Static Shiv vs Phantom Dancer

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The Lexer

Senior Member

10-16-2013

Which do you think is better?

I personally like shiv because of the extra dmg but is phantom dancer better because of its stats? and its passive?


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Papproni

Junior Member

10-16-2013

Depends on champ.


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BaronVonSlicey

Senior Member

10-16-2013

Anyone who wants to front-load a lot of damage (such as Caitlyn with her Headshot procs), or anyone who has high mobility to charge it up (Quinn) probably benefits from Static more, but can still buy Phantom.
Anyone who has superior late game scaling (Tristana) or can't really make use of Static's proc due to already having great wave clear (Graves) should get Phantom - but can still make good use of Static.

In the end though, its purely down to personal preference. I prefer raw stats myself - so I generally go Phantom Dancer. But some prefer the boosted damage spike - so they go Static.


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first time Vayne

Senior Member

10-18-2013

If I play a Bloodthirster AD carry like Varus or Graves, I go Shiv because it's cheaper but still gives enough attack speed to get me through the game. Then I stack the damages.

If I play an autoattack oriented carry like Cait, Vayne, Quinn, or Trist, then I go PD for the raw damage output. Yea, Cait can use the Shiv proc in tandem with her Headshot, but Headshot is only used for coordinated poke burst in lane, and when are you ever going to get Shiv in lane? It's a second item after BT/IE every time.

I especially like PD on close range carries like Vayne. Ignoring unit collision can be a big deal, but is often overlooked.

Then there's attack speed Vayne, which you build when the enemy is super tanky, on whom you get both!

On melee carries like Tryn and Fiora, though, I prefer Shiv because it gives them mixed damage and increase frontloaded burst, which can be crucial in top lane skirmishes. PD's extra stats only outshine Shiv in longer trades autoattack trades, like those put out by autoattack oriented AD carries in full team fights, where they just spam autos. If you find yourself poking, bursting, or skirmishing, which melee carries do in lane and in team fights, then Shiv is what you want.


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MrJayGoBOOM

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Member

10-21-2013

The pushing potential is huge though. I find myself buying Shiv if I look at the map and we have to push down a couple more towers, but if it's basically in the base I'll go PD for the dmg increase. Lol Math did an episode on this, you can check it out on youtube.

FOR PILTOVER! FOR PROGRESS!


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Aerothal

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Senior Member

12-14-2013

with cait i like getting an early avarice blade (after vamp scepter) for the extra cash and then shiv either right after BF sword or after BT when i did well.
I usually get PD as a late game item...


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Partholonian

Senior Member

12-15-2013

It also depends on whether your champion has a kit that interacts with movement, like Tryndamere, Quinn, and probably Yasuo.


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Aezuriel

Senior Member

12-16-2013

Raw stats aside... I tend to base this decision based on 2 things.

1. Do I have time to use Avarice blade to help me cut costs on other items?
2. What kind of team fights are we having (or do I expect to have)?

Using Avarice blade as a cost cutter is a no-brainer, but the burst on Shiv has some interesting effects on team fights. In sustained fights, Static Shiv is not as raw-awesome as Phantom Dancer, however you will find that those fights are rare (unless your comp is built for them). Much of the time, you have those awkward moments where each team dances around looking for the enemy to make a mistake, or leave an opening for a profitable engage. In these scenarios, Shiv gives a marksman a little bit of pokey-ness skin to a caster, allowing them to trade damage during stand-offs without fully committing. That kind of trade can turn the tide of a fight even before it begins, especially on a champ that can crit.

For example, think of Jinx. If you expect to be standing mostly in one spot, burning people down... PD is probably better. If you are going to be moving around alot and poking with rockets... go for Static Shiv (and yes... static powered rocket poke is freakin' awesome).


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TheJollyB

Senior Member

12-16-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by BaronVonSlicey View Post
Anyone who wants to front-load a lot of damage (such as Caitlyn with her Headshot procs), or anyone who has high mobility to charge it up (Quinn) probably benefits from Static more, but can still buy Phantom.
Anyone who has superior late game scaling (Tristana) or can't really make use of Static's proc due to already having great wave clear (Graves) should get Phantom - but can still make good use of Static.

In the end though, its purely down to personal preference. I prefer raw stats myself - so I generally go Phantom Dancer. But some prefer the boosted damage spike - so they go Static.
I'm sorry, but Graves should always be building Shiv. This item helps increase the burst of his Q + R combo; he relies a bit more on his abilities to do damage than other ADC's.