A Wild Knifecat Appears! (Rengar Discussion)

First Riot Post
Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

ParkKingLot

Junior Member

09-28-2013

Poor guy dropping his heart and soul to make this champ viable and I get to the bottom of X amount of posts and its "-245." I think you are doing a great job Scarizard, and stealth doesn't matter. Make the game better, not fulfill peoples AVP fantasies.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Arctic Bro

Member

09-28-2013

omg this thread is monster to keep up with
do anything you want with Rengar already I give up on catching up here


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

PlasmaWreck

Junior Member

09-30-2013

*Tumbleweed... * Rengar jumps from tumbleweed MOBILE BUSH SUKAS


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Parapsychology

Member

10-01-2013

Quoted by Scarizard
- "Rengar's 500% AD triple-q-in-less-than-a-second doesn't make me feel clever, or like i'm outplaying anyone - it just makes me feel like i'm subverting gameplay in a way that makes our game more dry as a whole."

500% ad in less than a second? I've been playing Rengar for 8 months or so and I have never been able to get 500% of ad off in less than a second. Even if Rengar players could, what is wrong with that? After the first burst, Rengar becomes extremely weak for a few seconds(Spells on cooldown and ferocity is low).

Webster's Dictionary defines assassin as: 1. One who murders by surprise attack, especially one who carries out a plot to kill a prominent person.

Look at champions like leblanc who can 100-0 People, Fizz can too, oh and then there's that one.. see where I'm going with this? If you are going to redesign a champion just based on the fact that he can instantly kill someone (when fed) is just absurd, redesign Fizz and Leblanc then too. The cooldown on his ultimate is laughable. Try having a Rengar who is 1-1 standard farm, instagib the ADC. NOt gonna happen. He only becomes scary when he's fed.

As for the early level 2-3 Strength of Rengar; why change this? He has some of the worst base scaling in the game. He needs an early game to make up for his weak late game.

Maybe I'm missing something, but to me, Rengar is VERY balanced. Squishy and Bursty, just the way I like my assassins.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Radosmoi

Junior Member

10-02-2013

I think the bonetooth necklace should be a buff, when you buy it, it goes into your "buff section" instead of your item section,
since not much people actually buy it, or at least give it moar stats, maybe rengar gains 0.3 ad for each minion/monster he kills,
this encourages people to actually buy it, and also increases the amount of people playing jungle rengar.

they should also make the normal bola root, the ferocity bola should also inflict a mark (that only rengar can see) which when rengar strikes the target with a mark deals extra damage, his ult should mark every enemy on the battlefield, so when rengar jumps on someone, increases rengar burst.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

RadiantWings

This user has referred a friend to League of Legends, click for more information

Senior Member

10-02-2013

Aspd increases work by altering a character's base attack speed. Rengar has a base attack speed of .679. Savagery's 100% (max rank) aspd bonus for 4 seconds means that it averages out to an average 2.7 AD scaling for a total of 4.7 AD assuming Rengar AA's the entire time.

Assuming that Empowered Savagery deals the same %damage as it does now (200%) and given that each point of Ferocity is worth 1/5th of an empowered Savagery and that the new Empowered Savagery grants 3 Ferocity, the new Empowered Savagery now has an effective 3.2 AD ratio.

3.2/4.7 = .68 (rounded down
1 - .68 = .32

In terms of sustained damage, the new Empowered Savagery is now 32% worse than the current Empowered Savagery.


Rengar has however improved is in his burst (surprise!) because of the Savagery chains. If anyone survives his burst, he is worse off than before.

The best case burst scenario (which I'm assuming he's now being balanced around)is where Rengar has all the prep time in the world and knows where you are before he ults. He first activates Q2 then ults and pounces exactly 1.5 seconds later. He chains another Q2 on top of normal Q and in .75 seconds he Q2's again. In this time he hits W and E simultaneously and Q2s again. Finally, 1.5 seconds later, he Q2s again.

He can get off 5 empowered Q's in less than 2.25 seconds + 1 normal Q + E (let's say 1.0 new ratio) for a total of 1200% AD in damage. This is assuming the target doesn't do anything to Rengar in the meantime. If he eschews the last Empowered Q and times his jump so that he gains Ferocity just after the second Q, he can theoretically put 1000% AD in less than a second.

