@Riot It's time that you acknowledge that Ashe is currently...Trash (big post)

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HandheldBrandon

Senior Member

08-24-2014

I decided to do some research into Ashe because she is one of the marskman i happen to like alot. Well after looking through the patch notes dating all the way back to february 10th the only change that Ashe has received of any significant value was a nerf and it was to her E's gold gain.

They nerfed her E's gold gain to 3 at all ranks and also lowered the cooldown of E to 40 at max rank.

YAAAAYYY!!!!!

Exciting right?!

Well guess what that was her only change can you guess when her last change was before that?

Dont bother ill tell you it was patch 3.13 which was released on October 29 2013. Thats right Ashe hasn't been changed in almost a year meanwhile Lucian receives buffs and nerfs left and right. Patch 3.13 was also the same patch that Sivir got her visual upgrade and rework released. The same Sivir who received changes constantly month after month after month until recently hell Lucian has been in almost every patch for the last 3-4 months. But Ashe a champion who has literally been invalidated because of Riot's incessant need to give everything a god damn gap closer still hasn't mentioned her nor said anything is on the Horizon balance wise.

Ashe probably has one of the most useless passives in the game. Yay Ashe builds up crit chance passively when she doesn't attack. Meaning that when Ashe is attacking she has no passive. If she does use up her focus stacks they reset to her a level currently at what her crit chance is. Sounds nice right? It does except that you dont build focus if you are attacking meaning that if you use that critical hit and then you continue attacking your passive is no longer functioning and building focus.

Now lets get to the biggest Issues.

Mobility
Dashes
Movespeed buffs
Blinks

You know what Ashe has in common with those?
She has none of them. What she does have however is a slow. A slow that costs mana every attack and a ranged AOE that has a slow dependent on above mentioned abilities level.

Now i am going to list the marksmen

Vayne-Tumble
Graves-Dash
Corki-Dash
Caitlyn-Dash
Ezreal-Blink
Draven-Movespeed buff
Lucian-Dash
Tristana-Jump
Twitch-Movespeed and Invisibility
Sivir-Movespeed on hit and ultimate AOE Movespeed
Miss Fortune- Passive movespeed buff unless attacked
Jinx-Massive Movespeed on kill or assist
Quinn-Dash/ministun and ultimate Movespeed buff
Ashe-No mobility
Varus-No mobility
Kogmaw-No mobility


Out of all those champions listed only 3 of them dont have any mobility whatsoever that can be used in any fashion or by their control. I decided to compare stats as well and Ashe's only saving grave vs these 2 other marksman is her base range is higher. Except for koggles when he has W on ashe only has 25 more range than varus who has a massive poke radius of up to almost 1400.

Not only does Ashe not have any mobility but she also has no usable steroid (her passive is worthless) or passive steroid to call upon so that means that she hard levels through items but if shes behind in lane shes also going to be behind everywhere else. So not only does she have no mobility and no steriod she also gains all of her power through items.

"PPPFFFFTTTT you are dumb dude Ashe is the reason we have so many gap closers and she has a permaslow gtfo"

Sure Ashe is the reason we Had a few gap closers made namely Xin and Jarvan but that doesn't explain the over abundance of gapclosers that pretty much every champion has now. I want you to go ahead and look through a champion pool and tell me which of the recent releases doesn't have a gap closer or any mobility of any kind?

The most recent champion releases without some kind of Movement ability whether that be a dash or movespeed boost was the four listed below.

Xerath
Vel'Koz
Brand
Swain

The last champion release before that that didnt have any kind of movement ability whether dash or movespeed boost was......

Kogmaw
on june 24 2010 was the last time a champion without any kind of movement/dash ability was released. Now you can't tell me that Ashe is the reason for 4 years of champions with gap closers of some kind can you? No you bloody can't.

I will now list the champion releases from newest to last with dashes or blinks.

