Trundle Item Build Discussion

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Griefherald

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Senior Member

12-02-2010

Liking Frozen Mallet + Atma's+Zeal thus far.


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Dianetics

Senior Member

12-02-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Krshna View Post
Make sure you don't waste your money on a Rageblade since he doesn't use AP. He has one ability that even has AP scaling, and it's on the measly amount of damage tacked on to his ultimate. In general, I'm telling you guys, this whole Sheen/Triforce thing is a bad idea.

It's cute. It's a cute little trick getting the damage proc. But remember, you are tanky dps, in that order. Early he gets Blue Buff (if you're not jungling, you're doing it wrong), and late his runes mana regen for him.

So you're wasting Gold on mana. You're wasting gold on AP. But, you did get a proc out of it? Worth it in the long run? No.

You have to open with a Wriggle's on him, it's just too perfect, and for a solid amount of you out there who aren't buying 10+ wards a game (tsk-tsk), it has a built in ward for you to use every three minutes you don't need to delay your later items buying wards.

The main thing that's really bad about rushing Sheen, and then rushing straight to Triforce after boots... where's your survibility coming from? You get crit, which you don't need. You get attack speed which is good. You get health and mana, but not much of either. You get some damage which is good, you get some AP which is useless. And you get the proc.

This item, is one of the most expensive items in the game. You just took your whole savings from the whole game so far, and you put it into an item where half of the stats on it do not benefit Trundle (AP), or aren't necessary (the mana, the crit).

Put your hard earned gold into an item that synergizes with and benefits Trundle. Probably a Frozen Mallet.
Trundle is an excellent laner. He can jungle sure but much like Gragas he can lane and he can jungle equally well.


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Krshna

Senior Member

12-02-2010

"Is it just me or does everyone totally ignore the part where Q resets auto attack timer, during a teamfight or with a fair amount of aspd?"

People might ignore it, I don't know, but being able to effectively use his reset is one of the main things you need to be doing on Trundle. Do NOT use this ability on cooldown. Don't spam it. You will see a major increase in overall damage if you hit Q RIGHT after you land an auto attack. Forget Sheen, this is a built in Sheen haha.

Especially when jungling, this is very important. You will take a lot less damage from the neutrals due to killing them faster, and you will be ready to gank sooner (although ever so slightly). Always hit Q right after an auto attack, and even let Q sit on cooldown for a moment to let the next autoattack land if your autos and the skill coming off cooldown didn't line up perfectly.

"Trundle is an excellent laner. He can jungle sure but much like Gragas he can lane and he can jungle equally well."

This is true, but he should never lane at the expense of jungling. Too many times today, I saw a laning Trundle on the enemy team when the team had no jungle at all. People need to understand two things in this game haha... you need a jungler, and buy as many wards as you can, they pay for themselves.

Whether it's Malphite, Irelia, Shen, Trundle, hell even Twitch (I swear I've seen jungle twitch succeed lol, and it's very dangerous because he's always MIA, so you never have the "twitch just stealthed, I'm backing off" moment that saves you so often), you need to jungle if your champ can do it, and no one else on the team is doing it.

I played a game today as Malzahar, and I had a Tryndamere, an Irelia and a Malphite on the team, and we had no jungler....


Besides that, the main reason I wouldn't play Trundle if I had to lane with him is I don't lane with any melee champions who don't have a ranged damage ability. It's far too easy for two ranged champs to zone you back to your tower while the creep wave is in the middle of the lane, denying you last hits and experience. Versus some champions as a melee, you can't even approach the creep line. Think of laning as a melee with no ranged ability vs. say Kassadin. That's not going to go well.

An example of melee champs I would lane with, would be Shen or Pantheon. If your lane opponents are very aggressive and are good at zoning you out, you can still get last hits with Vorpal Blade or Spear Shot.

The next level of melee champ in lane, is one that has no ranged ability, but does have a farm abillity. Say Master Yi, (although I would never recommend playing Master Yi, this is just an example). Even if he can't last hit in the middle of the lane, when the lane is pushed to his tower, he can Alpha Strike, getting last hits.

