@ Riot - Please give Sakura Karma her kimono back!

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Yohan Leafheart

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Senior Member

03-19-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by IronStylus View Post
Ohmikegoodness is an absolute authority on this. He can tell you personally how difficult Queen Ashe and Divine Soraka were.
IronStylus, would it be possible to make the tabbard go a bit lower? Like to half her thighs. I understand the point of the animation issues, specially the knees can be a PITA to deal with robes and/or dresses. But I think that a slightly longer tabbard would go a long way to improve the skin


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Hollywood Cool

Senior Member

03-19-2013

If cloth physics are beyond the talents and capabilities of your animators, perhaps you should hire more animators.

And in order to make this dress more conservative, how about you do it the way you did traditional Karma and cover her legs or something?


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RichardMcNixon

Senior Member

03-19-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by IronStylus View Post
Yup. That's why I'm cool with tanking it =)
Gonna need a Guardian Angel in your build if you don't convince an animator to get in here soon! Lord knows animation isn't time consuming or anything i'm sure there's dozens of animators just sitting around with plenty of time to be on the forums lol


I say, if the community wants it so bad - let them design it. Make it a contest and let them create their own content. who knows? Maybe you'll get a top designer out of it.


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Dryaddancer

Senior Member

03-19-2013

I am not trying to throw any **** onto the hard work you guys have done for Karma, my favorite champion. I know there are some serious limitations to what can be done in animation vs time. One champion to soak up so much talent, leads to slower things down the road.

That said, In the spirit of Divine Soraka and Queen Ashe, please please please can we have the kimono back. It was an iconic feature of Sakura Karma. It gave her grace and class, in a sea of skimpy tupperware **** and big booty female champions.

As a Karma fan, (pun unintended) I have to say that Sun Goddess was always my favorite. I loved the coloring of it, and how her skirt seemed metallic and really nicely done. I am a sucker for color. That is why I liked the subtle details in Sakura Karma as well. This one thought.. the lower half seems .. muddy. Please know I am trying to be objective and not insulting. The spring green with that cerise pink of the top seems to clash with the colors on the bottom. (Also have you thought about maybe changing the red streaks in her hair to pink?) . If the skin requires extra work, why not make it a 1350 skin ala Dragon Trainer Lulu? I think this is something that if the fans desire it, then they will pay for the extra time and effort put into it.

Also, one more question/constructive suggestion - with Sakura Karma's face, I know much has been said about her makeup. My question was more along the lines of what about giving her a traditional geisha look, with the start white face, with some cerise pink lips and help to emphasize her eye makeup more.

Thank you though for the work you do, just wanted to give my 2 cents


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Whyumai

Senior Member

03-19-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by IronStylus View Post
Yup. That's why I'm cool with tanking it =)
inb4 next tank champion is a parrot.


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BuddyBoombox

Senior Member

03-19-2013

I may be reading too far into this... but I really hope a legendary skin comes out with a wicked awesome kimono.


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Letler

Senior Member

03-19-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by IronStylus View Post
We do indeed animate differently. There's no cloth simulation, no real-time physics engine, it's all hand-crafted. This makes fabrics in general very taxing on the animators, and when things go astray, where there's clipping, or a particular animation might cause the polys to deform badly, we have to edit. It's not about "are we up to the challenge", there are physical limitations we do have to deal with, and we do have to make cost/benefit analysis at times. It can be an issue of practicality, feasibility and payoff.

Ohmikegoodness is an absolute authority on this. He can tell you personally how difficult Queen Ashe and Divine Soraka were.
Yet those were completed and work fine. I'm confused. As someone who paid for Sakura Karma because of how it looks this new skin isn't a good work around in my opinion. With technical limitations I still think something better could be made. At least make it look less ugly, the color scheme doesn't match the original. The purple-ish pants just make her lower half look large and odd.


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le Ketsuno Ana

Junior Member

03-19-2013

Indeed the new sakura karma far from its original concept imo.

In a short explanation on my beliefs...

The bottom dress does not match the top. Its a simple design matter, the top is robust, have lots of fabric, does not offer high mobility and freedom, its stiff. The bottom, is a ninja dress, almost no cloth, legs out, high mobility, totally free.

But what are exactly the problems with the animations?
imo, a full set traditional kimono offers no mobility at all, mainly once wearing it you can barely do a normal sized step. Considering the speed you have to travel in game, it would pretty awkward seeing the champion walking with lots of small steps. It will certainly generate a bad effect in game.
To make the champion use large steps would deform lots of polygons in the model, stretch textures and still wouldn't have a great effect overall in game.
I believe that the best choice to cover it would be to make a bottom like Setsuna's from Soul Calibur. Which is an open bottom kimono. By doing so, you can still have Karma stand animation to be classy by stand still having her legs all covered with style. As she moves, her legs will just go out as the fabric allows it. Allowing great animation to be created. It would be even more interesting if we had 2 or 3 animations for her running according to its movespeed. This would allow the player to get a good felling off her classy kimono out on the start of the game as she can run with smaller steps and a bit more "cautious"... as the game proceeds and she gets up to a certain speed she just start using larger steps allowing her to still be within the game and not looking awkward.

It seems that this solution is doable imo, but it would give a lot of trouble and hardwork for the animators. As I don't know how tight is their schedule I can't tell if its viable or not.

The bottom line for me is, a kimono isnt a battle suit, it seemed a good idea by the time it was created and with the old karma looks, but right now, with the new model it just doesnt fit if you take in consideration the problems you'll have to implement it in game.

But I believe that you should do it anyway as a form of respect to everyone that already have bought this skin.

I didnt read the whole thread, just some posts here and there.


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Letler

Senior Member

03-19-2013

All this ends up feeling like, especially when you say Queen Ashe and Divine Soraka were technically annoying, yet still completed, is that a half baked original Karma is getting a half baked "who cares" remake and visual update.


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MrTharne

Senior Member

03-19-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Letler View Post
All this ends up feeling like, especially when you say Queen Ashe and Divine Soraka were technically annoying, yet still completed, is that a half baked original Karma is getting a half baked "who cares" remake and visual update.
The problem is that Soraka and Ashe are two very static champions, they don't do extreme moves with their legs, if you look at some of Karma's new animations here : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qZ_lu...layer_embedded you see than she does a lot of movements with her legs, and i think it may cause a tons of clipping.

And then remember that Sakura Karma is a 520RP skin, they can't do different animations for this skin only, it would make the skin more valuable than it costs now, so they would have to change the price, refund all people that already have it and then everybody has to pay it back for more RP if they want it again. And then people would complain.

They can improve the new Sakura skin (and they should), but they can't make a full kimono.