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Is Sivir Worthless?

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Chorus

Senior Member

12-14-2009

I've played every game with the same character (40/32 as of today), and I went from an 8 Win streak to a 5 loss streak, and I'm starting to wonder what the purpose of Sivir is. A tower pusher and harasser, and with a Frozen Mallet can be a great team ganker, but what if you never get to that point?

If there's ever a decent Ashe in the mid, I'm worthless. Her attacks are too fast to shield except for her ult if she's a reasonable distance away, and even if I just stay close to the tower the amount of gold and EXP I get is so pathetic I might as well be a side. With anyone really, Sivir doesn't pump out enough damage is is the number one target of ganking because there's really nothing she can do. She can use her Ult to run away, but not only is that pointless now it's getting nerfed next patch.

I used to rely on Promote to add pressure in the lane if I was getting pushed back to the tower and help get Gold/EXP, but since they are removing that next patch I've already taken it off. I've been playing with Smite but found it worthless for the most part (Some gold every minute, that helps, but not really), and Exhaust though it's pointless to use on Sivir because she just doesn't output any damage compared to other characters.

So she can farm, except she always dies against just about any other character. Some characters even at level 6 will dominate her in less than 2 seconds.

My item build generally goes Pendant, Stone, Boots, Starks, Frozen, Infinity. It was doing fine before, but now any team I see any opponent Yi, Elevynn, Twitch, Ashe, Teemo, ect. the game is pretty much over and I'm generally to blame.

Without Promote Sivir just seems completely worthless for anything. No damage, no defense, no CC, nothing. I have used the same build since I've started and it was working fine, but as soon as I removed Promote I've been completely worthless.

Sure, Sivir can get damage later, but early game she's just a free kill to me and apparently to everyone else i'm against.

EDIT: On a side note, I've never seen a better Sivir on the opposing team. Any time I've been pitted against another Sivir I have won, so I'm not sure if it was just me or the character itself because I used to hold Sivir in high regard, and apparently so have a lot of other people.


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Swiftstar88

Senior Member

12-14-2009

You're joking, right? I find it much harder to shield her ult than her volley, it moves so **** fast. I'll hand it to you that soloing mid against an Ashe is probably one of the hardest match ups you'll face as Sivir (along with Cho), but it's not impossible.

Where are the patch notes? Last I heard, her ult wasn't being touched.

Promote is not nearly as useful as something to keep you alive. Sure, you'll pressure a lane, and then five enemies show up, own you and your promoted unit, then call it a day. Take cleanse or ghost instead. I prefer ghost, and it's saved my ass many times.

If you die as Sivir, you're doing something wrong. I average maybe one death a match in all the games I've played with her. You need to know to read the map for ganks and get the hell out before you get swarmed.

Your build is too generic, and it makes you pretty useless for most of the match except for running along with your teammates and buffing them with starks. Instead of focusing on those items, get survival and cooldown reduction items, with mana regen. That way you can spam your Boomerang Blade, by far your most damaging skill, especially early in the game.

Sivir is not worthless without promote, far from it. Just get out of your current mindset and learn to think out of the box when playing her, you might be surprised with what you come up with. And if you still suck with her, maybe she's just not the hero for you.

With Sivir, I own early game, especially with a lane partner. Boomerang Blade doesn't do too much damage, but it adds up, and fast. Try it out. Get a mana manipulator -> Soul Shroud, Boots of speed -> whatever upgrade helps the most at the time, and Stinger. That's my core for Sivir. Give it a try before giving up on her. And don't forget to harass like hell early and often.


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Bait

Recruiter

12-14-2009

you know spell block gives you mana if you successfully block a spell? ashe's volley can be blocked using this method. sivir can outplay ashe.


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Cresil

Senior Member

12-14-2009

Sivir is far from worthless.. I play sivir or ashe i go on a 5+ win streak without even trying. I play any other char i start losing games.

Just make sure that you are responsible for keeping the minions pushed on there side of the map the majority of the map, to allow you to do quick ninja pushes throught the game.

So basically push every lane but playing passive enough so that you don't get ganked while doing this, and make sure you are ready at every team fight.


