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A Wild Knifecat Appears! (Rengar Discussion)

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X SkeletonCandy:
lol They got rid of his escape, his damage, his initiate, and his fun.

Nice one, Riot.

Fly or Die23:
Is it me or did they completely alter his identity? I bought him because I want to play a stealth stalker to pick off out of position people and blow up squishies.

Without a stealth from TOTH it really homogenizes him. He loses the fun flavor that most people I wager bought him for and now he is just a half-a$$ed bruiser half-a$$ed assassin with no hard CC.

I have yet to see it in action so I can't say, "OMG HUGE NERF OLAF STATUS!" But the removal of stealth= snorefest.

Just a couple quotes from another thread that I borrowed. First one sums up this "rework" perfectly, and the second just points out the problems.

You ruined a top laner. He's now entirely melee, except a bull**** skillshot that will probably hit creeps. You're not going to be able to lane versus anything except another melee. A lot of fun that'll be. And all because you wanted him to be turned into a jungler. What, 40% of people play him as a jungle, according to some post above mine?

Why even start a thread and ask for feedback if you just ignore it? Rengar has been homogenized, as is the case with every unique champion in this game. Did you honestly change Rengar because he could blow people up from stealth? Oh boy, not like we've seen any other assassins gutted before.. So much ad carry love..

Throw me into the group that really dislikes these changes.

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Lunar Lightning

Senior Member


Rastamon Ganja:
Summoners pick up the pitchforks. Don't let this thread die. Start other threads. Those that normally don't post, please post and show that you hate the new Rengar changes and what you would actually like to see in the rework.

If enough people express their thoughts and disapproval for this Rengar rework, nay, Rengar Massacre, Riot will do what the players want

Remember when SGU did not have death animations and everyone in GD expressed their disappointment? surprise surprise, Riot did what the players wanted.

Riot please listen to the communities voice/thoughts/concerns about this Rengar Massacre. You already know how Scarizard murdered Karma. Please do not let him do that to Rengar. Karma was just reworked and she is again on the list to be reworked/new lore etc. Scarizard drained karma of all her uniqueness and now she is just another brick in the wall. and a ****ty crumbling brick at that. add enough of those bricks and the wall will collapse.

Rengar is unique because of his ultimate stealth ability. Why are you trying to maker Rengar only a Jungler? Why give him a skill shot? Is he a marksman or a mage? then why does he need a skillshot? Lets take a great and unique champ like Rengar and force him into Scarizard's bland cookie cutter champion rework. He does need an update/slight rework but not a massacre.

What is up with the massive increase in movement speed instead of the bola slow? Same goes for the tri force/phage nerf? why take away the slow and add movement speed?

I wish Xelanth or someone else was working on this rework where they actually listen to suggestions and concerns of the players in the threads and try to compromise and understand what the players cherish like/dislike about a certain champs kit/abilities etc. This whole thread was a fluke. Players in the community clearly stated what they like/disliked, what they though was unique about rengar/his gameplay/ his kit, but Scarizard basically just said:

"yeah, we already know what we are going to do with Rengar, were gonna do this and this, and we tested him, thanks for your input GD but we are not gonna take any of your suggestions and concerns into consideration because we do not want any champs to have unique aspects..."

Please let others see this so that they can get involved and help keep Rengar from being butchered/massacred like karma. I don't care if you downvote me or whatever it takes as long as everyone voices their disappointment and concerns about this "rework"



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Samuel L Jaxx

Senior Member


You sound like a VERY dumb person. Rengar actually is a jungler.

Except.......jungler isnt a tag now.

It's a position, not a role.

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Senior Member


Well I'd also just like to add, I've played with scarizard before and he went rengar top. he just started doran's blade and just repeatedly all inned everything in sight mashing Q. and I think he's projecting what he likes about rengar onto the community when most of us wouldn't like to see rengar become braindead bruiser.

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Senior Member


Honestly, I'd rather Rengar is left untouched than that he is ruined by Scarizard.

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Senior Member


Think of it another way - Rengar is a big cat. He's got two big thematic influences - the Predator and a lion. Lions, leopards, cougars, as far as I know every cat but the cheetah, hunt by stalking, sneaking up on their prey before they pounce. As opposed to simply running it down in the open like a wolf or cheetah.

The stealth fits the lion aspect of Rengar perfectly in game terms. Obviously it's even more core to the Predator aspect. Turning him into some speedy maniac that you can see coming a mile away just doesn't make sense to me.

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Senior Member


Hey y'all -

So i wanted to talk to you guys about our good ol' Stabtabby, Rengar. Classick handed off to me his initial refactor of Rengar that he had begun posting about a while back, but internally it was shown that while it certainly buffed him and fixed some issues with his design, more work needed to be done.

What our playtests revealed is that preserving the predatory feel by making his ultimate stronger is all well and good, but proved pretty abusive when it came to his burst potential. In a way, Rengar is a champion that has always been defined by his abuse-cases, either in TripleQ assassinating someone in less than a second from stealth, or double tap W + DFG pentakilling teams from stealth with AP, or simply stacking health + spirit visage splitpushing waves, then escaping from nearly any sort of chase. We've come a long way from the latter of these, but if the Pridestalker is to see any sort of return to glory we'll need to iron out some of the abusive kinks and round him out as a whole.

