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Insititue of war no longer cannon

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OGZ Bob Gnarly

Senior Member

05-02-2013

This is something I've been discussing with my friends lately. LoL's full lore would fit in like...an RPG or something. But as an MOBA? It's getting a tad too ambitious and overreaching for that.


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lJustShadowl

Member

05-02-2013

I got same feelings. The league was made as a tool to prevent a new war, course it would shred world apart. Meanwhile, creepy ghost tells everybody about an incoming army of ice monsters who wants to freeze the world. Feels like council just ignores that.
Or, if look deeper, maybe adding Howling Abyss to fields of justice is a solution, Institute of war can't create panic and throw all forces to the Freljord just because some dead guy tells us about something bad that might happen. But by making that place a battleground it guarantees that there will be champions and summoners in case something really will go wrong.


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Vongeo

Senior Member

05-03-2013

I saw other threads saying similar things.


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JoshTep

Junior Member

05-04-2013

I agree with this completely. Although I like the idea of the whole war of three sisters and how much of a badass storyteller Lissandra is, it's like the League is non existent. For a secretive witch that goes around blatantly spewing about her world conquest seems rather...ironic. There wasn't even a smooth transition into it from the old Freljord lore's. Like...oh Lissandra alligned herself with Ashe to upward her intentions. Lissandra is keeping a secret from the rest of the world...but oh wait she joins the league out of the blue without a declaration of "Oh btw ashe our treaty is void now, i'm actually an immortal that has been fooling everyone, and there's going to be war in a couple of months." The fact that Lissandra is blabbering about world conquest and there is no awareness about it in the institute of war is also iffy. Quit frankly Lissandra has no reason to join the league in the first place. She is ready to take action and isn't trying to delay time anymore. So mediation and diplomacy isn't needed when that is the entire point of the league.

They need to mention the champion's intentions of joining the league like majority of all the other champs. It just seems like all these serial killer type champs especially from the Shadow Isles event onward could just fight in the league without any type of restrictions or limitations. The Institute of War is just becoming like a club where people can fight in whenever they please. Brings champions like Morgana, Kayle, and Nasus to shame.

I get why the league might not have any say in this event however. This is a civil war that isn't involving 2 nations but just one internally. Like in the real world, domestic issues are out the jurisdiction of a institution unless it threatens the sovereignty of another nation or the world as a whole.

Riot really needs to get consistent with the greater world of valoran instead of just throwing everything out the window for a small event in a single region.


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Axinhed

Senior Member

05-04-2013

Quote:
JoshTep:


I get why the league might not have any say in this event however. This is a civil war that isn't involving 2 nations but just one internally. Like in the real world, domestic issues are out the jurisdiction of a institution unless it threatens the sovereignty of another nation or the world as a whole.



The League still has reason to interfere because, as you said, this civil war could affect the world.

Here's something I wrote in another thread

Quote:
A "passive" stance would mean the death of all.

The Kalamandan Conflict might have been started by the League (more specifically one man inside the League) but it was also ended by them. Had they not done so, then...
[QUOTE]
“What do you think would have happened if the League hadn’t stopped Demacia and Noxus in Kalamanda? I can sum it up in four words: the sixth Rune War.” -- Ryze, the Rogue Mage (http://dominion.leagueoflegends.com/crystal-scar)


The League was made to stop war. Any war, even a civil war, can cause devastation to the world if kept unchecked. What if the magic users from each of the three tribes caused (accidentally or intentionally) the ice in Freljord to melt and flood Valoran? What if Noxus decided to strike at Freljord while they fought, doing irreversible damage to the land via black magic and Zaun chemicals? What if Lissandra won and covered the world in ice? What if other nations see Freljord's war and decide "hey, the League didn't stop them, so lets go to war too!". A hundred possibilities, each one potentially world-ending, can come from civil war.

All this could happen if the League merely sat back and watched. Them being "passive" defeats the whole purpose of the League.[/QUOTE]

Remember that Runeterra is wracked by magic. A Rune War could end the world. A civil war, though less dire, could still have a permanent effect on Freljord.


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Axinhed

Senior Member

05-07-2013

The Freljord AMA is here (http://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/comments/1dveg8/we_worked_on_the_freljord_ama/), and most of the lore-based answers seem to be flat-out ignoring the questions as to what the League is even doing there.

Some of the answers also point to a full scale civil war going on in Freljord, but no word about the League doing anything.

Some quotes:

Quote:
kitae:
We've set up an awesome war between interesting factions, if we resolved that in a week or so that would really not give the conflict an opportunity to reveal interesting stories.

The fight to be Queen of the Freljord is more interesting than one of the champions being Queen of the Freljord.

But, we will progress the story, and ultimately we will want it to reach resolution.


A war, and yet no League to resolve it.

Quote:
RiotRunaan:
Demacia has acknowledged that the Freljord could potentially become a threat in the future, but as the war there is just beginning to unravel, they're not going to interfere just yet. So long as the Freljord is busy fighting itself, Demacia has no need to fear a united barbarian front crashing down on their borders. Jarvan will certainly be keeping an eye on the Freljord, though, and maybe Quinn will go on another scouting mission eventually.


Threat? Interfere? What has the League been doing, if not keeping the peace?

Quote:
kitae:
A united Freljord could be a danger to any of the factions of Runeterra. Their divided nature is the only thing that has stopped Freljord from rising to become a dangerous power.

If Ashe is victorious that would be the safest outcome, due to her diplomatic nature, but even then Freljord is a dangerous sleeping giant.


Freljord and the other states seem to be getting more aggressive and warlike. Isn't the whole point of the League to curb aggression between states?


