, tank, and damage? Take Shyvanna.
These are just a few of the more common examples.
However: The recent buffs MIGHT make this build semi-viable, but at the complete cost of all other playstyles....

Tank Rengar:

Outclassed by every other true tank. They all have better initiate than he does, and they all have more CC than he does and thus can fulfill the role. Not only that, but they can often deal more damage than Rengar can...which is downright amusing if you think about it.
totally agreed except one point

1) He was one of the best splitpushers in the game due to the rate that he could take down towers and he could do it safely <------------- this one

suppose enemy team has tryna or Jax do you think you can split push! ? i dont think so .. tryna and jax both has most split pushing power in the game .. and no way old rengar could kill them either jax or tryna Both hit and they hit so hard honestly when jax or tryan got botk they hit tower so hard if tryna got botrk and shiv he will take down the tower less then a min and off course to kill tryna u need a strong top laner!

Rengar is good split pusher but not best ! i really dont know why riot gutted the power of split pushing! i never ever Saw a Single LCS or OGN or EU match where rengar picked as Assasin and did the insane split pushed

but i Saw Tryna Split pushing and jax split pushing even in OGN and LCS and shyvana or renk cant stop them

remember the Zion spartan jax CST vs EG when jax was pushing so hard and shyvana was unable to stop him!!!


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Mr Scruffz

Senior Member

04-25-2014

Rengar can assassinate just as hard I don't see what the problem is he just doesn't assassinate towers anymore.


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HeWhoHates

Member

04-25-2014

@RiotScruffy

Increase the width and the speed of the bola.

Give back his normal Q AS, (for Jungle clears).

Also you should just remove the whole, "The Hunt Is On" quest. Kha overpowers Rengar by a huge margin. Not only is he superior to Rengar's early game but if Kha just focuses him and get kill after kill, It's over before it even began.


PS.

His top lane is HORRIBLE!


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alfavhunter

Senior Member

04-25-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by HeWhoHates View Post
@RiotScruffy

Increase the width and the speed of the bola.

Also you should just remove the whole, "The Hunt Is On" quest. Kha overpowers Rengar by a huge margin. Not only is he superior to Rengar's early game but if Kha just focuses him and get kill after kill, It's over before it even began.
The problem with THIO is this

Kha gets a good power spike for winning

Rengar gets what he would have or very we'll should already have because he can get 20 stacks with some ease from smart plates and teamwork

The problem is they changed his bone tooth without updating the head or quest (is it still bugged to where rengar literally cannot win? It has been for moths before his nerfing err I mean rework)

Kha gets a huge power spike rengar gets an item visual change with no benefits

Heck I would t be surprised if they still haven't fixed the quest so rengar literally cannot win still