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So, let's talk about Kassadin

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chigchig

Senior Member

12-15-2010

He seems to be op because of his versatility that lets him to punish all the bad players for overextending really hard, more than anyone in the game probably.


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Lestaroth

Member

12-15-2010

Quote:
Dyonos:

This is not a QQ thread.

Anecdotal evidence aside, Kass is the hero I see Mejai's on the most (besides, perhaps, Karthus), simply because he has such godly survivability with one or two minor health items. He is almost impossible to run from, and has a silence to boot.

Tl;dr: Kass's ult too strong? How to beat him?

Sorry but this thread looks like some sort of QQ thread

What's Mejai? A snowballing game.
Playing with low level summoners people will just "do what they want" and thats why no one use ward or invisible champs looks like "overpowered". I know a lot of lv20~25 summoners who doesn't even know what's a oracle and that's why they still getting pwned by eve, teemo, shaco and twitch. If someone buy a Mejai/Leviathan and this sort of item just focus him with a good teamplay (teamplay is something that need to be worked on LoL, some people still want to fight 5 enemy champs alone) and it's done.

Each champion has something that make's him "unique" and cool to play, the ult is the most powerfull skill each one has. So every champ has something that makes him better in some tasks, if you remove or nerf Kass ult you ll destroy what make's him special and he ll go to the thrash pile of useless champions.



If people are killing you just learn how you can become better in the game instead asking in the foruns to nerf anyone who is better than you.


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Prenn

Senior Member

12-15-2010

Quote:
Dyonos:
Ok, I checked the first five or so pages and couldn't find a single thread about him, so I figured I'd make one. First things first:

This is not a QQ thread.

This is an advice/discussion thread. In the past couple of games I've been playing, I have seen a lot of Kass. The bigger thing is, I have seen a lot of Kass dominating. I know the whole thing "acquire disable, disregard assassin", but the thing is, even with disables I can just never seem to kill him with my team.

Case in point: Had a game with a Xin and Urgot on my team. Kass is out alone in our jungle, myself and Mundo go to flush him out. Get him to ult straight into Xin and Urgot. Urgot swaps him, then Xin dashes and knocks him up. while this is happening, Mundo and I are moving to get to him, while Vladmire goes to cover the obvious escape. After he gets swapped, he ults once, after he gets knocked up, he ults again. As Vlad moves in for the kill, he gets silenced, slowed, and Kass easily ults for a third time, safely escaping into their forest.

Anecdotal evidence aside, Kass is the hero I see Mejai's on the most (besides, perhaps, Karthus), simply because he has such godly survivability with one or two minor health items. He is almost impossible to run from, and has a silence to boot. To compare him to some other assassins:

Obviously, Kass is the most mobile assassin in the game, with built in slow and silence. So, I ask you, do you think his ult is too short? Perhaps a bigger penalty than increased mana cost on repeat casting? Is there some strat I'm missing that is effective for dealing with him? I'd like opinions from both Kass players and people who fight him, if possible.

Tl;dr: Kass's ult too strong? How to beat him?


I mained kassadin for awhile. I can see what your saying. Hes a very challenging champion to kill and thats probably his most possessive benefit. Outside of that he can do a lot of damage, and with soulstealer and his ult... man he can start hitting hard just because its so hard to kill him.

To be honest, over the past month all of the champions which have been nerfed as of this last patch were free to play, so I would expect kassadin to receive some type of change in the future since hes free to play right now. I think they are in the process of balancing the game, and they are trying to find the right fit for a character like kassadin (which is why he was put on hold till this last champion nerfathon). I personally love the character, and the key to playing him well is truthfully being level 30 with the correct runes. AP, Magic Pen, and most important CD reduction are a giant must have for the character. There are other rune builds which can be alright but this is definitely the way to go. Then you can start focusing on how to play him correct... which is an entirely different story.

Which then plays into his synergy. The dude is a wired balance. Hes melee (which you really dont use with AP builds), all of his moves waist his mana like its gulps of water out of a small bottle, and he has extremely low health.

Anyone with that type of rap sheet in my opinion deserves to have a utility spell like his ult and should do high damage. I personally cant say much about the direction just becuase I support the champion. Hes hard to play and in the right hands hes horrible, but in horrible hands hes easy to kill. I like that about champions like him which makes me bias over bull****.

