@Morello: When you consider nerfing Support Zyra. Just remember one crucial thing....

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JacksonSolo

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Senior Member

10-11-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by CreativeSavagery View Post
She should have a hidden passive with Maoki.
She already does...

I believe she has 2 or 3 actually


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montyElGato

Senior Member

10-11-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by spiderswine View Post
it depends on WHICH support,as i've said it depends on gameplay.
janna can solo lane,lulu can solo lane,zyra can solo lane,in most cases for a support to work in a solo lane it needs to have no sustain.
you need to understand something about supports,they are generally very reliable champions,lets take nunu for example.
he has no skillshots,and a ton of sustain,if he works,you will lose the lane with little you(or him) can do about it. support generally need reliablity to face other supports(it's a cycle) but out of bot lane said reliablity translates into severe lack of counter play.
this however isn't true for all supports(janna and lulu work fine as i already said).
now as i've said the tag is meaningless,it's all about the gameplay,if a support has the kit to add more varity to another lane,let him,if however it will only bring idiotic,frustrating and boring gameplay(hello nunu,soraka and taric),do not let them.
tags are meaningless,it's all about gameplay.

for example one of my most annoying period of playing this game was when taric was op and everyone knew he was op.
when i had to support i was forced to make a choice:
1)pick a champion i hate EVERYTHING about(moronic piece of faceroll garbage) and put your team in a very big advantage just by locking it.
2)pick a champion i enjoy playing and risk being in a HUGE disadvantage if the enemy picks taric,not to mention how insanely frustrating it is to lose to someone you see has no idea what skill even is,but will still win lane because he picked a moronically op champ who requires nothing more than facerolling kayboard to win lane.

I HATED THAT CHOICE,a champion with bad gameplay should never be a strong pick. riot shouldn't put people in the spot they placed me with that piece of garbage abomination.(i have heard tales release soraka was worse,but that's not the point)
No.

You've just made it apparent that you're one of those people that says stuff like, "GG. You played something OP. That's the only reason you won."

Even when someone has sustain, they are not "OP" in lane, necessarily. Malphite is annoying in lane, if you insist on playing your favorite AD top laner against him. If you play Kennen or something, he's an easy win.

Against Nunu, when he was a good laner, if you played an all-in burst assassin-type guy, you could jump on his face and kill him straight up, before he had time to heal back.

Stuff like that.

It's all about counter picks. If you insist on being able to play anything against anything, then of course your arguments will work. But if people listen to you at Riot, or people like you, it will also lead to the homogenization of all the champions, eventually to the point where everything is Garen (read: boring as **** and super-binary/ not unique in any way.)

Don't like sustain? Play against it. There ARE ways to do so.


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Cancer Fizz

Senior Member

10-11-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by montyElGato View Post
No.

You've just made it apparent that you're one of those people that says stuff like, "GG. You played something OP. That's the only reason you won."
like it or not,there's often a lot of truth in that,prenerf taric was acknowledged by everyone(including riot) to be grotesquely op.
Quote:
Originally Posted by montyElGato View Post
Even when someone has sustain, they are not "OP" in lane, necessarily. Malphite is annoying in lane, if you insist on playing your favorite AD top laner against him. If you play Kennen or something, he's an easy win.
...riot keeps saying they are against hard counters,and wins in champ select,what is so hard to understand? prenerf top nunu would insta win a large majority of matchups.
Quote:
Originally Posted by montyElGato View Post
It's all about counter picks.
riot has repeatedly stated they don't want the game to be about counter picks.


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UnderworldH4des

Senior Member

10-11-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by mertatron View Post
it is sure they will hurt mid lane zyra more than support zyra

and I only play mid lane Zyra, I don't like support Zyra
You and I are in the same boat...

Except Zyra is like one of the 4 champions I enjoy playing...well there goes another...it used to be 5...but LB fell too.


