Bye Bye Supports

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Gurei Fullbuster

Senior Member

11-20-2013

Sigh, and of course as soon as I get here and post something I really wanted a response on, Morello seems to have left/moved on...


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EffectFX

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Senior Member

11-20-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by naotasan View Post
Explain Karma then.

She went from ****ing amazing support niche pick to cookie cutter Q spam in the mid/top lane.
Primary Role: Mage
Secondary Role: Support

There you go.


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Battletick

Senior Member

11-20-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Morello View Post
3) Looking at these changes, seeing "NERFS" as the takeaway is...well, I don't know how to put it....insane. One of the patch notes could be "increased income by 3000-6000 gold per game".
That's buffing the income of the person who takes 0 CS, it doesn't buff supports at all. Basically you want traditional supports to feel like they're poor even though you're giving them more money. I don' think I'll ever play Janna again after these changes. :/


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PureQuestion

Senior Member

11-20-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Henry Plainview View Post
Because it's fairly ludicrous that Morello can't see how it's a nerf when supports need 100+ AP to reach their CURRENT utility levels.
100 AP?! WHAT AN UNREASONABLE NUMBER TO OBTAIN. That's like, 2000 whole gold! How absurd!

Edit: Since I'm somewhat worried at the quote I've received and also these negative votes, I am, in fact, being sarcastic.


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Lykanthar

Senior Member

11-20-2013

My biggest concern over the support champion changes are that many of them don't seem to break even until around 100 AP. While it's great that these support champions will scale utility much better past that 100 AP mark (and late game support buffs are definitely welcome) it seems like they will be weaker up until that point. Meanwhile, fiddlesticks or annie with 100 AP are going to get much stronger at a much faster rate now, with no early game nerfs to get past.


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silverbacon

Senior Member

11-20-2013

I don't see what in this update is stopping me from taking Syndra bottom lane and just absolutely wrecking the lane. I couldn't do it before because the lack of gold made her worthless late game. Now that shouldn't be a problem. And she's not the only champion in this position now.

I should add that I love to play traditional support, primarily Nami, and have gotten pretty good at playing her support. But is the extra utility worth more than having a second viable AP carry? I'm not so sure with these updates. Support champions just feel inferior.


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SmokingPuffin

Senior Member

11-20-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by EYO TEETO View Post
Wow - I can't believe people are actually ANGRY about these preseason changes. As a support main, I am extremely excited, and I'm counting down the days until the preseason patch is live.
I'm pretty excited too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by EYO TEETO View Post
And as far as supports getting their AP ratios nerfed - Why are people complaining at ALL about this?
Because as usual with supports, it's one step forward and one step back. There can be no support buff without a support nerf, and people hate nerfs more than they like buffs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by EYO TEETO View Post
With the new gold, we now actually have the freedom to buy AP, AD, tank items, whatever we want.

Yes, the AP ratios have been nerfed, but the fact that we can actually AFFORD to buy AP far outweighs the fact that the ratios were nerfed.
Specifically, I will be using this freedom to dunk people with support LeBlanc.

You see, Janna got some nice AD scaling on her shield as long as it lasts, and her W slows more. In exchange, she got ratio nerfs for her stuff. Meanwhile, support LeBlanc just got a truckload of extra money to buy AP with. I figure that shield will last maybe 0.5 seconds, and I can live with a bit of slowing while I'm destroying Janna's carry.

This is maybe too dystopic a vision, but that's the way the game looks to me tomorrow. I expect many of the classic supports to require significant buffs in order to get themselves back into competitive play.

Quote:
Originally Posted by EYO TEETO View Post
Also - This patch will greatly increase variety inside of the support role. Since the role will now be getting a lot more gold, it will technically be viable to take ANY champ bot lane. It's hard to say what new champions will shine - but with no doubt, this patch will make for a more dynamic, interesting, and (dare I say it?) FUN support experience.
This is why people are complaining, man. They see a world in which their favorite supports aren't worth playing and mids take over their lane. It's no different than when top lane was overrun by Kennens and Elises and Ryzes; the fighter players were pissed.

Of course, I have extreme confidence in the developers buffing every support that falls behind, because this is a tentpole issue for season 4 and they will not let supports be sad.


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Woodchuckmaster

Junior Member

11-20-2013

All i got to say is ppl u have to try the new support stuff b4 u come out and go its horrible otherwise ur just complaining w/out knowing the full story


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Silentcoyote

Senior Member

11-20-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by MisterTitanic View Post
morello, supports bottom lane should not be a necessity every game. AP mids bottom lane should be just as viable as a support bottom lane. supports are historically the least popular role and the meta basically shoved them down our throats. it's like stockholm syndrome where if you're forced to play something enough you eventually enjoy it
That's like saying all top should be able to jungle.
Put Malz, Ahri, or fizz support tell me how that works out.

These changes are taking a lot into account. If supports ratios stayed the same they would outclass everyone. They would buy gold flow items. But AP damage items, and then we'd have Nami being a burst mage.

These changes are right.
Disperse you damn rebels.


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Axxlon

Member

11-20-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Morello View Post
If you want to do big damage, then I actually don't understand why you are playing a support character.
You don't seem to understand the concepts of 'potential' and 'out-classing', do you...? -_-


It's not that we WANT to. It's that Ori/Zyra/Annie not only fill in the roll for "traditional" supports, but do EVEN MORE.

Basically: Zyra can provide the same general level of CC as, say, Janna, but also have high damage potential. And it's not a big trade-off either.