Another example of why blind pick should be removed

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1Darkwatch

Junior Member

03-20-2013

I just played in a blind pick 3s match with the same team 2x in a row first game was quinn elise and i forgot who thier 3rd was but its was vs udyr oriana and an alistar. The outcome of that game was a slaughter 15-2 with nobody being able to lane against quinn on the top lane because of the champion selection. Then comes the next round where we have the exact same 6 players same 3 people vs same 3 people but this time the teams were quinn elise and alistar vs udyr jayce and nid. This time the other team comepletly crushed the enemy in a 1-6 before they surrendered early.

Since the same 6 people were playing against each other and the skill levels of each person would not drastically change after 1 match its pretty safe to say that player skill has a minimal effect on the outcome of a game compared to champion selection. I am not saying skill does not matter at all but it does become overshadowed by team makeup, but if the team makeup was fairly balanced then skill would determine the winner its more of a tiebreaker.

Ok now why is this bad. If the only non ranked 3's mode is blind pick then 3's is essentially a guessing game with the correct answer usually being one of the handful of champions that are overall better in 3's there are so many posts on this that I won't bother to go on about that.

So what draws alot of people to play LOL in the first place is being able to play a game where player skill supposedly matters and playing and improving your game play is a big part of what makes LOL fun, but blind pick 3's deviates from what LOL is supposed to be and turns it into a guessing champion selection game where your skill has a minor impact on the outcome of the game.

It would be nice to know if riot actually read these posts, but I doubt it since ive seen so many similar posts of people hating blind pick 3's and hoping for an additional mode or just removal of blind pick in favor of draft but I have yet to see any change or impact from forums posts. That being said if forums post have no effect on riots decisions on this matter the only option I could see being realistically effective is some sort of boycott on playing and purchasing rp from LOL since they are a business and ultimately are making this game for profit and not some ideal that they want to make a game people will like, but that would take too much effort and I would probably just quit playing the game before that point.


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TamOcello

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Senior Member

03-20-2013

You want a larger sample size. Two games does not a pattern make.


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Sofar

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Member

03-20-2013

Different champions have different skill/reward floors. Some champions are simply really easy to play well.

Also, some champions have better synergy with other champions. Furthermore, it's possible that the team that was crushed in the first match were using new/unfamiliar champions in order to test viability.


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Iytrix

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Member

03-21-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sofar View Post
Different champions have different skill/reward floors. Some champions are simply really easy to play well.

Also, some champions have better synergy with other champions. Furthermore, it's possible that the team that was crushed in the first match were using new/unfamiliar champions in order to test viability.
Pretty much this. Some things are broken a bit in some ways, but nothing inherently wins or is best. You can have a good setup, and a bad match up, but that doesn't mean that the team you did poorly against will always do well.

There are some champions I can do REALLY good with, but other do terrible with. People like garen and vlad I rarely lose as, but it's not because I can't lose, it's usually just me fighting against people I'm good against, or people just not knowing how to properly counter who I play.

It really isn't a black and white line of who is good and bad, or broken and not. It's about your team comp, how familiar your team is with their champions, and all the small things that happen in the game.


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1Darkwatch

Junior Member

03-21-2013

@Tam

I do have a larger sample size I recorded 30 random games team comps predicted winners based on champions alone and then recorded who actually won with a short description of what happened in the game. The example I gave this time was just the best example of this.

@Isabella

My point wasn't certain champs were broken but that due to only being able to play blind pick certain team makeups can have a much higher chance of beating another team based on what people decide to pick making skill a minor factor in the outcome of the game. Meaning the game is more based on team synergies and your champs being able to counter their champs but this is not based on skill but what champs you are randomly up against.

I hate having the outcome of a game be pretty much predetermined by the time you see the load screen. This does not happen every game but there are times when you know the outcome of the game before it starts. The easiest example is when you play against a singed there are counter champs but unless you decided to play one while you were blind picking then the other team will have a huge advantage. With blind pick there is no way to avoid this happening to you besides guess they will have a singed every game and choose counter champs all the time limiting your champion selection considerably.


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1Darkwatch

Junior Member

03-21-2013

Ok here is the list of 30 random blind pick match ups I am interested to see if people can predict the outcome of the game at least at a 75% accuracy rating since guessing should yield about a 50% accuracy if skill is the major factor and not champion selection which is based on blind pick luck.