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Krosan

Senior Member

12-14-2009

Low-mid ELO player here, but I find her excellent for a few purposes. In team fights, she's not much good for much but dropping DPS (though if I've had enough time for hardcore farming, and maybe got fed a bit, Sivir can drop some major DPS into a crowd) and flinging attackspeed bonuses around, but she has her benefits. First, during laning, she can oftentimes utterly gimp someone; if there's a carry on the other end, she's wonderful at keeping them from farming. I don't worry about laning against Twitch any more with Sivir, because the **** rat just chokes on blade. So, she can lock down a lane if she lanes against a squishy, especially at my level, where people aren't smart enough to dodge the blade.

I typically go Boomerang->Shield, then upgrade in a pattern of ult>boomerang/ricochet/shield. The one level of shield is quite handy against certain types of enemies; depending on who you're laning against, it can be a lifesaver (block the damage from Nunu's ult) or keep you whipping out blades (Fiddlesticks' Dark Wind, for instance, is pathetically easy to shield-block for a little hit of bonus mana).


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mermin

Senior Member

12-14-2009

sivir is too unkillable, spell block shld block dmg only like blackshield, anyway this lets her farm HARD every game when she solos


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Patyrn

Senior Member

12-15-2009

Quote:
sivir is too unkillable, spell block shld block dmg only like blackshield, anyway this lets her farm HARD every game when she solos


Black shield doesn't block damage only.


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Krom

Senior Member

12-15-2009

Troll'ed...


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Chorus

Senior Member

12-15-2009

I've been trying a few new things. I'm straying away from using ghost because it takes a point out of Offensive, and currently i'm 15/0/0.

I don't really like the Mana Manipulator -> Soul Shroud. Mana Manipulator doesn't generate a lot of mana for a single person, and I spend most of my time solo in a lane anyways. After that, the upgrade costs a lot. I feel even Chalice is a better upgrade, but I did manage to win the match I used that combo, so i'm not sure. I can see how Sivir is a great support with Starks and mana, but I don't know. I'll play with it some more.

My issues still follow is that for a long time Sivir just seems like minion murdering dead weight. Always first targetted for ganks, and with no CC she's a prime target to get fed on early on. Harassing doesn't usually work until mid game, as early harassing works both ways.

I still have problems with a few champs that I deam literally unkillable.

TF for one is nice enough to feed me mana, but the problem is he can spam low costing attacks like none other and just teleport anywhere and any time in 2 seconds, and since Sivir lacks any sort of CC or Defense, he can pick her off pretty easily. I thought he wasn't a problem, but I played one that could harass me more than I could him. Oh, and apparently sheild doesn't stop damage? I thought it did. Gold card stuns still take off a bar and a half with one hit, I just don't get stunned.

Evelynn is...ugh. I don't see any nerf incoming for her, so I assume somewhere people believe this stealth tank oneshot wonder is balanced. Even buying Elixers, you don't get to see her until she's in range to assualt you anyways. Even if you do see her, she just stuns and takes off 80% of your HP by level 5. I've never seen one lose. I've seen twitches lose because he's squishy as hell, but Evelynn isn't and can deal far more burst damage than anyone else.

Ashe is managable except for the fact her range is insane and crits hard early game, spamming Volley like none other. It's difficult to time shield with Volley, while others say the Ult is harder I disagree.

Teemo. One hit, normal, poison, takes off twice as much as the initial hit. That's terrifying. It seems like Teemo is the ultimate harasser and squishy killer.

Yi just two shots me, but to be fair he's squishy as hell in return. I still think he's broken damage wise, but whatever.

Twitch can kill me in half a second from twice my range away, but to be fair he's pretty squishy too.

Tyrn I don't think is meant to be killable. Can solo Baron at level 12, so whatever floats his boat.

Everyone else seems like a pretty fair fight. Cho is my favorite to fight against because he feeds me so much mana, and in return I just can't kill him.


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Ramayana

Senior Member

12-15-2009

Have you read any guides on her at all? Your saying your just discovering these new things you are trying, but it has all been posted in multiple guides for monthes.

Chalice -> Boots -> Starks.
Promote and Rally.

Sure stealthers are annoying, but getting an elixir after you get boots and they are kinda screwed. And while I haven't tested it, if I had to guess I'd say spell shield prevents her stun out of stealth, which you have plenty of time to activate if you have an elixir to see her. But even if it doesn't, I haven't seemed to have a problem with her taking me down 80% health before I can react.


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