Welcome to the Forum Archive!

Years of conversation fill a ton of digital pages, and we've kept all of it accessible to browse or copy over. Whether you're looking for reveal articles for older champions, or the first time that Rammus rolled into an "OK" thread, or anything in between, you can find it here. When you're finished, check out the boards to join in the latest League of Legends discussions.

GO TO BOARDS


Champion Spotlight: Karma, the Enlightened One

Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Willchristiansen

Junior Member

03-30-2013

OMG I hate the new karma so god damned much. She's not the same champ anymore. I wish they had reworked the old champion and made her more OP but had kept her abilities the same. They changed so much she isn't even recognizable anymore.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

BlackWidowSPDR

Junior Member

03-30-2013

Quote:
exe3:
She has no passive. It's bad enough that that passive should be attached to the ultimate but it doesn't get affected by minions making it near useless as a cooldown reducing effect. It was designed for support Karma as it has the same idea as that support mastery that gives gold for AA'ing the enemy champion. Mage Karma has no passive.

Q's visual effect isn't very good imo, difficult to see the AoE size unless it's Mantra'd. Otherwise it's just a standard spam attack, nothing particularly interesting tbh. Effective but dull. Mantra version feels excessive, it does too much imo.

W feels worse than before. At least before it could be used as an escape, a slow or a speedup. Now it's damage at an awkwardly close range with a delayed root. There's not much gameplay involved with just keeping close to the enemy for 2 seconds. The heal on the Mantra is random as well, it doesn't serve a purpose as far as I can see, it's just kind of *there* to make it seem like mantra'ing W is worthwhile, I don't agree.

E was gutted. The shield and damage is nothing compared to before, you can't use it nearly as often due to Mantra's long cooldown and the speedboost is just random and colludes the actual purpose of the spell. E was my fave spell before, now it's almost ignored in favor of Q.

The Mantra changes were horrible, there is significantly LESS choice in only having one charge as you can't afford to waste one particularly with the long cooldown. Using a mantra NEVER feels satisfying now and is utterly devastating if it's wasted. Before Q and E were equally useful because they had greatly different effects, that was the beauty of mantra, it didn't just do more of the same, it fundamentally changed the spell, not so anymore as all the Mantra'd spells are essentially just more damage so you're going to always pick the one with most damage which is Q. On occasion it's worth doing a Mantra'd E but using a Mantra on W is just as much a waste as it was before.

This new kit is BAD. Not because it can't do damage or can't win games but because it lacks an identity. There's a bit of kit overload with little thought put behind what each spell should do and how they interact with each other. Sh!t was just thrown at a dart board. A classic example of more is less.

Old Karma had heaps of depth with every ability being both offensive and defensive in nature and you had real choice with Mantra's. The depth is lost and the choice in mantra usage is gone. I could care less about how "viable" new Karma is as she's just not fun anymore. Old Karma needed love (namely only her W needed love) but Riot doesn't seem to understand that love doesn't mean ripping out the champs soul and creating something completely different particularly when the new kit ends up having its own set of problems.


This.

I rarely come onto the forums but this rework is horrible. Karma was unique and fun to play, as she is now .. I doubt I will play her again.

R.I.P. Karma.
Thanks...


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

AnimasWrath

Junior Member

03-30-2013

New Karma should be called something else, because it is not Karma AT ALL. Moves look similar, but suck way more than old Karma. Maybe not suck per say, but it's entirely new skill set for a her making her a **** tier in the AP mid rankings. She can't even be called a support anymore; she can't heal, can't speed up allies, can't slow enemies as well as before, and her shield sucks. Not to mention her god awful CD on her Mantra and not having the ability to have two stacks.This wasn't a rework, it was a terrible remake. I hope someone does something about this or none of the old Karma fans who truly loved her before this will not play her. That's more important than fitting her into this goddamn Meta run game.

Also her fans are what made Karma Karma. Now she's just a bland mage with bland abilities (and a new bland dance). Maybe instead of her trying to make her live up to the "Enlightened One" status, leading the Ionians spiritually, you should've just changed her story like you've done to so many champs Riot.