Gnar
Braum
Yasuo
Lucian
Aatrox
Lissandra
Zac
Quinn
Thresh(can dash if he lands Q which is a pull itself)
Vi
Zed
Elise
Khazix
Rengar
Diana
Jayce
Hecarim
Fiora
Nautilus
Ziggs
Sejuani
Ahri
Fizz
Shyvana
Graves
Riven
Talon
Wukong
Leona
Vayne
Lee Sin
Nocturne
Jarvan
Maokai
Renekton
Caitlyn
Irelia (better nerf just to be safe)
Leblanc
Urgot (in a sense his ultimate is a suppression blink)
Xin Zhao
Akali
Shen
Ezreal
Gragas
Pantheon
Poppy
Nidalee
Shaco
Corki
Katarina
Malphite
Kassadin
Amumu
Tryndamere
Alistar (Headbutt can be used as a dash See headbutt pulverize combo for more info)
Jax
Master Yi
Tristana
Warwick



Now if im not mistaken thats about half the roster.

So more than half the roster can by pass Ashe's kiting ability.
Still believe that Ashe is fine well what if i told you that most of these Dashes have ranges of 400-3500?

You would think thats a huge range between dash ranges wouldnt you but then what if i told you the majority of dashes (around 90percent of them) are 500-700 range.

"PPPFFFTTTT So what Ashe can slow them and kite all day!"

Go ahead Kite Lucian
and Vayne
and Wukong
and Caitlyn
and Leona
and Gragas
and Maokai
and Jarvan
and Nidalee
and Tristana
and etc etc

My point has been made Ashe's "Utility" is no longer an excuse to keep her in the state she is. You say she can Kite and i tell you to look at all the top picks currently and go ahead and to kite them and then i want you to count the times you were successful without flash because once you use flash you lose all mobility and any chance you had of escaping if you try and go back in at all and someone is after your blood.

Ashe has no mobility, no steroid, one damage ability, and 3 utility abilities. Her supposed Utility is completely invalidated by the fact that everyone and their mom has a dash longer than Ashes attack range and twice the mobility to boot. Ashe has some pretty poor base stats and on a list of comparison to her other marksman she is dead last in nearly every category.

Its time to face the music.

Ashe needs buffs and or a rework and you just aren't doing it or acknowledging the problem that she does and cant compete with her fellow marskman in nearly any category.


TL;dr Read the damn thread if you dont have time to read it then i dont have time for your answers.


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Fel8 Me Byoch

Senior Member

08-24-2014

Ashe needs a buff?

I'm shocked. SHOCKED.


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HandheldBrandon

Senior Member

08-24-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fel8 Me Byoch View Post
Ashe needs a buff?

I'm shocked. SHOCKED.
Thank you for your wonderful insight.


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Erijian

Senior Member

08-24-2014

Hey, I want buffs for Ashe too, alright. There's one problem with asking for buffs for her, though.

Riot considers her a beginner champion. As long as they consider Ashe a beginner Champion, she won't receive any buffs any time soon. I've pretty much accepted this after Riot ignored the pleas for Garen buffs for ages then replied "LOL Beginner Champ sorry." in a Q&A.

It's about time to give up on asking for buffs for her too. Riot doesn't really care much for the buffs the community wants, they mostly care for buffs/nerfs that keep their eSports in the "FLASHY/COUNTER PLAY!" area.


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Hawkefire

Senior Member

08-24-2014

Here is the thing though.


Ashe isn't the only one that needs buffs, many many champions are harmed very greatly by this league of mobility.

Such as Olaf, Garen, Darius, Volibear, and there are others as well. These champions are harmed even more than ashe is by the sheer amount of mobility in the game.


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HandheldBrandon

Senior Member

08-25-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hawkefire View Post
Here is the thing though.


Ashe isn't the only one that needs buffs, many many champions are harmed very greatly by this league of mobility.

