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False Item choices: Statikk Shiv

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RockJockey

Senior Member

05-10-2013

Xypherous' Season 3 Itemization changes have been great. Many Champions that were unviable before have become playable and much more enjoyable because it feels like we can actually contribute to the teamfights. Hecarim, Sejuani, etc...

Many in Season 2 were complaining about the standard build for RADCs being same old, same old, no variation.
Greaves, 2 PDs, Infinity Edge, Blood Thirster and Last Whisperer.

So Xypherous gave us a couple of new toys to play with. Statikk Shiv and BoRK. But now players are complaining that RADC's feel underpowered. There are a couple of reasons for this.

Unfortunately, Statikk Shiv is a false choice and a noob trap. Although it is cheaper than Phantom Dancer in two ways, both in total cost and by having Avarice Blade as part of the item build. This lower cost is deceiving because players want was is most efficient, so they buy this item. And because of the lower cost, the item has 40% AS and only 20% Crit. The trade off is that you get this cool 100 Magic Damage arching lightning passive. This passive turns the item into good at poking so it seems like a good item especially during the laning phase. One advantage Statikk does have is splitpushing.

But as soon as the mid and late game come around, ADC's feel like they aren't doing as much damage. This is because they bought Statikk Shiv, trading raw Damage potential that Phantom Dancer provides for a flashy 100 Lightning Magic Damage.

Phantom Dancer gives 50% AS and 30% Crit Chance. Critical Strike Chance is one of the most expensive stats to build. Most builds never get above about 45% in Season 3. Even without Infinity Edge, Crit Chance makes your Auto Attacks do 100% more damage. Critical Strikes is the equivalent of building 2.0 Attack speed because it double's your Attack Damage if it procs.

So in comparison:
Phantom Dancer allows 1/3 of your AAs to deal double damage.
Statikk Shiv allows 1/5 of your AAs to deal Double Damage.


I've posted in another thread why Blood Thirster is better than Infinity Edgge in Season 3. http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=3304624&highlight=rockjockey+blood
The other reason that ADC's feel less powerful is because Infinity Edge is so expensive. As far as game strategy goes in terms of raw Damage, it is better to have Infinity Edge by 20 minutes for teamfights. But the dominance of Blood Thirster is because it gives survival during teamfights. Unless the game goes on for 30-40 minutes, ADCs rarely find themselves building Infinity Edge, usually as a 5th item. This causes the ADC's actual "Carry" status to be pushed back to the 30-40 minute mark.

TDLR: RADCs feel underpowered in Season 3. Don't buy Statikk Shiv if you want a presence in teamfights.

General Optimal Build for ADCs in Season 3.
Bezerker Greaves => Phantom Dancer => Blood Thirster => Last Whisperer => Infinity Edge => Blood Thirster

Discuss please


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Ill Darkistino

Senior Member

05-10-2013

I play ADC, and my third item is almost ALWAYS Infinity Edge. I know that I will have to be dealing that cool 250% damage in teamfights starting mid game, and IE makes me ready for that.


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RockJockey

Senior Member

05-10-2013

Quote:
Ill Darkistino:
I play ADC, and my third item is almost ALWAYS Infinity Edge. I know that I will have to be dealing that cool 250% damage in teamfights starting mid game, and IE makes me ready for that.


Ill Darkistino, it's wonderful that when you play Draven that you are able to build an Infinity Edge as your third item, which you are sacrificing an AS item for. Draven's kit places greater value in getting Critical Strikes and thus he can afford to build an early IE. So your experience may be flawed compared to the overall feel of other ADCs.

However, my thread is speaking broadly about items for all RADCs (Ashe, Varus, Caitlyn, Twitch, Draven, etc...). If you have any comments or criticisms that actually contribute to the conversation, I would be glad to hear them. I'm not quite sure if you disagree or agree with what I am saying.

Reread this section
Quote:
The other reason that ADC's feel less powerful is because Infinity Edge is so expensive. As far as game strategy goes in terms of raw Damage, it is better to have Infinity Edge by 20 minutes for teamfights. But the dominance of Blood Thirster is because it gives survival during teamfights. Unless the game goes on for 30-40 minutes, ADCs rarely find themselves building Infinity Edge, usually as a 5th item. This causes the ADC's actual "Carry" status to be pushed back to the 30-40 minute mark.


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MajorSwain

Senior Member

05-10-2013

Explains alot about ADCs this season.


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Vuther

Senior Member

05-10-2013

Statikk's pretty popular in Korea, I hear.

So it's probably fine. It's used for poke and split-pushing.


