What items would you guys like to see? (With Rules)

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Dimensionist

Senior Member

12-19-2010

A couple other major issues I have with itemization:

1. Some of the *best* and *most* commonly bought items hurt mages in two different ways. EG: Merc Treads + Banshee's Veil.

Casters rely on CC and Magic damage with completely useless auto attacks. DPS rely mostly on auto attacks, some of their own CC and/or CC from tanks/support. Merc Treads helps mitigate CC and helps mitigate magic damage. Banshee's veil gives HP, mitigates one nuke and/or CC, and to top it all off provides more magic damage mitigation.

Imagine if Merc Treads still provided CC reduction and gave armor instead of magic resist. Or if banshee's veil provided armor but still kept the shield passive but no longer gave magic resist. This is IMHO another huge issue as to why casters are lackluster. Squishies generally will buy little no armor items because none of them provide passives that are worth striving for.

Possible item:
Banshee's Armor - 65 armor, builds from catalyst + Chain vest. Keep the same amount of HP, Mana, and Total gold price with the same unique passive that does not stack with Banshee's veil.

Easiest fix for Merc Treads is just to remove the magic resist altogether, keep the unique CC reduction passive, and give it 100-150 HP instead.

This way the items are not intentionally designed to screw mages over.


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Agg

Senior Member

12-19-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xypherous View Post
I'm curious as to what items would you guys like to see in game?

Let's lay some ground rules first. I'm not going to respond to your post unless it meets the following criterion:

1) You explicitly define what problem/hole in itemization that you see in our game, or explicitly list a few champions that will *most* synergize with it.

2) You list everything about the item: Stats, Gold Cost, Recipe, etc.

3) You explain why the item solves the problem that you defined in #1.

For example (Not that I would actually put this item in game):


Problem: AoE CC-chains are too powerful in our game.

Spirit of Freedom:

Null Magic Mantle + 700 G

50 MR

Unique Passive: Each time you are stunned, feared, taunted, silenced or rooted, you apply a debuff on your attacker. This effect causes your attacker to deal 5% less damage for 8s. This stacks up to 10 times.

Explanation: If your entire team gets this, AoE CC's will cause the ones who used their AoE CC's to deal highly reduced damage for the remainder of the fight. So they get to choose whether to do high damage or AoE CC your team.
There is a distinct lack of basic items. What I mean by this is that there is no Cooldown Reduction only item, there is no Spell Vamp only item. Flat Magic Pen and Armor Pen items are also lacking.

Based on an item cost efficiency spreadsheet I found, a good starting point for a:

CDR item might be 200 for 5% reduction and/or 350 for 10%. Let's say it is the 10% item and call it "Stone of the Quickened Mind."

Spell Vamp item might be 175 for 7% Spell vamp and/or 350 for 15%. Additionally, there is a severe lack of options to obtain this stat. Let's say its the 15% item and call it the Wraithorb.

With regards to armor pen, using The Brutalizer as the base-value-item and accounting for the other stats it give, Armor Pen is way too efficient. Using the CDR rate above, plus the damage/cost of a longsword, armor pen is giving you money. Discussing this further would lead to a tangent so I will just say Armor pen needs to be made more expensive.

The picture for Spell Pen is significantly grimmer than Armor Pen, when using the Haunting Guise as a base-value-item, as accounting for other stats leaves Spell Pen costing slightly more than 20 gold per point. When considering the fact that Spell Pen costs money where Armor Pen seemingly creates value for you, and the fact that the Haunting guise does not build in to anything, there is something obviously amiss. Stats should cost gold, and as such I think the only conclusion one can come to is that Armor Pen, and therefore The Brutalizer, are under-priced.

Now on to more specific suggestions.

Problem: Endgame Spellcasting items are boring/fewer/less impactful than endgame AD items. There is also a distinct lack of spell vamp items.

Soulgorger:
Built from Needlessly Large Rod + Wraithorb + 900g

100 AP
20% Spell Vamp
Passive: Gain an additional 1 Ability Power and 0.35% Spell Vamp per kill. Maximum of +50 Ability Power and 17.5% Lifesteal. Bonuses are lost upon death.


This item would provide some toughness for spellcasters, while still allowing them to be bursted down by assassin type characters. This item would synergize well with low-cd casters such as Ryze, Karthus, and Kassiopeia. Any other offensive caster will also benefit from the stats.

Problem: Casters need an item that give AP and allows them to take a hit or three from any kind of physical damage dealer.

Atma's Brooch:
Built from Blasting Wand + Chain Vest + 700g

45 Armor
40 AP
Unique Passive: 3% of your Maximum Health is added to you Ability Power.


Problem: Magic damage dealers have no Bloodrazor equivalent (DFG does not count as it does magic damage for magic damage dealers, and thus building against the character builds against the item as well).

Zhonya's Barb:
Built from Blasting Wand + 2x Stone of the Quickened Mind + Null Magic Mantle + 700g

40AP
31% CDR
30 MR
Unique Passive: Abilities (Magic damage dealing ones only if the tech exists to differentiate them) deal 1% of target's Max HP per second as physical damage over the CD of the ability. The maximum length of this debuff is 10 seconds. Also deals 5% of the ability's damage over the same amount of time as Physical Damage.