Such as Olaf, Garen, Darius, Volibear, and there are others as well. These champions are harmed even more than ashe is by the sheer amount of mobility in the game.
But those Champs still have a function role. Olaf berserk the enemy back line and forces the enemy team to stop him or lose their carry plus his true damage is killer. Garen while he struggles can become one of the tankiest monsters in the game plus with his q up he can remove slows and silence and does some pretty decent Aoe and there is always the threat of his execute.

Darius struggles a bit more but his pull plus his Aoe and huge bleeds and his ultimate mean even if he isn't putting out the most damage to someone he's putting some serious hurt on at least several members of the enemy team. Ever seen a voli blitz out of the jungle because it is one of the scariest things out there. An early voli gang is almost certain death to his target or guarantees a forced flash plus he can get deceptively tank as well and can berserk enemy back lines plus if he has built smart it will tank a whole bunch of cool down to kill him or an ignite.

Ashes whole niche is her utility and ability to kite easily. Calling her a beginning champ when part of her whole mechanics is kiting which is much more advanced than any beginner will ever know. Her utility is a stun skillshot and vision. Her passive gold is an absolute joke and no beginner is ever going to understand her passive unless they aren't a beginner at all.

Basically she's built to be a slow machine who initiates fights and scouts for her team but what good is a slow machine if the enemy can get out of your slow 99 percent of the time?

My suggestion is scrap e for its pointless at this point she needs a new e with the warding game being so heavy there is little need for it besides it not only gives away your position but it's also a huge warning light for enemy teams to let them know that you and your team are coming. Give ashe a steroid I'm fine if she has no mobility but by God give the woman a proper steroid.

I don't really need to say this but the passive has to go that should be blatantly obvious.

Q is fine I like it and it's core to her character but it needs to be updated. Give it a passive aspect for example and this is just an example

Her q could passively slow albeit not as strong as it is now and when activated it could slow around the enemy similar to how iceborn works. That's just a random example.

The main issues I see are her e and passive being slightly worthless and her q being good but outdated. Her w is fine but could be updated. Keep the slow functionality the way it is. If i had my way with it you would be able to hit enemies with multiple arrows and it would slow the enemy the closer they were. So if you are garen and ashe uses w amd you are in her face you get his by multiple arrows and take more damage and get slowed for the max value but if you are at the tip of ashes range and she uses w you get hit by 1 or 2 arrows and get a reduced slow and take less damage.


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Keenano

Member

08-25-2014

+1

Also, what is your opinion on MF? Because I personally feel MF is even worse than Ashe.


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Crett

Recruiter

08-25-2014

ok i GOT it i got it
instead of 1 crappy crit, she should build up 10 focus with each autoattack and once it's maxed, her next attack should have 1000 range and slow for twice the amount
BAM can't even get close enough to dash
league of gap-closers has been shamed

volley SHOULD have shotgun damage, even more league of gap-closers slapping
and after using volley, the next two autoattacks have 2.5 attack speed

either that or she should be able to charge volley for 2 seconds for like, double damage

E just needs a shorter cooldown and longer duration
if it could be used every 15 seconds at max rank and last for 5 seconds, she would suddenly have an amazing ability right there
and then just put 100 true damage on the hawk shot if it hits an enemy directly

there i made her op


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MAXED6

Senior Member

08-25-2014

Riot should give ashe drow ranger's passive, let the tears role.


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Cancer Fizz

Senior Member

08-25-2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hawkefire View Post
Here is the thing though.


Ashe isn't the only one that needs buffs, many many champions are harmed very greatly by this league of mobility.

Such as Olaf, Garen, Darius, Volibear, and there are others as well. These champions are harmed even more than ashe is by the sheer amount of mobility in the game.
this isn't exactly true,look at kogmaw,one of the strongest current adcs,he is clearly immobile,and yet at the same time,clearly works.

i agree that mobility is part of ashes problem(like with plenty of other champions),but it is not all of it,her bases stats and abilities are just pathetic to what meta adcs bring,she needs some aggressive buffs just to make her viable as a highly situational pick,and she should get those buffs.

and btw,the w change to 3 gold flat was definitely a buff.


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