I want a refund on Karma now Riot.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

HelSkadi

Senior Member

03-30-2013

First of i agree with all of the old karma users the new karma isnt nearly as fun or versatile as old karma. Second, for all of the ppl basing this horrific rework to be good on the fact that u barely saw a karma its kinda stupid. This is why u barely saw karmas because 2 reasons: 1.) Honestly not everyone likes to play support roles and thats the truth. In every match u see ppl fighting and raging over who is mid, adc or top, its really rare to see ppl fighting over jungle or support roles. 2.) old Karma required a lot of practice and skill to fully master her, thus u needed to invest time on her. Its easier to play a sona that is spamming spells ( no hate intended to sona i love her too this is just for the sake of comparison) than the old Karma. The new karma offers nothing as a support and as an AP is not the best one out there. Old karma had the flexibility to adapt, she could be a full support, mid ap, and even tank, thats how versatile Karma was. Now u have no choice but to play her ap, because as a support she does a mediocre job. Honestly i dunno what Riot was thinking when they did this rework, it doesnt reflect at all what karma fans where requesting. It feels more like they just wanted to make her appealing to the ap mid masses. Sad very disappointing


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

MasterRohan

Junior Member

03-30-2013

Quote:
BlackWidowSPDR:
This.

I rarely come onto the forums but this rework is horrible. Karma was unique and fun to play, as she is now .. I doubt I will play her again.

R.I.P. Karma.
Thanks...




Same here, this is the first time I'm here on the forum and I feel so angry and disappointed that my favorite champion is no more!


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

MasterRohan

Junior Member

03-30-2013

Quote:
AnimasWrath:
New Karma should be called something else, because it is not Karma AT ALL. Moves look similar, but suck way more than old Karma. Maybe not suck per say, but it's entirely new skill set for a her making her a **** tier in the AP mid rankings. She can't even be called a support anymore; she can't heal, can't speed up allies, can't slow enemies as well as before, and her shield sucks. Not to mention her god awful CD on her Mantra and not having the ability to have two stacks.This wasn't a rework, it was a terrible remake. I hope someone does something about this or none of the old Karma fans who truly loved her before this will not play her. That's more important than fitting her into this goddamn Meta run game.

Also her fans are what made Karma Karma. Now she's just a bland mage with bland abilities (and a new bland dance). Maybe instead of her trying to make her live up to the "Enlightened One" status, leading the Ionians spiritually, you should've just changed her story like you've done to so many champs Riot.

I want a refund on Karma now Riot.




Yes indeed! The fans was the biggest reason for me to start learning her. It took me a while to learn this champion and it became my favorite champion! It is sad for me to see the rework. It is a completely different champion and I definetely want a refund on this new Karma.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

OpprobriumIII

Member

03-30-2013

Don't you guys think you made karma a bit too strong now? Before she was just fine, as long as you took the time to learn how to play her, but now especially early game she does ridiculous amounts of damage while being able to sustain alot herself. 200 damage at level 1? come on now.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Marth Wagner

Senior Member

03-30-2013

Quote:
Grinningsphinx:
I read your whole post.

If all you care about is "fun" factor and not viability, you have no business commenting....as fun is purely an emotional response...plenty of people think that spamming Soulfire is "fun".

Whoa... This guy watches streams and copies "pros". Be careful guys, he is unable to form an opinion of his own or is an elitist ******bag who hides behind "top tier" because in truth is a crappy player. Please do reply saying how I'm bad now because I don't play the oh so not skill defining solo queue and dont have a rating, seen it before. You can't even be original there if you tired.

Anyways. On topic here, karma before the rework... It's not like she was bad. She just needed a little attention and a bit of fixing up is all. She fully had the ability to do a ton of damage, support her team, and get pretty tanky (easily winning a 1v2, as getting low was only a strength).
My only complaint was 2 mantra charges should have been 3, W had little use and needed fixing (3 mantra could have changed that), her base MS was too slow, CDs were a little high but tolerable, and her mana costs were too high.
It was maybe twice a year but whenever we saw karma in champ select we would mutter "karma? Aw ffffffffffff***" because although it was rare to see karma, players who used her were good with her, they showed her true potential. It's been a while but I use to play old karma, early she was eh, but late game you felt like you had so much to offer.

It was also cool how every champ has their own weapon. Fans were always cool but now... Watch out.... Her fists are colourful -.-'


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Denjin Dai

Junior Member

03-30-2013

I loved the old Karma... I blew a good amount of RP on her... now she sucks... Compare her to Lux or Lulu now. Shes terribad and I'm out 20 bucks /cry

Edit: AND there is no more awesome fans and awesome dance /wrists


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Watafool

Senior Member

03-30-2013

I love new karma. She is so much fun. She has so much utility in her kit, and its so much easier to use now than it was before. To speed up your entire team, they had to run through your tether, and same for slowing an entire enemy team. Now you can just use your mantra'd shield to speed up your team or use soul flare to slow an enemy team. Fantastic.

Her heal before was okay, but moving the heal to only herself allowed Riot to make her strong overall.

I'm really glad with the way she turned out, and she feels really good to play.