Hi, I'm talon.

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AH3roNam3dHawk3

Member

05-12-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phreak View Post
Hi, I'm Talon. I have the fifth highest win rate in the game at the moment, but no one's bothered to try me out seriously yet.
Right well Im sitting here, watching absolutely no one play Talon in Diamond and see a 2% pick/50% win rate on lolking.


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Xtractor

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Senior Member

05-12-2013

winrate doenst say much when nobody plays talon, because zed & kha zix are 100x better than talon.


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SageMoad

Senior Member

05-12-2013

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Originally Posted by titiln View Post
talon puts the ass in assassin.
lol!


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BlargCow

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Senior Member

05-12-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phreak View Post
Hi, I'm Talon. I have the fifth highest win rate in the game at the moment, but no one's bothered to try me out seriously yet.
clearly malzahar is a good character as well


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DementedLord

Senior Member

05-12-2013

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Originally Posted by Ralik098 View Post
I thought Riot always said win rate didn't matter, which is it? Why was Janna buffed when her winrate was already in the top ten?

The tangled webs riot has weaved.


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MoonsBane

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Senior Member

05-12-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phreak View Post
Hi, I'm Talon. I have the fifth highest win rate in the game at the moment, but no one's bothered to try me out seriously yet.
According to LoLking he has an average of ~50%. Some days 46, some days 54. I really wish you reds would stop quoting statistics that we don't have. If your internal data is different than what we're given you really need to share that with us. That's a whole 'nother can of worms though.

On subject; I love playing talon. Don't do it much anymore since his bugfix buff. Comparing apples to oranges but i really think he'd see more play if Kha was changed slightly or he was changed compared to Kha. Kha argubly farms better than half the mages in the game and almost every other toplane as well as being the best assassin. Oh, and resets. Don't forget to mention there was almost an entire month of tourney's in which the match was decided by which team got the first kill in the teamfight; Team A with Kha or team B with Kat.

If we could see slight mana reductions to his W I'd see no reason why he wouldn't be viable (and about +10 base damage). At the current time Kha and Zed farm effortlessly when compared to him. Toss in the fact that Talon doesn't really have a lane he belongs in and it's apparent why Talon needs something when you look at the other popular assassins. Love the guy to death but to a degree his kit is counter intuitive. An AoE ult on an assassin whose job is to kill one person and a passive that screams to be put on tanks. I love his ult a lot but it really doesn't fit on a character whose whole purpose is to kill a single person. A balanced AoE assassin can't really exist.

In short, a few mana changes, a passive fit for an assassin, and +10 base damage on his W ( Everyone that has ever played talon knows that caster minions always survive Rake with 5 health in the laning phase for whatever reason) and he'd be in a good spot. Though, once again, i'm not entirely sure if Zed and Kha need to be toned down or Talon just needs number buffs, but as long as these three stay in their current state there's just no reason to pick talon.

Edit; Though i will give Talon this. I main dominion. Consistantly play with the same players and big timers of dominion, I.E Saruon and the like. If a champ is OP on dominion they are OP on rift. We've always been ahead of the curve. We were begging for Jayce nerfs day 1 of his release. Took SR and pro players a month to figure out that he was OP. Same with Lux, Yorick (to an extent), Urgot, Kha, and Zed. In almost 2k games of dominion this has always held true champ release after release. That being said, Talon is never picked on Dominion anymore. Sure the meta is different but when it comes down to it teamfighting is the same. Kha and Zed will out harass, outrange, outpoke, and outdamage Talon in every teamfight. This is mostly why i consider talon in need of buffs. Not because of some statistic but because of 2k games worth of experience. Talon was an amazing pick. Then people got their hands on Kha and Zed. He's got nothing on them after his last round in the patch notes. Granted, this is just the observations of one player who barely plays ranked. In theory, his AoE means he should excel in teamfights. Countless games i've seen that proven wrong when Kha gets a reset or Zed throws out 2 shadows over the entire tower.


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Deafiler

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05-12-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phreak View Post
Hi, I'm Talon. I have the fifth highest win rate in the game at the moment, but no one's bothered to try me out seriously yet.
http://www.lolking.net/champions/

~36th, according to this.


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Super Explosion

Senior Member

05-12-2013

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Originally Posted by Xtractor View Post
winrate doenst say much when nobody plays talon, because zed & kha zix are 100x better than talon.
This is the thing.

Underpowered champions don't necessarily cause lower winrate:

They cause lower commitment rate.

Fewer people tend to play them over all. (There are other factors of course.)

In fact, an underpowered (or less-played) champion can get much higher winrates, simply because the only people playing that champion are the ones really devoted to him her or it.


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Flana Scarlet

Senior Member

05-12-2013

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Originally Posted by Super Explosion View Post
Phreak, let me tell you a little something about win rate:

It is almost entirely dependent on who chooses to play a champion.

Imagine if you will that Dyrus was the only one in the world allowed to play Singed.

Since Dyrus's win rate with Singed is currently 64.6%, Singed's winrate would be 64.6%.

Do you see it now?

If the only people playing a champion are those who are very skilled at that champion or at the game for their ELO bracket, winrate will increase.

This is probably the major factor that yields winrate.

Not necessarily how powerful the champion itself is.



Edit: This is as well what can cause especially an underpowered champion to gain higher winrates-- if the champion isn't absolutely terrible, just suboptimal, mostly only people really committed to that champion will continue to play the champion.

And they'll tend to win at a higher rate than people not very committed to the champion.
This doesn't hold up. Clearly there are a lot of people who think Talon sucks and needs buffs. Either they're whinning about a champion without ever playing him, or he's stronger than most people think. Besides, Riot hasn't commented on popularity yet (that I know of), I'm willing to say he's in a good place.

Let me tell you a story. Vlad was problematic, and Riot decided to nerf him. However Riot messed up and the nerf didn't go through, but showed up in the patchnotes. Everyone then said Vlad is trash tier and shouldn't be played, and his % dropped.

Vlad was never nerfed.

Perception is important.


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gamemasa5000

Senior Member

05-12-2013

I haven't played Talon in forever might have to give him some love tm