My Trundle Lore Rework rendition

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Morec0

Senior Member

04-05-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nahtee View Post
I thought of that before i ended up writing this one, and was thinking I could write a bad guy one too. One that is a little more deep, because it doesn't really take a smart person to beg for his life (like in the new Trundle lore with the ice witch) or make up a story about weapons (which even if his clan were idiots, they shouldn't have believed that easily). I just like everything they made traditional Trundle stand for, "Don't judge a book by it's cover" thing.
So... you would rather have Trundle be a whimp that begs for his life and becomes a slave to the Ice Witch than a brilliant and crafty that struck a deal with the Ice Witch to save his skin with the intention of simply betraying her at a later date? JUST to keep the old lore, you would have a Champion that, effectively, is simply a minion to another?

EDIT: And I'm sure that the Clan didn't believe his stories completely; but once he showed up with said weapon of power he had been talking about and then KILLED the old Chieftan, it's not hard to claim power. Mostly 'cause, you know, the old leader is dead.


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cpmd4

Senior Member

04-05-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tolfor View Post
Alright, I apologize to only be responding to such a small part of a large and clearly thought-out post, but I'm really tired of hearing people talk about "Trundle's heroism." Anyone who actually read his original lore (and more particularly, his Judgment) knows that old Trundle was not a benevolent friendly troll hero - he was a failed martyr who, upon realizing that his sacrifice wasn't going to save his kinsmen, let alone earn him the attention and adoration he desired, turned his back on his tribe and left them to die.

When Trundle was told that his tribe could still be saved by transferring the disease back to them, and that they would otherwise all slowly die:

So stop going on about what a great heroic character he was and how Riot's new lore ruined him, because that's not what happened. Anyone who thinks old Trundle was a selfless, stand-up guy needs to remove their nostalgia goggles and actually read the lore.
He is a hero. He saved his tribe. Actions or thoughts following a heroic act don't change the heroic act.

Then after he saved his tribe they continued to mistreat him. Then, when faced with the decision to save those same people again, he declined. Since when does doing bad things to bad people make you a villain? Not to mention the league emissary implies they will die out either way, suffering the disease again was only going to prolong their lives, not save them. Not a villainous act, it's pretty morally ambiguous. Which is a GREAT thing. Now he's generic "kill, rape, pillage" villain, serving generic "I want to destroy the world" super villain.

Now I wouldn't have a problem with the changes if they kept the spirit of the character.
- Relied on wits instead of muscle (he is now huge, brutish and dumb)
- Morally grey, not black (he only cares about himself, wants to advance his own dominion, serves an evil witch)
- Was mistreated, makes a sacrifice, turns his back on those he saved (this provided pity toward the character, which allowed the "heroic" look people see him with even after leaving them to die. It's also an interesting and unique story within the lore)
I don't need him to be a swamp troll, but I need these 3 things.


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Nahtee

Junior Member

04-05-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Morec0 View Post
So... you would rather have Trundle be a whimp that begs for his life and becomes a slave to the Ice Witch than a brilliant and crafty that struck a deal with the Ice Witch to save his skin with the intention of simply betraying her at a later date? JUST to keep the old lore, you would have a Champion that, effectively, is simply a minion to another?

EDIT: And I'm sure that the Clan didn't believe his stories completely; but once he showed up with said weapon of power he had been talking about and then KILLED the old Chieftan, it's not hard to claim power. Mostly 'cause, you know, the old leader is dead.
You missed what I was saying, when I said "it doesn't take a genius to beg for his life" i was referencing the PBE Lore, because that's essentially what he does. It doesn't take a silver tongue or enormous wits to say "Hey don't kill me... i uh... i have friends who can help you if you want " And the Ice Witch has Boneshiver and other assorted weapons just laying around (i get it, there was a few guards, but come on) and he almost snatches it