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UnderworldH4des

Senior Member

10-11-2013

Spider, no offence but....you keep saying you're a support main...So why are you basically jumping on anyone that posts here even though you don't even do as much mid zyra and it has no effect on you..?
This is primarly a mid zyra thing which morello is destroying...;s


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montyElGato

Senior Member

10-11-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by spiderswine View Post
like it or not,there's often a lot of truth in that,prenerf taric was acknowledged by everyone(including riot) to be grotesquely op.
...riot keeps saying they are against hard counters,and wins in champ select,what is so hard to understand? prenerf top nunu would insta win a large majority of matchups.
riot has repeatedly stated they don't want the game to be about counter picks.
I'm not talking about what Riot has previously said, I'm talking about how to make the game better.

Without counter picks being very important, the only possible road leads to every champion being slowly homogenized, until everything is basically the same 4 abilities on 116+ different champions with different particle effects.

If you don't want that, then counter picks will be important.

Your general line of reasoning is of the same kind as that of people who rage and QQ every time a "unique" champion exists. Thresh, Elise, etc. Anything that's not really basic and stuff gets complained about.

Nunu top might have destroyed lots of stuff, but so does stuff that exists now, like Malphite top and Kennen top. (Kennen is a brutal counter to most wannabe melee guys that think they're gonna "carry" with their dumb Garen or Darius or Malphite picks.)

Pfffff....

You are the kind of person that pushes for the game to become more STALE.

And saying "Riot has said..." doesn't make that any less true. Maybe Riot will make the game stale. I hope they don't; I hope they don't listen to people like you.

"QQQQ It's OP! OP! OP! I can't use my favorite champion against it and win! WHAT!? Counter-pick!?!? But I don't wannnnnnnt tooooooooo!!!!!!!! Aaaaaaahhhh QQQQQ!"


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Cancer Fizz

Senior Member

10-11-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by UnderworldH4des View Post
Spider, no offence but....you keep saying you're a support main...So why are you basically jumping on anyone that posts here even though you don't even do as much mid zyra and it has no effect on you..?
This is primarly a mid zyra thing which morello is destroying...;s
support zyra is 70%(a neat approximation) her ult,which is getting a heavy nerf.
they are both getting nerfed hard.


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Cancer Fizz

Senior Member

10-11-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by montyElGato View Post
I'm not talking about what Riot has previously said, I'm talking about how to make the game better.

Without counter picks being very important, the only possible road leads to every champion being slowly homogenized, until everything is basically the same 4 abilities on 116+ different champions with different particle effects.

If you don't want that, then counter picks will be important.

Your general line of reasoning is of the same kind as that of people who rage and QQ every time a "unique" champion exists. Thresh, Elise, etc. Anything that's not really basic and stuff gets complained about.

Nunu top might have destroyed lots of stuff, but so does stuff that exists now, like Malphite top and Kennen top. (Kennen is a brutal counter to most wannabe melee guys that think they're gonna "carry" with their dumb Garen or Darius or Malphite picks.)

Pfffff....

You are the kind of person that pushes for the game to become more STALE.

And saying "Riot has said..." doesn't make that any less true. Maybe Riot will make the game stale. I hope they don't; I hope they don't listen to people like you.

"QQQQ It's OP! OP! OP! I can't use my favorite champion against it and win! WHAT!? Counter-pick!?!? But I don't wannnnnnnt tooooooooo!!!!!!!! Aaaaaaahhhh QQQQQ!"
say what you want,outside of midlane there aren't many hard counter matchups.


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UnderworldH4des

Senior Member

10-11-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by spiderswine View Post
support zyra is 70%(a neat approximation) her ult,which is getting a heavy nerf.
they are both getting nerfed hard.
Because she wasn't made as support, was intended for mid, I also get it's wrong to nerf her support instead of making other supports better, but lets face it....zyra support will get nerfed no matter what...we just don't want her mid to be destroyed...which is EXACTLY what is happening...

fk you morello e.e


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Cancer Fizz

Senior Member

10-11-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by UnderworldH4des View Post
Because she wasn't made as support, was intended for mid, I also get it's wrong to nerf her support instead of making other supports better, but lets face it....zyra support will get nerfed no matter what...we just don't want her mid to be destroyed...which is EXACTLY what is happening...

fk you morello e.e
look if you would take the time,instead of listening to GD idiots,you would see her pick+ban rate in the competitive scene is on par with sona and thresh,her winrate and pickrate in soloq are lower than sona,whilst her banrate is lower than threshs.
she isn't op anywhere.