There is also room for say making an item that would build from some combination of current and items listed above, such as the hextech revolver from an Amplifying Tome and a Wraithorb or some such.


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Dimensionist

Senior Member

12-19-2010

Another thing I want to add is the lack of a truly viable movespeed item for mages.

Zeals/phantom dancers/tri force are all great items and are often times bought on many DPS champs. In a longer game it's very common for a DPS champion to buy a phantom dancer as part of their build. If the game drags on longer I often see a DPS selling the boots for yet another phantom dancer, they don't sacrifice movespeed or damage by doing this.

I'm not asking for mages to have godly movespeed items but at least ONE item that's a little bit more viable is not too much to ask for. Lich Bane is such a Niche item and only good on a few select champs.

Item Solution:
Hextech Rod - 3365 gold total cost.

Needlessly Large rod - 1600 gold
Hextech Revolver - 765 gold
Combine Cost - 1000 gold

+ 140 AP
+ 25 percent spell vamp.
+ 9 percent movespeed

This would help casters like Annie, Anivia, Morgana, Leblanc, Ryze etc that can at least get some movespeed late game against the DPS running around with 500 plus movespeed.


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Ekitchi

Senior Member

12-19-2010

There is only one active support item (Shurelya's Reverie). And no way to deal with CC for an ally.
It would be interesting to have a Quicksilver Sash-like item for allies:

Name: Treatment (name creation is not my cup of tea ^^):
Recipe: Kindlegem + Cloth Armor + Null-Magic Mantle + 500g (total 2050g)
Stats: 200 HP, 18 Armor, 24 MR, 10% CDR, 8% movement speed
Active: Removes all debuffs from target ally. 105 second cooldown. Range: 400.

This is a support/tank item that allow for active support (rather than passive aura support) and fill a currently unavailable function (cleansing an ally). The range is small so the user puts himself at risk if trying to get someone out of a really bad situation, but the movement speed helps to position yourself better.


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Splenetic

Senior Member

12-19-2010

Problem: Not enough multipliers for spell damage, making spell damage weak compared to auto-attack damage late-game.

Compendium of the Apocalypse
Needlessly Large Rod + Needlessly Large Rod + 1000g (total: 4200g)

160 Ability Power
Unique Passive: When the champion's spell deals damage to a target, there is a 25% chance for the target to take twice the usual damage.

Explanation: This is yet another attempt at making a spellcaster equivalent of the Infinity Edge, utilizing a kind of "spell crit". A caster who rushes one of these will be extremely dangerous but will lack both survivability and mana. It can also be bought late-game to boost damage in a more effective manner than stacked Archangel's staffs.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Agg View Post
There is a distinct lack of basic items. What I mean by this is that there is no Cooldown Reduction only item, there is no Spell Vamp only item. Flat Magic Pen and Armor Pen items are also lacking.
A basic movement speed item would be nice too! But magic/armor pen items are unique, so it wouldn't make sense to have a basic item for them.


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ZFjzeqgp3enl4IRT

Senior Member

12-19-2010

1) Lack of armor item not impairing offense capability of casters if purchased.

2) "Battle Mage Vest":
Hextech Revolver + Amplifiying Tome + Chain Vest + 300g
Stats:
60 armor
80 ability power
20% spell vampirism

3) Armor item with AP, moderate cost item with good cost effectiveness, armor + spell vampirism give good extra survivability against auto attackers.

==================================================

1) Lack of high AP items in comparison of the number of high AD items, lack of AP + CDR items except Deathfire's Grasp, lack of extra movement speed in casters itemization except the discutable Lich Bane.

2) "Wand of the Hurricane"
Needlessly Large Rod + Amplifying Tome + 1100g
120 ability power
Unique passive: reduces ability cooldowns by 15%, +10% movement speed
Unique active: gain 15% of movement speed in ability power for 6 seconds. Cooldown 60 seconds.

3) High AP item with cooldown reduction and extra movement speed.

==================================================

1) Lack of Xypherous's Atma's Impaler remake in League of Legends.

2) Implement it.

3) Enjoy your AD scaling caster new favorite survivability item.


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SonicTheHedgedawg

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Senior Member

12-19-2010

Why?
-Because ever scince the revamp of soulstealer, the passive of mana reward upon kill has been greatly missed by the likes of Evelyn and other mana dependent assasins/killers.
-Because high mana regen items are few. Basically just Archangel's Staff (with an innexpliccable 25 mana regen per 5 seconds from a single faerie charm + 2 upgrades)
-Because the needlessly large rod doesn't have enough upgrade options.
-Because spell vamp items are extremely limited: Spell vampirism items are limited to Will of the Ancients which is an aura item for support and Hextech Gunblade, which is exclusively for hybrids:

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Staff of Spirits:
Ingredients:
Meki Pendent x2 (390g)x2 = 780g
Needlessly Large Rod 1600g

Combining cost: 950g

Total Cost = 3330g


Stats:
+ 85 Ability Power
+ 30 mana regen per 5 seconds
Passive: +15% Spell Vampirism
UNIQUE passive: Mana reward upon champion kill.