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Morec0

Senior Member

04-05-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nahtee View Post
You missed what I was saying, when I said "it doesn't take a genius to beg for his life" i was referencing the PBE Lore, because that's essentially what he does. It doesn't take a silver tongue or enormous wits to say "Hey don't kill me... i uh... i have friends who can help you if you want " And the Ice Witch has Boneshiver and other assorted weapons just laying around (i get it, there was a few guards, but come on) and he almost snatches it
I don't get that feeling from the PBE lore. The way I'm reading it it's saying: "Hey! Listen! You can kill me and have one troll corpse, OR you can let me live and I'll give you a troll army at your side. Think about it; together we could conqure Freljord!" That's not so much "begging" as it is barganing, and don't forget the bit at the end that pretty much adds the amendum; "oh, yeah, and I intend to betray you sooner or later." (not that Lissandra knows that).

Quote:
As she summoned her dark magic, Trundle believed he had met his end and failed his people, but another clever idea struck him. With a knowing grin, he offered the Ice Witch a devious proposition: a troll army would be of much more use to her than one troll corpse. Together, he told her, they could conquer the Freljord. The Ice Witch agreed, and Trundle departed with a powerful ally - one he was certain he could defeat when the time was right.
No one who's scared for their life and begging propses they work together with "a knowing grin."

And there were more than a few guards, there were an number of powerful magical traps as well. Traps which, can be implied as no one else seems to have an Ice Witch-related item, are PRETTY dangerous to everything.


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Nahtee

Junior Member

04-05-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Morec0 View Post
I don't get that feeling from the PBE lore. The way I'm reading it it's saying: "Hey! Listen! You can kill me and have one troll corpse, OR you can let me live and I'll give you a troll army at your side. Think about it; together we could conqure Freljord!" That's not so much "begging" as it is barganing, and don't forget the bit at the end that pretty much adds the amendum; "oh, yeah, and I intend to betray you sooner or later." (not that Lissandra knows that).



No one who's scared for their life and begging propses they work together with "a knowing grin."

And there were more than a few guards, there were an number of powerful magical traps as well. Traps which, can be implied as no one else seems to have an Ice Witch-related item, are PRETTY dangerous to everything.
What Trundle did in that lore a six year old could do. Fabricates a weird story about weapons then goes out and gets a big stick. Then gets caught by someone tougher than himself and cuts a deal to get out of trouble (which the ice witch probably doesn't trust him as much as she just needs allies). What would be witty and clever is not getting caught in the first place.

I just think more could have been done because his character isn't impressive. I would like to write a bad guy lore and post it on here soon


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Morec0

Senior Member

04-05-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nahtee View Post
What Trundle did in that lore a six year old could do. Fabricates a weird story about weapons then goes out and gets a big stick. Then gets caught by someone tougher than himself and cuts a deal to get out of trouble (which the ice witch probably doesn't trust him as much as she just needs allies). What would be witty and clever is not getting caught in the first place.

I just think more could have been done because his character isn't impressive. I would like to write a bad guy lore and post it on here soon
A six year old... find a magical club that radiates icy powers... then cut a deal with an immortal, ancient Witch of Ice... by promising her that you will lead the trolls to assist her? While also fully intending to stab her in the back at a later date?

Good sir, I don't think you understand anything about the capabilities of children. Nor do I think you are even attempting to understand the new lore, as you merely wish to see the old lore kept not matter how much worse doing so would make the current retcons.


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Nahtee

Junior Member

04-06-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Morec0 View Post
A six year old... find a magical club that radiates icy powers... then cut a deal with an immortal, ancient Witch of Ice... by promising her that you will lead the trolls to assist her? While also fully intending to stab her in the back at a later date?

Good sir, I don't think you understand anything about the capabilities of children. Nor do I think you are even attempting to understand the new lore, as you merely wish to see the old lore kept not matter how much worse doing so would make the current retcons.
"Trundle drags his club across the ground as he patrols the halls of Lissandra's lair while his troll soldiers sleep. His tribe was never a beacon of honor and decency, but at least they weren't mere enforcers under the control of an outsider.