However from stealth or if he uses his ult for movement speed, without that Ferocity gen, he'll lose not 2 but 3 Q2s from his combo, doing only 600% AD damage (His current form doing 672% AD in 4 seconds)


In lane, the only chance people have to fight/escape him is by interrupting his Q combo (dashing away, stuns.) However, if you lack the means to kill Rengar in slightly less than 4 seconds, any time you waste a dash/stun while Rengar is at max Ferocity gives him the opportunity to pull off his 4 second death combo.

There's also the fact that Rengar can stealth after the Ferocity has been generated, allowing him to wait for his cooldowns. Assuming Rengar builds tanky enough (for both him and his opponent to survive), he then moves on to Death combo Beta. 3.6-5 seconds (depending on his CDR minimum 17% required) after Death combo Alpha he will tag you with Q and stealth. 5 seconds later, all of his cooldowns will have reset and he will combo you with 2 Q2s and finish you off.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Torrence

Junior Member

10-02-2013

Hello my friends. I am a Rengar fan and although I am not that good with him I can tell you that the best part of his skill set for me was the versatility he gained whenever he was in brush or in stealth (i.e super cast range bola for ultra harass, best disengage NA, jumping to minions for the clutch maneuvers etc.). It is safe to say that at the moment Rengar has the strongest stealth in the game but I don't think he actually needs a stealth in order to be effective (Just keep reading). Therefore I propose the following idea for remaking his ultimate:
Thrill of the Hunt
Upon activation, Rengar consumes all Fury and gains 30%/45%/60% movement speed, 1 Ferocity generation per second, and vision in all brush areas in a 3000/4000/5000 range around him for 5 seconds +1 second for every Ferocity consumed. If he is able to successfully reveal a champion then he can cast a sub-ability:
Forestation
Rengar summons a large thicket of brush in a 200/350/500 AOE at his target location. The brush will remain there for 10 seconds and Rengar will have vision of all targets in the brush for the entire duration.
I know its kind of strange but I think it will help his teammates who benefit from being in a brush (i.e. Caitlyn) and make Rengar not just an assassin but also a teamfighter. Tell me what you think and thanks for reading!


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Pirrian

Junior Member

10-04-2013

Heeeeey, reading main post without Scrolling through all 400 pages, so my apologies if I step on anyone's toes.

But I just wanna throw out an Idea that Sparked while reading comments on the Wiki Rengar Page. Basically, It was the image of Rengar killing a foe, then for a short amount of time, all basic attacks would leap. ALL of them. Blood frenzy of the Jungle King.

Perhaps if you get a kill within x amount of time after activating your ult?

Please note that this is a HIGHLY unrefined idea that may have been stated before, and I might not revisit it because I desperately need to work on art to throw on here. (as part of a thingy)

Anywho, my last comments will be of how awesome it is to actually be able to see and provide feedback for a game- especially one that is neat and has the ability to input new content really easily.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Javvek

Senior Member

10-04-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by DontChangeRengar View Post
I was originally for these changes but now it just seems only for the pure intention of nerfing and I have changed my stance. The only thing I see being a solid buff is the Bola Strike change but even that is going to be blocked by creeps. Bonetooth changes are buffs for the jungle but nerfs for lane. All the rest of the abilities are receiving damage / utility reduction.

I really want riot to either scrap the change or start over and do it better - not bland out and nerf and call it a rework

Make q a bleed, attack damage up front, %50 ATDam over 5 seconds - empowered 100% ATDam up front - 150% over 3 seconds

Battle roar, make armor and MR scaled based on champions hit, with 5 champions bring rengar up to 75% reduction and zero / one champion as current is. -
Empowered ability does half current heal but gives large health regen for 6 seconds - based on max hp but scales less with higher hp pools

Bola changes proposed are okay, obviously well thought out and brings spice to the mix maybe with the root allows rengar to leap to the target outside brush

I agree that his ult is toxic currently. Many times have I been abused for the ult. I like the changes with this. But it shouldn't just do one leap and be over. for the 15seconds it needs to allow leaping (champions only) give sight and movement speed (stealth only available out of combat)

If these were the kind of things we saw with the test phase of the rework I'd be much more pleased at riots creativity. Not this 'Nerf by rework' design they are now implementing and applying to Rengar as the kids mum's band aid for those who cannot deal with him
You... you are a brilliant brilliant man. Signed in to upvote and quote. Thank you very much.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

DJTxNorrathx

Junior Member

10-04-2013

Honestly, I love Rengar and want him to be fun. He either insta-gibs a char or is useless, just tossing out a bola every once and awhile. I'm excited to see what they come up with.

Just make him fun to play.