Melee that have no ranged attack, and no farm ability (an ability that deals enough AoE damage to insta-clear or at least devastate a creep wave), should not lane.

Maybe you did ok with Trundle in lane today. But if you are against a Kassadin and a Vlad in your lane, you won't be able to approach the creep line, and when they push the lane to your tower, you won't be able to last hit all of those creeps either, (you'll get a few the traditional way).

Trundle in my opinion belongs in the jungle. Another example of a similar case is Warwick. Why does Warwick never lane? Because he has no ranged ability to last hit mobs, and he has no farm ability to get the last hits at his tower. Those two things together equal low CS which in turn equals you sucking.


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Rayre

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Senior Member

12-02-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Krshna View Post
Make sure you don't waste your money on a Rageblade since he doesn't use AP. He has one ability that even has AP scaling, and it's on the measly amount of damage tacked on to his ultimate. In general, I'm telling you guys, this whole Sheen/Triforce thing is a bad idea.

It's cute. It's a cute little trick getting the damage proc. But remember, you are tanky dps, in that order. Early he gets Blue Buff (if you're not jungling, you're doing it wrong), and late his runes mana regen for him.

So you're wasting Gold on mana. You're wasting gold on AP. But, you did get a proc out of it? Worth it in the long run? No.

You have to open with a Wriggle's on him, it's just too perfect, and for a solid amount of you out there who aren't buying 10+ wards a game (tsk-tsk), it has a built in ward for you to use every three minutes you don't need to delay your later items buying wards.

The main thing that's really bad about rushing Sheen, and then rushing straight to Triforce after boots... where's your survibility coming from? You get crit, which you don't need. You get attack speed which is good. You get health and mana, but not much of either. You get some damage which is good, you get some AP which is useless. And you get the proc.

This item, is one of the most expensive items in the game. You just took your whole savings from the whole game so far, and you put it into an item where half of the stats on it do not benefit Trundle (AP), or aren't necessary (the mana, the crit).

Put your hard earned gold into an item that synergizes with and benefits Trundle. Probably a Frozen Mallet.

edit: And remember, he is moreso tank than DPS. He is NOT a tank. But he is also not a DPS carry. He is somewhere in between, leaning further towards tank. You shouldn't be worrying about getting lots of damage items on him. Like Garen/Mordekaiser, and other tanky DPS champions, they have low scaling but high base damage. This is to make up for the fact that they will have to buy defensive items. Ranged carries would be balanced differently if it was assumed that their first major item might be a Sunfire Cape. They design these champions to do high base dmg, so that they can build the defensive items they need, and still be able to compete offensively. To compensate for this, they don't scale extremely well with items.

Trundle is not a carry. People who are building Black Cleavers, Infinity Edge, whatever other weird builds I've been seeing, if you want thay kind of champ, there are a ton of Melee carries who will excel with those items. But why choose Trundle to do that job, when he won't do it half as well as someone else. His job isn't to wipe the enemy team.

Trundle has a few aspects to his role. He is a soak. He is a disruptor. He controls the action on the battlefield without dealing massive damage. With Merc Treads and his W, he is nearly un-CCable. His main contributions to a team are his pillar and his ultimate. And his ability to jungle, freeing up another solo lane. Since his main utility lies in a damageless Slow/Wall and a low damage ultimate that makes its target very squishy while making Trundle very beefy, focus on survivability and cooldown reduction. These two things will enable you to constantly annoy the enemy team while supporting yours.

TLDR: If you want to build Madred's Bloodrazers/Black Cleaver/Bloodthirster etc., play a Melee Carry.
+1 for you good sir will try him out ur way


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Rayre

This user has referred a friend to League of Legends, click for more information

Senior Member

12-02-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Krshna View Post
"Is it just me or does everyone totally ignore the part where Q resets auto attack timer, during a teamfight or with a fair amount of aspd?"

People might ignore it, I don't know, but being able to effectively use his reset is one of the main things you need to be doing on Trundle. Do NOT use this ability on cooldown. Don't spam it. You will see a major increase in overall damage if you hit Q RIGHT after you land an auto attack. Forget Sheen, this is a built in Sheen haha.