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MajorSwain

Senior Member

05-10-2013

I agree that Statikk Shiv is good for poking and splitpushing. Toplane Quinn or Vayne might pick this up. Blue Ezreal uses this to bump up his damage on his Q pokes.

But as far as teamfights go, it lacks the oomph that Phantom Dancer has.


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RockJockey

Senior Member

05-10-2013

Let's get more discussion in here.


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BfM DevOuR

Senior Member

05-10-2013

I use it for the early laning phase it tends to scare people off so we can freely farm mostly, then I just sell it to get a better item later on. But it all depends on the scenario.


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PhailRaptor

Adjudicator

05-11-2013

Part of what Xypherous did with the item overhaul that the majority of people don't understand is to divorce the "highest damage" build from the "most class-related utility" build. Previously, when you build a Ranged AD, you flat out had to have PD, IE, and BT in your build. Come late game, you were by definition required to have a Last Whisper against competent opponents.

Now, you have to choose between having the absolute max DPS (IE, PD, BT), or having massive class-relevant utility (Youmuu's, Statikk Shiv, Hurricane). Obviously, max DPs revolves around having as much AD, Crit, and Attackspeed as possible in as few item slots as possible. For a utility-centric build, you would be using the properties of the items to make up for their "lack" of raw DPS, for example using the large quantities of movespeed to kite effectively while still dealing damage, and hitting multiple targets at the same time.

Quote:
RockJockey:
General Optimal Build for ADCs in Season 3.
Bezerker Greaves => Phantom Dancer => Blood Thirster => Last Whisperer => Infinity Edge => Blood Thirster


That is a good list of items Ranged AD's should be looking at, it is by no means the optimal build. You really can't generalize an order, or even a set item build, that all Ranged AD's should build at all times. There are too many kit-centric differences in the order items are built, and the value different weighting different kits place on each of the 3 Ranged AD primary stats.

For example, as you mentioned previously, Draven wants all the crit chance he can get to take advantage of his passive should he not have a Spinning Axe out. Because of his passive, he is also 1 of 2 Ranged AD's that can make effective use of Black Cleaver, because of his physical damage DoT (MF is the other because of her ult's multi-hit nature). And because his Spinning Axe also gives him a huge bonus to raw AD, he can delay his BF item in favor of rushing more crit chance.

Vayne, on the other hand, has Silver Bolts. In order to proc Silver Bolts as many times in a fight as possible, she wants attackspeed. Like, a lot of it. She is facilitated in this by her ult giving her free AD, and Tumble giving her AD (and her ult's AD) a % amp. Vayne can afford to go straight from a Vamp Scepter (or, as I always do, Cutlass) straight to a Phantom Dancer before worrying about an IE or BT.

Then, consider Trista. Her Q is a huge amount of attackspeed. She can go straight to an IE if she wants, and the only significant loss she'll take is the lack of movespeed from not having a PD. She can also skip taking a BotRK in favor of a Statikk Shiv, giving her great AoE poke that she can readily take advantage of with her range increasing passive.

Another effect the S3 item overhaul had is a decrease in necessity of Last Whisper. Inb4 downvotes. Let me explain. The item overhaul had the effect on defensive itemization of incentivizing health, and desincentivizing resists. This was furthered by Black Cleaver shifting to become a Buiser item, and the stacks becoming so simple to apply. The combined effect has had the effect of Armor being purchased in lesser quantities. In most games I play, it's pretty rare for anyone to go over 100 Armor anymore, and the person who is at or around 100 Armor is generally the Tank -- the last person the Ranged AD should be attacking in the first place.

Playing Caitlyn, my end game build usually looks like this (in no particular order):

Furor Zerker's Greaves
BotRK
PD
IE
BT
GA

I usually start Long Sword + pots. First trip back, buy Zerker's, upgrade Long Sword to Vamp Scepter or, if you can afford it, Cutlass. Buy Zeal, then BF Sword, upgrade Zeal to PD. Upgrade BF to IE, then Cutlass to BotRK. Upgrade Zerker's with the Furor enchant. Depending on which I need more, build GA or BT, then the other.



That's not to say that I don't agree with you that Ranged AD's are too.... vulnerable. But that has less to do with Ranged AD's being inadequate, and more to do with Bruisers being too effective.


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RockJockey

Senior Member

05-11-2013

PhailRaptor, thanks for replying, very well thought out argument. I agree wholeheartedly with you. The shifting of the meta made resist stacking less viable. I did not know about how much Black Cleaver shifted the Meta.

As I have said before, this is a general guide. Each Champion has their own particular builds that are optimal for them. My example would be Twitch who I build Phantom Dancer or BoRK first on before getting any major AD items.

Thanks again.