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@Riot Please revert change of Traditional Karma

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The Insane

Member

03-23-2013

643079

Riot, please change it back to the old Traditional Karma skin.

Something you guys may think towards this post:

Quote:
Raptorg:
"Traditional Karma is being released to prevent alienation of the old Karma fans.

Not going with the long dress would make no sense.
This incarnation of the traditional Karma skin is about as close as we'll get her to be to her current model, and thus it should stay this way.

Don't like the dress, use a different skin."


Something that I agree on:
Quote:
Morgan87:
"With all due respect, I honestly don;t believe that Riot can look at this awkward design and think that it looks good! The dress looks awkward and unladylike, which basically kills the whole purpose. Plus, the original Traditional Karma was simply amazing... It had the grace of old Karma and the authority of new Karma. Changing it, because a bunch of kids on the forums complained about it, is simply not a logical decision! Plus, I'm sorry, but why should the opinion of the haters be heard and the opinion of those of us who loved the first version be ignored?

Plus, let's face it, Karma will probably never get another skin. Why turn Traditional Karma in this abomination, when it could have been kept beautiful?

Honestly, I can't even be annoyed with Riot. This is all the community's fault. I hope everyone is happy as they got what deserved...

...Oh, wait, now we're all punished though, aren't we?"

Quote:
Hihahoe:
"What has also been brought up is the fact that with the previous balance right after Sakura's remake you had four very unique skins:
You had the new Classic one with Karma in all her green and purple
You had the old Traditional with the open dress and tabard, still portraying the old ying and yang theme while moving around in her new moveset and animations
You had the Sun Goddess where she, uh, was a Sun Goddess
and last but not least you had the newly remade Sakura's kimono come back, staying true to the theme of the Japanese kimono even within her new moveset and animations.

With this we had four unique skins for Karma.
What worries some people now (including me) is that the new dress for Traditional bears too much resemblance of Sakura's kimono, effectively making Sakura and Traditional recolours of eachother (with another hairstyle and Decorum). This was instead of Traditional and Classic being the only ones resembling eachother, even though you could hardly see it because of the different colours on the models (purple/green to black/white), and different clothing."


Please think about this.


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Lord Gaga

Senior Member

03-23-2013

The new, full dress looks so much better. It's not awkward at all and captures the current look Karma has (the whole point of the Traditional skin) much better than the cape version.


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Rashidas

Senior Member

03-23-2013

I really am not seeing the issue with the new look.


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The Insane

Member

03-23-2013

Again, this is what you guys may think

Quote:
Lord Gaga:
"The long dress looks way better and is much closer to her current look, which is what "Traditional" is meant to emulate."


Someone/Some people who also agrees with me (http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=3250795)

Quote:
Lacae:
"I prefer the tabard, personally. It gives me this awesome sense of what's between Old Classic Karma and New Classic Karma, but I get what Ququroon is saying about traditional skins being meant to align with JUST the old Classic.

But I mostly agree with what everyone else is saying, about how the Sakura Karma rig doesn't really match. I think there's this disconnect with how a kimono is open, but bound shut, and Traditional's got a one-piece. The model looks strange to me where the dress opens.

Definitely open to changes, but the way it is now, I do prefer the tabard."


Quote:
nvmvoidrays:
"the problem with adding the dress onto traditional karma is it looks like its rigged exactly the same as sakura karma.

the animations that made for the kimono won't work for traditional karma. they'll look awkward because the coat doesn't look tight at all; it looks like its supposed to flow, but, if its rigged like sakura karma, she'll take dainty steps. that's where my problem comes from. the kimono one doesn't really "move" when she walks. it's really not supposed to. seeing a coat stay plastered to her legs will look really awkward.

tbh, i think it would be better to keep all three skins looking completely different from each other.

sakura karma has her kimono.

sun goddess karma has her loincloth/aztec culture flair going on.

traditional karma has her coat/tabard combination.

i'll say i love how sakura karma looks. however, i don't want to see each of her skins become a copy of sakura karma. that removes the originality of each. right now, all three skins look vastly different than each other and offer a different flair. keep that riot.

riot pls."

Here's another good argument for keeping old Traditional Karma
Quote:
HarryOrunitia:
"Because it would look awful without the fans and it wouldn't "connect" with her other animations.

To all the people who are saying the point of "Traditional Karma" is to be as traditional as possible, I want to ask is it worth it when it looks bad? If in order to make Traditional Karma more similar to the original Karma we have to accept awkward animations and weird textures, is it really worth it? I think the first version of Traditional Karma had already nailed the Karma look anyway, even without being a full dress. And this is coming from a Karma diehard who was absolutely traumatized by the removal of her fans and many other elements of the rework.

The original Karma could afford being in a super tight full body dress because her animations, including her "pimpwalk", all revolved around her fans. She could afford looking small and powerless because it kind of was the point: "I can look like this because the moment I get tired of you I'll just blow you away with my fans". Now that she doesn't have the same weapons, her kit is completely different, and even her concept is apparently completely different, a tight full dress and a strangely uncomfortable/restrained walk animation don't work with her anymore. They don't express dignity and elegance anymore, they just look weird.

