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Why shouldn't energy champs get the full benefit from cdr?

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FierCat

Junior Member

08-24-2013

Edit: If you just want the math, look at my post on page two, I feel that it explains it better.

Cdr seems very good for most energy champions.. until you get to max cdr. With Shen (for example) this isn't hard at all, spirit visage and frozen heart are both easy choices (depending on enemy team), and the last cdr item could be a blue pot, a stinger, or etcetera. But theres just no way for an energy champion to fully utilize full cdr, taunt for example costs way too much (without hitting 2+) and even just using feint every time it is up will use all his energy (50 energy every 3 seconds).

I am not saying that energy based champions should get an easy source of energy regen.. but rather I am asking why shouldn't they get the full benefit from stacking cdr, like every other champion? Oriana and Lux for example, can spam constantly at every stage of the game without going OOM (they almost always get blue buff, and even without it, a chalice is enough). Health based champions like Vlad laugh at the costs of spamming abilities so don't tell me its because energy based champions would spam too much.

Edit: My best idea for increasing energy regen, would to have the champion's passive ability to get energy back scale off of cdr. However, technically Akali's q's energy return already scales from cdr.

Other ideas: For example, 10% cdr could give energy based champions 2 to 10 energy per 5. 40 regen per 5 might be too high (almost double base value at 40%), but even just 10 per 5 (at 40%) would still allow energy users to have more leeway late game in team fights. Or cdr items could each have their own energy regen value. Afterall.. you could think of energy as a global skill cooldown, that is being reduced.

Another suggestion would be to give a slight buff to energy regen per level, maybe so that energy users have less energy early, and more later. Which could mean they can't spam as much in lane. Finally, there could be a 'yellow' pot that gave a small boost to energy regen per level (it could scale with cdr as well), along with some base energy. This should be balanced to be worthless, until later in the game with several decent items.

This could also be seen as a slight buff to energy users late game, and an opportunity for a possible nerf to their early game, since they are a bit strong early anyways. Thank you for your time.


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MarhsallLee67

Senior Member

08-24-2013

last I checked, CDR only effects cooldowns on your abilities, not mana regen.


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Overlord Heian

Member

08-24-2013

Shen.

Frozen Heart.

Well you're going to need all that extra mana.


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FierCat

Junior Member

08-24-2013

Quote:
MarhsallLee67:
last I checked, CDR only effects cooldowns on your abilities, not mana regen.

This is a question about balance, and I just don't see why energy champions shouldn't be able to effectively use full cdr, with 10 or 20% cdr they work fine. And just because cdr doesn't currently affect mana regen, doesn't mean it couldn't be changed (besides there is a very popular cdr item that covers all mana costs..). Besides, there are other ways to buff their energy regen, and I would prefer the discussion to be about whether or not these champions would break if they had more energy.

Quote:
Overlord Heian:
Shen.

Frozen Heart.

Well you're going to need all that extra mana.


Thats my point, there are times when frozen heart's passive might be better against their team than randuin's passive.. so why should all those extra stats be effectively wasted? Doesn't this just make it worse on Shen for .. no reason at all? If you have more than 20% cdr, from theory anyways, energy champs will go OOM(E) way to fast, and the stat is wasted most of the time. So if you are using more than one ability to poke, or in any fight longer than a few seconds you aren't benefiting from the cdr.

I'm arguing that if an energy champ had any extra source of energy.. at all, then 40% cdr might actually be viable on such champions. I know they have passive abilities for extra energy, but these are balanced for no cdr. Maybe those could scale off of cdr instead?


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Whoa There Betsy

Senior Member

08-24-2013

You're a just a bucket of stupid OP.


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Conail

Senior Member

08-25-2013

Quote:
whoa there betsy:
you're a just a bucket of stupid op.


lol


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Fiveofswords

Senior Member

08-25-2013

energy champs do get full benefit from cdr.

I don't play orianna but lux totally cannot spam unless she has both blue and athenes


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MarhsallLee67

Senior Member

08-25-2013

Quote:
FierCat:
And just because cdr doesn't currently affect mana regen, doesn't mean it couldn't be changed

...

what.

...

I can't.

...

just.

._.


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acrid56

Senior Member

08-25-2013

Quote:
Fiveofswords:
energy champs do get full benefit from cdr.

I don't play orianna but lux totally cannot spam unless she has both blue and athenes


and hes a senior member -_-


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ViolenceFreak

Member

08-25-2013

how are you in silver? this seems like complete bronze logic. youre argument has so many flaws and the examples dont even warrant a reason for those. and CDR doesnt affect mana regen. Sure there are items that have both cdr and mana regen but energy champs dont need any regen and they can still use cdr.


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