Especially when jungling, this is very important. You will take a lot less damage from the neutrals due to killing them faster, and you will be ready to gank sooner (although ever so slightly). Always hit Q right after an auto attack, and even let Q sit on cooldown for a moment to let the next autoattack land if your autos and the skill coming off cooldown didn't line up perfectly.

"Trundle is an excellent laner. He can jungle sure but much like Gragas he can lane and he can jungle equally well."

This is true, but he should never lane at the expense of jungling. Too many times today, I saw a laning Trundle on the enemy team when the team had no jungle at all. People need to understand two things in this game haha... you need a jungler, and buy as many wards as you can, they pay for themselves.

Whether it's Malphite, Irelia, Shen, Trundle, hell even Twitch (I swear I've seen jungle twitch succeed lol, and it's very dangerous because he's always MIA, so you never have the "twitch just stealthed, I'm backing off" moment that saves you so often), you need to jungle if your champ can do it, and no one else on the team is doing it.

I played a game today as Malzahar, and I had a Tryndamere, an Irelia and a Malphite on the team, and we had no jungler....


Besides that, the main reason I wouldn't play Trundle if I had to lane with him is I don't lane with any melee champions who don't have a ranged damage ability. It's far too easy for two ranged champs to zone you back to your tower while the creep wave is in the middle of the lane, denying you last hits and experience. Versus some champions as a melee, you can't even approach the creep line. Think of laning as a melee with no ranged ability vs. say Kassadin. That's not going to go well.

An example of melee champs I would lane with, would be Shen or Pantheon. If your lane opponents are very aggressive and are good at zoning you out, you can still get last hits with Vorpal Blade or Spear Shot.

The next level of melee champ in lane, is one that has no ranged ability, but does have a farm abillity. Say Master Yi, (although I would never recommend playing Master Yi, this is just an example). Even if he can't last hit in the middle of the lane, when the lane is pushed to his tower, he can Alpha Strike, getting last hits.

Melee that have no ranged attack, and no farm ability (an ability that deals enough AoE damage to insta-clear or at least devastate a creep wave), should not lane.

Maybe you did ok with Trundle in lane today. But if you are against a Kassadin and a Vlad in your lane, you won't be able to approach the creep line, and when they push the lane to your tower, you won't be able to last hit all of those creeps either, (you'll get a few the traditional way).

Trundle in my opinion belongs in the jungle. Another example of a similar case is Warwick. Why does Warwick never lane? Because he has no ranged ability to last hit mobs, and he has no farm ability to get the last hits at his tower. Those two things together equal low CS which in turn equals you sucking.
where is the +10 button.


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MagicChicken

Senior Member

12-02-2010

I kinda wonder if he'd be good for a tnk build? SV, 3 sunfires and a FoN?


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pen0r

Senior Member

12-02-2010

so on a scale of 1 to 10 how would you put trundle?

because I have yet to see the first one that doesn't ragequit after 10 mins because (s)he plays him wrong..... and before I waste points for nothing again........


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Krshna

Senior Member

12-02-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by pen0r View Post
so on a scale of 1 to 10 how would you put trundle?

because I have yet to see the first one that doesn't ragequit after 10 mins because (s)he plays him wrong..... and before I waste points for nothing again........
Hrm, tough question, since I don't have any precedent for that kind of rating since I've never done it before. I'm going to dodge that question but answer it in a different way.

I have been burned by Urgot (I bought the double bundle...). I was burned by Swain, Lux and all of those recently (although those two got buffed into semi-usefulness eventually).

Trundle is not one of those champions. He is effective, he is fun to play. Using his pillar is really fun, and it's a great tool. His ultimate is thankless, no one will notice it, it probably won't get you a kill, but it will really beef you up and it will get the team a kill, it will definitely turn into an assist on cast, if used properly in a teamfight.

I think any champion that can jungle effectively is a good champion because it is a role that sometimes goes unfilled. That fact that he is tanky as well, is a double whammy of awesomeness.

I guess I would rate him so far a 7.5 or 8/10. He's not Annie or Galio or anything. You're not going to instantly pick him up and wipe up the other team. But he is very useful within his role, (soak/support/disrupt), and puts out higher than average DPS for a tanky support champion.