My point was blind pick "can but will not always have predetermined games" so out of the list if people can choose match ups where they are almost certain a team will win then make your predictions on that smaller list I expect prediction accuracy will get fairly high.

I made the list and played in the games so my results are probably biased so try it out yourself and let me know the results.

1. vi diana voli vs tryn(ap) ez vi
2. udyr ez morg vs ww brand jarv
3. tryn(ap) soraka udyr vs dar jarv brand
4. renek nid(ap) udyr vs mao cho ez
5. renek panth mumu vs vayne elise voli
6. elise cho xin vs xin zil ww
7. jax lux thresh vs cho lux jarv
8. jax pop lulu vs singed vi vayne
9. lux khaz cho vs kas yi kog
10. udyr nid rengar vs brand xin trundle
11. voli brand dar vs xin kayle shen
12. blitz fid noc vs mumu renek zyra
13. nid udyr trundle vs ken leona varus
14. karma wu dar vs jayce cho xin
15. cho xin renek vs wu brand xin
16. cho trist rengar vs nid elise jax
17. vi kass udyr vs vayne syndra singed
18. irelia vi akali vs xin ori vi
19. mumu thresh dar vs irelia jax morde
20. singed irelia jayce vs yi ori gp
21. garen kha annie vs panth taric annie
22. cho jarv ken(ad) vs yorick kat jarv
23. rengar draven sej vs brand shaco(ad) leesin
24. mumu irelia ken vs teemo swain irelia
25. tryn(ap) renek aniva vs anivia riven draven
26. irel yi malz vs xin diana teemo
27. mao riven brand vs renek rumble quinn
28. kayle mao renek vs quinn alistar shaco
29. quinn udyr mumu vs nid lee cho
30. cait teemo udyr vs noc diana taric

Okay there are 2 steps to this test first identify the match ups which you are fairly sure of the outcome of the match step 2 guess and see how accurate you are and share the results. I will post the results of each match on a separate post below try not to look until you finished taking the test if you are interested in doing it seriously.


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1Darkwatch

Junior Member

03-21-2013

Ok here is the list of winners from the previous list team 1 is the team listed earlier on the list than their opponents. I will also give a short description of what helped the team win.

1. team 2 ez ranged dominated bot lane early and they never lost lead.
2. team 2 2 bruisers vs 1 win in group fights
3. team 1 tryn's ult was a good counter to darius ult
4. team 1 2 bruisers vs 2 ap tanks total domination by team 1
5. team 1 mumu's ult and overall sturdier team won the game
6. team 1 completely dominates, team 2 had inferior ranged damage and initiation
7. team 1 lux took a huge early lead and kept pressure for victory
8. team 2 no contest singed dominated game
9. team 2 member of team 1 dced (probably shouldn't count this if you used it)
10. team1 trundle got behind and became useless
11. team 1 Darius wins top lane with an early gank then becomes unstoppable
12. team 2 mumu's ult and tankiness > fid's ult
13. team 1 bruiser superiority
14. team 2 xin jungle shut down darius early
15. team 1 close game no obvious advantages
16. team 1 close game
17. team 1 had enough gap closers to kill singed vi ult and kass
18. team 2 no range on team 1 letting ori pressure other team and keep lead
19. team 2 mumu jungle and weak solo bot char (thresh) gave team 2 the advantage
20. team 1 singed + bruisers = win
21. team 2 3 stuns and 2 soft chars on other team ftw
22. team 2 ad ken wasn't able to compete in damage
23. team 2 brand dominates without good range to oppose him bot lane
24. team 1 mumu and ap kennen ult combo
25. team 1 2 bruisers vs 1 ap tryn has bruiser status tryn dominates
26. team 2 teemo advantage yi could not stay on anyone without hitting shrooms
27. team 1 bot dominates with range
28. team 1 tanky team 1 wins vs less hp opponents
29. team 2 lee got fb and snowballed
30. team 2 all sturdy characters vs 2 softies


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metere

Senior Member

04-01-2013

Riot needs to add a 4-5 person per team ban draf for threes. it would fix so much of the imbalence with threes.