I think the first version of Traditional Karma looks much better because she retains her class and elegance while also being able to move freely. Her coat flows with every movement and it gives her an air of regality, she looks intimidating and she stands out on the battlefield. It's something she absolutely needs because without the fans she would just look like a lady in a plain old coat, surrounded by colorful characters with shiny weapons and crazy clothes. What I'm saying is she looks out of place with the full dress, way more than she did before her rework, because with the toned down animations and the dress tightly wrapped around her legs she lacks visual impact. It's a completely different situation with Sakura Karma, because in that case it's very easy to recognize her dress as a kimono and realize that it's supposed to look like that. It makes sense. It's inspired by real life. And it's also very colorful, so it definitely catches the eye. But on Traditional Karma, it just doesn't work."


Quote:
nvmvoidrays:
"i wouldn't have problems with the traditional karma redesign if it didn't look like it was rigged exactly the same as sakura karma. this means it would have similar animations to sakura karma. the sakura karma animations work because she's in a kimono. plastering these animations onto traditional karma will make it look awkward. she's wearing a coat, not a restrictive kimono. she's not supposed to have stuttered steps.

and then, if they keep the original animations, the dress will stretch and look even more awkward.

that's why i'd love for them to keep the current coat/tabard: it looks good, it gives the traditional karma a unique flair and makes each of her three skins look completely different.

i would hate if they did the same thing for sun goddess karma too. i don't want three different sakura karma skins with different colors/themes.

the animation team did do a stellar job with sakura karma, but, i can't think of how they could make it look good with traditional karma, especially considering how the dresses are rigged to the characters and not separate physics, at least, in sakura karma's case."


Quote:
nvmvoidrays:
[QUOTE]Homocastle:
"NOOOO. Don't do this. I was thrilled beyond belief she got her dress back from being another dainty skank! If you want a tabard, go with her original skin god damnit!

...

What reason do you have besides "It's so pretty and I love her man thighs."


uh, what? how did she look like a "dainty skank"? her traditional skin kept her more or less flat-chested; her ONLY exposed skin was her head and hands. she's wearing boots and pants for christ sakes and a full-bodied tunic.

are you blind?

the reason i want her to keep her old traditional style?


Quote:
nvmvoidrays:
"for anyone that's curious, the new traditional karma rework is on the PBE.

she has the exact same rigging and animations as sakura karma.

also, i wish i could edit my poll to make it clearer."
this is why.


"they're just copy-pasting the sakura karma animations and rigging. these fit and work thematically for the kimono-esque design. they DON'T fit with the new traditional style. go on the PBE and look at her walking animation. it looks awkward. it feel strange.

if they completely redid the animations, the rigging and how she looked? sure, it could look fine.

right now - at this moment - traditional karma is a recolored sakura karma and it looks bad.

with the old traditional coat/tabard, each skin had their own themes and flair. it made each skin unique. now we have two recolors and the aztec flair of sun goddess."[/QUOTE]


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RunYuThru

Member

03-23-2013

So I'm getting a strong sense of, "I know better than you do." from this thread.

Here's the thing. Riot does not make changes based on one or two people. Do you know how large the demand had to have been for this change to have been made? It was made on a new skin no less. Traditional Karma she may have been, but her whole design was brand-spaking-new, and I don't think they wanted to change it initially. So to ask them to change it back after they heard people ask for a change is ridiculous.

Now personally, I don't give a damn about which look they end with. Both the coat and the dress are quite interesting. Personally I'm a fan of the VU classic skin. Were it not for the (in my opinion of course) god awful voice, I'd play that skin in place of the traditional look.

Anyhow, Karma's VU seems to have caused more problems than it solved. Maybe it would have been best for them to have left Karma alone. I don't think she's going to be seeing much play on the live server for more than a week or two after she comes out anyway. A noble sentiment by Riot, but one that didn't seem to be worth the trouble.

Just my two cents of course. GLHF.


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Lord Gaga

Senior Member

03-23-2013

Quote:
The Insane:
Again, this is what you guys may think



Someone/Some people who also agrees with me (http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=3250795)




Here's another good argument for keeping old Traditional Karma



You copy pasted people saying the same thing over and over. That doesn't make your argument more valid.


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deynische

Junior Member

03-23-2013

Letting this all soak in for a day, I'm okay with either. I still prefer the coat over the parted dress, but if they're going to go with the dress, I'd like them to be able to fix how it looks during recall. It's going to bother me to see the dress stapled to her foot when she raises her leg. It doesn't seem as noticeable in the Sakura version, but it's definitely there in the new Traditional.


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Cerxi

Senior Member

03-23-2013

The Insane
Copy-pasting everyone's arguments from other threads isn't really worth making its own thread. It's just trying to make your side of the debate seem louder than it actually is.


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Refreshing Milk

Senior Member

03-23-2013

The animations on traditional (new) look pretty stiff and unpleasant.

I think keeping how it looked originally makes all of her skins have a unique feel. I rather not have a recolor of the Sakura skin.


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Best Karma Ionia

Senior Member

03-23-2013

Quote:
Refreshing Milk:
The animations on traditional (new) look pretty stiff and unpleasant.

I think keeping how it looked originally makes all of her skins have a unique feel. I rather not have a recolor of the Sakura skin.


Im really sorry, and I know Ill get downvoted for 'being a bully', but people like you who say that same thing are stupid.

You HONESTLY think Riot is going to leave the skin as is? They copy pasta'd because people wanted to see what the dress looked like.

THEYRE GOING TO GIVE HER HER OWN ANIMATIONS.

Good God, how inept do you think Riot is?


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