However I can give you some tips to killing him. Shut him down early game (levels 1-5)... even call ganks if needed. The dud is a chump till level 9 or more, so cripple his gold. Make sure your getting minion mana buffs. Hes good without them, but the way his ult stacks you dont want to see a good kassadin with endless mana, and most the time when the team fights are over is when hes starting to run out of mana mid-game. This will stop his endless running (remember he has a stacking buff for like 5 seconds after using a teleport which makes his ult cost more mana). And finally save your stuns for him, specifically silences. If your team is smart you can chain stun / silence / slow him. That will get it done.

If hes getting high stacks on SS one kill will cripple his damage early through mid-game. Most important is knowing that the dude is extremely weak early game, so freaking blow him up prior to level 9. Im sure most people who play him will over extend early game because hes melee (most kassadins who are good use Q to last his creeps). Let him do it, give him a slow and kill his 600 health. If he has 3-6 deaths by level 5 hes pretty much done till late late game and thats assuming that hes going to farm his way back. Think of it this way, early game hes a melee champion with 600 health, has no escape, and a silence which hits for 200 damage which lasts 1.5 seconds (enjoy that easy kill).


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ssuubu

Senior Member

12-15-2010

Quote:
Elit3Fire:
I have to say from my experiences with Kass, with common sense you could easily never die.
Even if your early game is bad, Kassadin is one of the few champions that can recover to become godlike mid/end game.


^ this

it feels extremely easy to snowball as kass because escaping is simple, running cleanse and a BV/QSS will keep u from dying so much in team fights even if they focus u


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OpenFaceSurgery

Senior Member

12-15-2010

Okay, so this assassins escape mechanism is stronger than others. What do you propose they do to it? Higher CD? (making him useless) or somehting else?


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ledikari

Senior Member

12-16-2010

hes balance imo, if you make higher CD it will ruin him. hes a glass cannon. that it.

besides he cant use it again and again, it drains mana so fast even getting a buffed angel tear drains it drains mana fast.


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SeriousSly

Member

12-16-2010

I wanted to say something about it, but Prenn said all i would say...

Oh yes, just one more thing. If you can't chain silence/stun for 2-3sec, trying to kassadin in jungle is a bad idea. Too much walls to go through for him...


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Alithalor

Senior Member

12-16-2010

Kass is what an Assassin should be. In, burst, out. He's probably the best out of all the Assassins at this, but he either does really really really well or really really really badly. You really can't have an average Kass player. In the end it's like any Assassin, if your team is Tanky enough or have enough AoE CC he'll dye more often than not.


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Flurry

Senior Member

12-16-2010

kass too stong.. not
and by the way atm eve is the best assasin in this game and not kassa.


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Dyonos

Member

12-16-2010

Quote:
Lestaroth:
Sorry but this thread looks like some sort of QQ thread

What's Mejai? A snowballing game.
Playing with low level summoners people will just "do what they want" and thats why no one use ward or invisible champs looks like "overpowered". I know a lot of lv20~25 summoners who doesn't even know what's a oracle and that's why they still getting pwned by eve, teemo, shaco and twitch. If someone buy a Mejai/Leviathan and this sort of item just focus him with a good teamplay (teamplay is something that need to be worked on LoL, some people still want to fight 5 enemy champs alone) and it's done.

Each champion has something that make's him "unique" and cool to play, the ult is the most powerfull skill each one has. So every champ has something that makes him better in some tasks, if you remove or nerf Kass ult you ll destroy what make's him special and he ll go to the thrash pile of useless champions.



If people are killing you just learn how you can become better in the game instead asking in the foruns to nerf anyone who is better than you.


Its not a QQ thread because I'm not coming in here yelling "zomg kass killed me OP OP OP nerf nerf nerf rabble rabble", I'm saying "wow, I've seen Kass do really well in the last couple games I've played, is there something obvious I'm missing to counter him?"

From the responses, it seems tanky champions, and a few specific champs with disables seem the best way to go (luckily I know a really good Veigar). Then, of course there is the whole "don't feed him" tactic, but with the teams I've been getting lately, that seems the hardest thing to do (sup 2 teammates going 1-5 before laning phase ends).