ABOUT UNIQUE PASSIVE
there are a few options for HOW to impliment this.

1 - Gives X mana upon killing an enemy champion.
~~Pros here: Consistency and a significant mana boost upon killing an enemy champion.

2 - Gives the killer all (or X%) of the slain champion's remaining mana.
~~Pros here: possibility of a HUGE cashe of mana upon champion kill.
**Cons here: manaless champs, or champs just low on mana kill the consistency of this passive and make it nigh useless.

3 - Gives X mana upon champion Kill and Y mana upon kill assist.
~~Pros here: More reliably restores mana than option 1, isn't ruined by being killstolen and opens this item's usefullness possibilities to champions who can make use of its other stats, but are not generally champion killers.
**Cons Here: inevitably, for balance issues, if the passive is to work upon assists as well as kills, the "X" mana in this option would be considerably less than the "X" mana in option one and, therefore, would be less beneficial for assassin mages who tened to take down one target without getting many assists.

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How the problem is solved:
- Mana reward on kill is given
- high mana regen is acheived
- This item accomplishes the goal of bestowing spell vampirism to a champion who is purely magical damage but who would make little use out of an aura.
- By NOT scaling off of AP granted by other items (like zhonya's), this item has a use when it comes to early aqusition. So, finally, damage casters could start with a meki pendent and lane until they could afford a needlessly large rod, much like how phys carries can lane until they can afford a BF sword. And then quickly turn that BF sword into a high damage item for assassin mages.


Any mage assasin would love this: Evelyn, Kassadin, LeBlanc, Ryze, etc.

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ALSO, I DON'T HAVE AN IDEA FOR THIS ONE, BUT WE NEED A CHEAP ARMOUR ITEM FOR AP JUNGLERS TO COMPETE WITH MADRED'S RAZORS FOR PHYSICAL UNITS.


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Druukian

Senior Member

12-19-2010

Problem: Support Caster sometimes don't feel too useful to a team, or the teammates don't understand how useful you are. I think there should be an item that would make your character a little more active.

Amulette of the Pure
[Needlessly Large Rod + Sapphire Crystal + 500g]
+100 AP
+350 Mana.
Unique Active: Amulette of the Pure becomes Amulette of the Saint.

Amulette of the Saint
[Catalyst The Protector + Sapphire Crystal + 775g]
350 Health
350 Mana
Unique Passive: Reduces ability cooldowns by 35%.
Unique Active: Amulette of the Saint becomes Amulette of the Pure.

Explanation:
Still useful to many casters that want some spells to comeback faster by dealing less damage, healing less. But makes it possible to be offensive when you need to be.
The Catalyst in the receipe makes it so it's also useful to level with kind of like Banshee's Veil.


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Weaver2

Senior Member

12-19-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Druukian View Post
Problem: Support Caster sometimes don't feel too useful to a team, or the teammates don't understand how useful you are. I think there should be an item that would make your character a little more active.

Amulette of the Pure
[Needlessly Large Rod + Sapphire Crystal + 500g]
+100 AP
+350 Mana.
Unique Active: Amulette of the Pure becomes Amulette of the Saint.

Amulette of the Saint
[Catalyst The Protector + Sapphire Crystal + 775g]
350 Health
350 Mana
Unique Passive: Reduces ability cooldowns by 35%.
Unique Active: Amulette of the Saint becomes Amulette of the Pure.

Explanation:
Still useful to many casters that want some spells to comeback faster by dealing less damage, healing less. But makes it possible to be offensive when you need to be.
The Catalyst in the receipe makes it so it's also useful to level with kind of like Banshee's Veil.
While I don't personally like this item, I think the idea of having two "forms" the item switches between is a really cool idea so I gave you a +1.


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Splenetic

Senior Member

12-19-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Druukian View Post
Problem: Support Caster sometimes don't feel too useful to a team, or the teammates don't understand how useful you are. I think there should be an item that would make your character a little more active.

Amulette of the Pure
[Needlessly Large Rod + Sapphire Crystal + 500g]
+100 AP
+350 Mana.
Unique Active: Amulette of the Pure becomes Amulette of the Saint.

Amulette of the Saint
[Catalyst The Protector + Sapphire Crystal + 775g]
350 Health
350 Mana
Unique Passive: Reduces ability cooldowns by 35%.
Unique Active: Amulette of the Saint becomes Amulette of the Pure.

Explanation:
Still useful to many casters that want some spells to comeback faster by dealing less damage, healing less. But makes it possible to be offensive when you need to be.
The Catalyst in the receipe makes it so it's also useful to level with kind of like Banshee's Veil.
This is cool, but the cost of building it from the needlessly large rod should be lowered. Rushing a needlessly large rod is going to make you weaker early-game, as compared to rushing a catalyst.

And it would certainly be nice to have another support item, since we no longer have the locket.

Still, if you want it to be a support item, I feel like it should have auras. Auras are a support thing, while any caster can use health, AP, or cooldown reduction.