We're sticking with the direction that Classick originally outlined in his post here (http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?p=37371487#37371487) - namely reducing the frustration/toxicity of Thrill of the Hunt (Ultimately allowing us to buff the spell in other ways) and driving clarity in his Ferocity choices by having the effects scale with champion level rather than rank of skill. Our other goal is to retain his dueling nature and strength in ambushes and skirmishes, but lower his instagib potential in favor of deferring his up-front damage into longer engagement windows. While he'll still be a threat, changing him to a sustained damage pattern allows us to pump more power into his other abilities/ferocity bonuses and make his ability set as a whole stronger instead of the current 'stabcat on AD carry and one or both of us will die' pattern that makes Rengar so frustrating and binary to play as and against on Live.

So with that out of the way, here are some questions i'd like to get your thoughts on -

-Do you identify Rengar's playstyle as one that would be a particularly good fit in the jungle? What improvements would you like to see be made to help him out?

-What is appealing to you about the defensive boost Rengar receives from Battle Roar? I'd like to change this from just flat Armor and Magic Resistance to something that can be situationally more powerful and makes him less 'meatwall' when he leaps on a target

-What types of improvements or changes would you like to see be made to Bonetooth Necklace? Ideally i'd like to see this moved away from a 'stat-stick' and embrace more unique enhancements like his 'Increases Leap Range by 150'

These questions are really just to begin the discussion - i'm certainly looking for thoughts/feedback on a variety of topics, but these are a few that we've been talking about on a higher level that have less of a set direction currently. Wav3break, one of our Live Design Interns is working closely with me on this project and will be monitoring this thread alongside me and will help to soak feedback and answer questions y'all may have.

Without further ado: Rengar! I choose you!

Here are the changes (Without numbers, as they are subject to change/tuning as always) that we've been testing so far:

Updated 8/16 - updates in bold

Bonetooth Necklace
10 AD, 1 AD/Level
Recipe: Hunter's Machete + Long Sword + 100g
PASSIVE: 20% Increased damage to monsters

3 Stacks: Rengar gains Flat Movement Speed while out of combat, or while in brush

6 Stacks: Leap range increased

9 Stacks: Thrill of the Hunt lasts X seconds longer

14 Stacks: Rengar gains % Movement speed for 2.5 seconds upon exiting brush

- Health Regen, Health Regen/lvl, and Health/lvl all increased

Unseen Predator
-Now becomes visible at the beginning of the leap, rather than midleap

- Attack Speed reinstated, -slight- buff to %AS, -slight- nerf to base damage.

Ferocity Bonus: Savagery
- In addition to dealing bonus damage, grants Rengar 3 Ferocity.

Battle Roar
- Damage increased
- Cooldown decreased
- No Longer grants Armor/Magic Resistance
- Enemies hit with Battle Roar have their Attack Damage reduced

Ferocity Bonus: Battle Roar
- Heal unchanged
- Now deals damage based on Rengar's level

Bola Strike
- Damage increased
- Bonus AD Ratio increased
- Is now a skillshot
- Increased Range

Ferocity Bonus: Bola Strike
- Now deals damage based on Rengar's level
- Root duration increased

Thrill of the Hunt
- Cooldown decreased
- No longer plays Voice Over or gives an Icon to enemies within Rengar's sight/detection range
- Consumes current Ferocity on cast - each point of Ferocity consumed increases the Duration of Thrill of the Hunt by 1 second.
- No longer stealths Rengar for the duration
- Duration greatly increased, scales with ult rank
- Movement Speed increased
- Rengar's first basic attack while in Thrill of the Hunt will cause him to leap at his target - Rengar retains the Movement Speed increase from Thrill of the Hunt for 3 seconds after leaping.

I don't think you have a CLUE about champions you remake man. Karma blows, and despite the outrage you didn't change it because you're STUBBORN.

Rengar is a PREDATOR. Guess what comes with that theme? STEALTH. I seriously think you're my least favorite rioter.

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Senior Member


Just kind of sucks that Scarizard won't see over 100 downvotes because of the upvotes he got before he revealed his true colors (that he just wants another generic bruiser).

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Berserk Knight

Junior Member


Lunar Lightning:
if u used your r to run u were playing rengar wrong


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Senior Member


Removing the stealth entirely is what makes Rengar iconic.

I don't want my job to be split pusher. Leave that to Yi and Heimerdinger.

Do you think Rengar has a predator skin because his stealth isn't what makes him, him?

Do you think ALL OF THE OBVIOUS PREDATOR INSPIRED AESTHETICS INCLUDING THE STEALTH CAMO ON HIS STEALTH are because people don't pick him for that unique flair? Xelnath, I appreciate your input on the matter, and I can understand the "don't knock it till you try it" philosophy, but there are just too many disenfranchised players who KNOW without reason of a doubt that removing the stealth entirely is NOT what the player base wants at all.

And in regards to the bola changes - the examples you gave were all lane and duel/assassin examples. Lead shotting someone in a bush feels great, yes. I would play Xerath or Ez if I wanted to do that.

Do you know what feels better? Jumping onto an adc, almost killing him, and then when they flash and their whole team jumps on me, I throw that final bola just before dying, and I confirm the kill.

THROUGH all the tanks and gap closers and whatever minions there were, if any. How it SHOULD be. But I don't know. Maybe in some world these e changes can work.

But the stealth....Riot, pls.