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PBE - Jayce [Update 4: 07/16/2013] - [Delayed till 3.11? 3.12?]

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Phonike the 2nd

Senior Member

07-11-2013

Hey Xypherous thanks for taking the time to talk to us I have had a question that had been bothering me for a while. I would appreciate it if you have time to comment on it.

http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?p=39601637#post39601637
Thanks again man


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Rokkit Jumpa

Junior Member

07-11-2013

Why make To the Skies! scale off of Ability power? I see your reasoning behind the AD scaling but magic damage with Thundering Blow so why not do the same with To the Skies!? If this was put into his kit I don't see why you should completely change it. As personally I do level the form change because of the free resistance and the resistance shred. I'm sure number tweaking with the shred can put Jayce into a good place since it originally opened up a lot of combos and ways to outplay his opponent.
And as of currently Jayce's huge power comes into late game because of the tear changes. So why tweak with jayce's game play when he works fine the way he is? I'm sure can you change the damage types but the way he scales with ad is what makes him who he is and what was put into his kit.
The current "nerfs" i don't mind but he's still open to be outplayed by any hero. jayce can be destroyed with a champ that can commit to a fight harder than jayce can.


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CynicalGiant

Senior Member

07-11-2013

So any plans to change/rework Jayce's current passive? Why the flat speed boost?


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enderkin

Senior Member

07-11-2013

Quote:
Phonike the 2nd:
That is assuming his current q is not OP and the addition of his new unaugmented Q brings nothing to the table. So in otherwords it would depend heavily on how his unaugmented Q is handled


In order for the bare Q to farm creeps like Jayce does currently with his Accelerated Q, Q alone is going to have to do a lot more damage and probably have a higher particle speed. That means that his new Accelerated Q could even have a reduction in damage and still do as much damage as it does currently. Having a skill that reduces your damage so directly seems odd, so that single target damage will probably have to stay just as strong in order to make it worthwhile. As a result, the new rocket Q sounds like it would hurt like the dickens and would require a huge Gate CD in order to prevent straight up fog-of-war sniping.


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NotBuzzJack

Senior Member

07-11-2013

Quote:
Xypherous:
or you could set up a siege and start peppering multiple empowered Q's forward - but as soon as that Gate drops, you know you can rush Jayce, etc.

Sounds like a modified version of Xerath's Locus of Power. However it sounds awesome and you should totally try it.


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Xypherous

Systems Designer

07-11-2013

Quote:

So any plans to change/rework Jayce's current passive? Why the flat speed boost?
I have no idea why the flat speed boost is there - but I suspect it's there to actually cover a bit for the mind-share it takes to transform mid-fight.

As in - it does take more planning and execution to perform swap combos as Jayce - thus the additional movement speed and ghost allows for a bit of grace in terms of mental mind share allowing you to focus on the combo, rather than mouse moving while doing so.

It also has some way additional side benefits in making the transform "feel" right from a visual perspective. Because Jayce changes his walking posture - intuitively, you think that Jayce has slowed down because his center changes.

Agreed that the ghost effect is probably superfluous - but there doesn't seem to be any real reason to remove it. I also agree that the shifting to lane case is a bit odd but outside of it feeling silly I don't see negative implications to it.

Quote:

In order for the bare Q to farm creeps like Jayce does currently with his Accelerated Q, Q alone is going to have to do a lot more damage and probably have a higher particle speed. That means that his new Accelerated Q could even have a reduction in damage and still do as much damage as it does currently. Having a skill that reduces your damage so directly seems odd, so that single target damage will probably have to stay just as strong in order to make it worthwhile. As a result, the new rocket Q remains terrifying.
There are really straightforward ways to solve that: 100% bonus damage to minions.

Or potentially, massive AoE spread - with falloff near the edges.


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Phonike the 2nd

Senior Member

07-11-2013

Maybe Jayce farming creeps the way he currently does is a part of the problem.
However for Q by itself it is entirely dependent on the number of things it hits as AoE
while accelerated Q will always deal more damage to a single target.
Depending on the situation either could be more useful depending on the situation.


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Skaarrjj

Senior Member

07-11-2013

Jayce's Accelerated shockblasts coming from the fog of war are downright annoying. As is his % damage knockback.


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Sol Badguy

Senior Member

07-11-2013

I dunno if you remember me, we used to occasionally talk and stuff- I did PTR work. I have some pretty bad feelings on this one, and it's giving me sweats. I'll try and break down concerns.

W is already insanely bad as a one pointer psychologically- Imagine a 6 skill system... That means that his W has to start at what, 50% damage atr rank 1? I would never hit that button at all under any circumstance. I guess you could tighten it up some, but it would still feel insanely god awful to actually touch that button.

We've already seen that the 6 system is really, really bad for a lot of reasons. The biggest I can point out is that if your 6th rank isn't better than it reasonably should be, you're in a situation where you feel like **** for having that system. But if your level 6 IS better it's like a bunch of miniults. Ugh- That creates edge cases that I imagine could be just as bad as he is right now- That's a no win situation.

It's like... You're playing around with a lot of levers here. You're talking about taking an extremely popular thing and adapting him to probably the least popular levelup system we've ever seen. I fully think Jayce is silly OP, but I don't think you shunting him into a situation where his players will get confused and come to find potentially false expectations is good.

Jayce's autoattack spammer W is really good, probably too good. But honestly, I'd rather he lost it if you're going to give me this thing that could be as low as 50% early on. That's not even a one pointer- That's a no pointer unless the AoE discharge is really good to compensate.

Other minor things: I don't think trading one itemization issue for another is good- ie you want to remove his shred, but give him magic damage on Q. These create a really similar end result, in that in lane he suddenly starts to feel -even weirder or less clear-.

He's leaping at you with a giant hammer- Every part of that screams 'Build armor to lessen this'


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CynicalGiant

Senior Member

07-11-2013

Why not keep his W 130% or something like that but make it so it can't crit like Renekton's W?