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Krshna

Senior Member

12-02-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by MagicChicken View Post
I kinda wonder if he'd be good for a tnk build? SV, 3 sunfires and a FoN?
Probably would work wonders at low Elo, where walking towards someone is about equal to a taunt. But against competent teams, if you build that tanky, they have no reason to attack you. Then can just ignore you, because you do no damage, have no hard CC, you aren't a threat.

With that build.


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TheDomination

Junior Member

12-02-2010

Triforce is extremely underwhelming on Trundle. And, its ridiculously expensive. Trundle is a tank killer and a support/carry disabler, end of story. If you build him as an ad carry or an ad/ap hybrid you arent using him to his full potential and you should probably just go buy kog maw or something.

The build that I have been doing (and havent lost with yet) is:

usually I will 2v1 top because Trundle is just too good at 2v1 lane (also, despite what phreak says, trundle is a dog**** jungler, just throwing that out there). But, if there is no jungler, hes a sidelane hero.

Against a lane with disables, rushing merc treads and leveling up your W early makes for some major lols. You are unkillable early game if you play it right (and you can keep up on cs easily. Just W before you run in to last hit). If you have an easy lane, id just get a rank1 boots, 2 hp pots, a couple wards, and whatever I could get of Phage on my first trip back.
Frozen mallet on Trundle is super imba. It makes him tanky and makes his already ridiculous chasing power even better. yaay frozen mallet.
Then (9/10 times) ill end up going for a madreds, while keeping your lane/dragon (if youre bot) or your lane/tribush (if youre top and have already killed 1st tower, otherwise just lane bush) warded as much as possible. You arent a carry, your power IS your abilities, NOT in beefing the ever living bajeezus out of them with 400 bloodthirsters. You can afford to spend the gold to help your team out. If for some reason you dont get madreds (you pretty much will every game, a 5v5 team without a tank/tanky dps is basically nonexistant), well I dont really know what to tell you...I havent had this problem yet.
ANYWAY. After madreds, if the enemy team has melee fast attack champs like Yi or Trynd, I'll build a Randuins omen. If theyre nuking your team down with AP bursters, ill get a banshee's veil. HOWEVER, if your team is going strong and has the upper hand, I have found that getting a Guardian Angel after you get madreds/frozen mallet works very well. People will basically stop targeting you when you have a GA and will leave you free to terrorize their team with pillars, slows, an ult on their tank, and constant Qs on their strongest AD carry (if they have one). ITS GOOD TIMES MON. You will win more team fights this way and will end the game faster...so you can grind more IP/rating. woot on that.
This is pretty much what has worked for me as trundle build wise.

For Runes, I run Armor Pen marks, Mana regen/lvl Seals, CDR Glyphs, and Flat HP quints (you get focused a lot in team fights).
For masteries, I have found that a 0/9/21 Build (nimbleness in def tree) with either Ghost/Flash, Ghost/Ignite, or Flash/Ignite (personal preference/situational, I prefer Ghost/Flash, but when Flash gets removed ill be running Ghost/Ignite) for my summoners.

As far as people getting spirit visage goes, if you do the math its really REALLY not worth the gold. You can either
a) rush spirit visage for 1260ish gold
OR
b) buy a phage towards your frozen mallet.
Let me explain why option b is better.

Your passive starts out at 2% health regened per enemy dying, maxing out at 6% at level 18.
Now, unless im doing it wrong, spirit visage reads as giving a 20% bonus to regen/healing effects, (you essentially gain 1% on your passive every 2 levels) meaning that at LEVEL 18 you will be regenning an extra 20% OF 6%, which is 1.2%. AND THATS AT LEVEL 18. By that time, the regen wont even matter, because trundles passive is STRONGEST early game. He is almost impossible to push out of a lane early, (another reason why Id rather have a trundle lane than jungle). Sure, the CDR is nice, and the MR adds to his tanky-ness, but the hp on Phage makes him even tankier, and rushing frozen mallet has proven (in my limited experience as trundle thus far considering how long hes been out) to be deadly in the early mid game as well as the mid game.

TL;DR get Phage, not Spirit Vis