A troll that is fresh into his adulthood, Trundle was able to muscle and trick his way into becoming the Chieftain of the Ice Trolls. He was just as strong as any other troll in his tribe, with the exception of the previous Chieftain, but Trundle had something that no other Troll had... intelligence. Deception and wit came naturally to Trundle, and coupled with his natural strength he was a formidable foe. However, Trundle also had another trait, something that would cloud his judgement, he was ambitious. He longed for leadership, but he would need to beat the chieftain in combat in order to earn the right to lead, a task that he knew he was not yet prepared for, and until he was ready, risking injury would be foolish. One dark night however, Trundle was visited by a troll he did not recognize in his tent. Quickly, he reached for his club, but the stranger called for him to stop and shapeshifted back into her true form, Lissandra. She came to him with a proposition, to help Trundle win his position of leadership, and in return be rewarded with an regiment of Troll soldiers. He agreed, and Lissanda cast a spell on him, granting him powers that tipped the odds in his favor.

When the fight came, he massacred the Chieftain, predicting his movements and countering with devastating force. The onlookers were astounded as Trundle delivered the final blow and claimed the right to lead for himself. Trundle led his new tribe to the Lissandra's palace, where Lissandra pronounced him "King of Ice trolls" and granted her new general "Boneshiver", a massive true ice club that could crush boulders. Trundle's first task was to destroy a village under Avarosan control as a letter of intent to Ashe, the Avarosan queen. For a week, Trundle subtley lead the poaching of the village's local animal life, so their target would have nothing to eat, and cut off any trade route between Avarosa and the village, so they couldn't signal for assistance. During a day of heavy snowfall, Trundle finally launched his surprise attack. They faced starved, tired, and dissoriented soldiers, who put up little to no fight, and Trundle was able to keep his tribe's casualties and even injuries to a minimum. He was a brilliant strategist, and Lissandra was impressed.

Only later however, Trundle would come to realize his new powers came at a price. He was under the complete thrall of the ice witch, unable to deviate from any order Lissandra gave him, or be wreaked by a painful shock. Now Trundle bides his time, strategizing... waiting for the opportune moment to get even with the ice witch.

"Beat anything you can't outsmart, outsmart anything you can't beat" - Trundle"

Here's my bad guy story. You still don't get it dude, I didn't mean a 6 year old could find a magical weapon or beat guards. I meant a 6 year old could fight the chieftain, lose, get humiliated, make up a story about magical weapons, and then cut a deal with the ice witch to spare his life.

This story at least makes him look like he chooses his battles wisely, is a good strategist (fighting a battle of attrition instead of a straight forward fight that might hurt his troops), and that if ANYTHING could have him make a mistake in decision making, it would be his ambition.


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0Relm0

Senior Member

04-06-2013

Being honest, they probably could have transposed Trundles backstory wholesale simply by

A. Moving his troll tribe to the ice lands.

B. Changing "exiled and wanders to the league" to "changes and wanders in the frozen wastes and finds Lissandra"

C. After League/Lissandra tells him about how the curse functions, changing "joins the league" to "Joins with Lissandra, outright conquers his old trollkind, as well as the rest of the trolls, and rounds up a troll army"

Of course, I'm not nearly as compelling a writer, and a rendition like this once he joins Lissandra would likely be fitting.


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Nahtee

Junior Member

04-06-2013

Sigh, if people want to keep the new lore, I guess keep it. I've heard so many people that didn't like it so I figured i'd try.

Then there's the people who don't care about the lore and just want to play the game.

But can anyone give me feedback on both of my short stories? I'm trying to be a writer


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Bilbo Batten

Senior Member

04-09-2013

[QUOTE=Morec0;36401371]The only problem is that ruins any connection between him and Lissandra, and leaves the Ice Witch without any allies aside from her Frostguard.

They should have chosen Olaf, and his people. They most likely would love to come out of secrecy and start raiding the towns and kingdoms of Freljord.


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