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Criomhthann

Senior Member

05-07-2013

Probably because within the confines of the story, it doesn't exist anymore.

Quote:
Kopikatsu:
This is something I've been discussing with my friends lately. LoL's full lore would fit in like...an RPG or something. But as an MOBA? It's getting a tad too ambitious and overreaching for that.


That's a sound point. The MOBA structure makes it serve well for the resolution of political disputes between states (rather than individuals) provided that some conditions are met:

1: Doesn't result in the total destruction of said states.
2: Doesn't result in the death or otherwise removal of champions.
3: While champions can have back story and development, they must remain minor in relation to the issues of the states which must be at the front of the story.

This is a problem for the style that the writers seem to want to go with (if they in fact want to go with it and aren't using the story for more cynical yet realistic goals, but that's a discussion for a different time). For example, Olaf's story is now dead ended, the entire conflict in the Freljord is dead ended, etc. They can't really go anywhere or do anything with them.


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Vongeo

Senior Member

05-26-2013

Quote:
Criomhthann:
Probably because within the confines of the story, it doesn't exist anymore.



That's a sound point. The MOBA structure makes it serve well for the resolution of political disputes between states (rather than individuals) provided that some conditions are met:

1: Doesn't result in the total destruction of said states.
2: Doesn't result in the death or otherwise removal of champions.
3: While champions can have back story and development, they must remain minor in relation to the issues of the states which must be at the front of the story.

This is a problem for the style that the writers seem to want to go with (if they in fact want to go with it and aren't using the story for more cynical yet realistic goals, but that's a discussion for a different time). For example, Olaf's story is now dead ended, the entire conflict in the Freljord is dead ended, etc. They can't really go anywhere or do anything with them.

I feel like the JoJ easily reached that criteria, but the events they are doing cannot.

And though I hate to complain about the new awesome CG, it didn't have visual of summoning as the old one did nor did it have the champions dying and there bodies moving away like the Dominion one did.


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Eserine

Senior Member

05-29-2013

"The New Awesome CG" is a disjointed mess actually, with numerous (and totally unnecessary) logical and artistic inaccuracies, even under the severe limitations of pan-cultural player appeasement and the need to cobble three unrelated short battle-films together. Brandon Beck writing that "this only scratches the surface" in his announcement-page post merely renews the ridiculous promise of storytelling of a quality that Riot will never have the capability to deliver... as everyone reading this thread already knows.

Consider this however: 2014 has prematurely been named by a number of industry-watchers as the "year of the Moba" since so many companies (in the dozens) are now making serious attempts to create a "LoL Killer" arena game, the metaphorical Subway Sandwich counterpoint to LoL's McDonalds. The way that each best see to do this of course is to attack Lol where it is the weakest: Inclusiveness of the community in creative content, and improving upon the reeking toxic pile that the LoL game-lore has become, as we already can observe as an obvious trend:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f66nNIuEW2Q
https://www.sinsofadarkage.com/news/1899/0/the-path-ahead
http://mercelite.com/preregister
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prime_World

Quote:
several books based on Prime World have been published, some from best-selling authors Vadim Panov and Alexander Zorich


Gosh, who could have foreseen this development (http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=2813286)?

Basically the visitors to this forum do not need to sit here and get told a list of arbitrarily-decided-upon character relationships they need to "fill in the blanks themselves" to derive enjoyment from. Each creative player is a kingmaker, with the power to shape LoL's upcoming competitors into works far worthier of attention, contribution, and funding, through sincere collaboration with listening developers instead of as accessory witnesses to nonstop and unreasoned canon bastardization and poor character design.

Sadly the bar for improvement has been set catastrophically low by Riot, but while Brandon Beck has ineffectually preached the dangers of Riot "losing the small game company culture", that culture remains intact in other, far away development cycles- where outside contribution can still fix problems, shift content offerings, or improve features within a game. Players can turn back the clock and find a new IP and forum, as yet untainted by dull and passive cows rejoicing at humdrum and formulaic boilerplate gamecraft fueled by an apathetic staff largely comprised of halfwits and the creatively-bedridden. Mark Ford wrote of Nabokov recently in The New York Review of Books:

Quote:
He conceived of writing as a chess match with a razor-keen opponent always looking to predict his next move, and joy and triumph lay in outwitting that reader’s assumptions, and thereby stimulating “curiosity, tenderness, kindness, ecstasy.”


Content can be clever and challenging, and that content can triumph over what is rotten and stale (Aatrox being an excellent example of the latter). I've been called "arrogant beyond words" by Ironstylus in the past for noting this fact in the lore forum, but as the stakes grow ever higher (http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/05/24/us-google-africa-idUSBRE94N0XG20130524) some developers out there are ready to learn and innovate together with the public to win the day away from the unworthy, much as AOL was destroyed.


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I am Razgriz

Senior Member

05-30-2013

Quote:
Vongeo:
With the slew of new lore and deaths and things and thongs and bios and Bildgewater(except not)

I have noticed, and others have too, that the institute of war, summoners, and matches in the league have not been mention for a long time (since jayce's bio?). Meanwhile conflict begins in the Freljord that hopes to end the world in ice.


Shouldn't the institute of war, who's goal is not to end the world and prevent rune war type issues make a presence?

My guess is that its not making a presence because its no longer cannon, and there is no reason for any of what we do in the game or the game itself.

What do you think?

It not being canon is what I've heard from sources inside Riot. That said, it's retarded. Mostly because they're just retconning it because they're bad writers. From what I know it's mostly because Summoners are too powerful.