[GUIDE] Masteries

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Shirokuma

The Council

09-28-2009

Quote:
Originally Posted by QUICKSLIDE View Post
He makes a good point. I think people are too hard on the gold over time items. What we should really be looking at is WHEN you get these bonuses.

A perfect example is jungling. You generally want to spec your runes and masteries so you are more effective at level 1. Obviously gold over time items wont help you here. However, if you are playing a carry character, what Pious Flea mentioned becomes very important. Why spend a mastery point for 0.66% crit chance when you can get more from the gold you get from greed or an avarice rune.

Point being, dont always take the most common opinion on a forum as law. You need to remember that most people here are followers and will blindly quote people they feel know more then them.
You have to equate when exactly the point becomes valid though. In all of his examples, he was stating the net value after 30 minutes. That's great and all, but the +HP you get from stacking Quints with Fortitude runes is instant. I'd much rather have that +120 HP on the first wave to help me get first blood safely than 3 runes that I have to wait on to become useful. Also, any which way you look at it, Gold/10 items don't really help you much once you have all 6 of your items.


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ZGBudai

Member

09-28-2009

I get greed simply because sometimes that 100 - 300g could be helpful for buying an item that you would otherwise not buy simply because you were 50 - 70g off and you don't want to wait a minute at the base for no reason.

Greed saves you 1 minute or so which is precious in a game where a comeback push could come any second.


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Arlando

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Senior Member

12-25-2009

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shirokuma View Post
You have to equate when exactly the point becomes valid though. In all of his examples, he was stating the net value after 30 minutes. That's great and all, but the +HP you get from stacking Quints with Fortitude runes is instant. I'd much rather have that +120 HP on the first wave to help me get first blood safely than 3 runes that I have to wait on to become useful. Also, any which way you look at it, Gold/10 items don't really help you much once you have all 6 of your items.
heres some more fuel. to me item spaces are very valuable. itemizing those bonuses is pointless if you dont have a slot available and the only way to get those bonuses is a mastery or rune. this is on top of being able to start with the bonus of a rune or mastery.


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Eviant

Senior Member

01-13-2010

Personally, Greed, I find pretty useless.
My suggestion is to go buy a 5 gold/10 second item.
But when you buy it, make sure it matches with your character.
Kage's pick= 25 ability power
Avarice blade= 12% crit (I think...may be wrong)
Philosopher's stone= Health and Mana regen Bonuses.

Now here is the real bonus, They can all be gained rather early, (As they generally cost between 700-1200)
Provide the bonus for most of the game, and if the game does make it to 6 item slots,
You just sell the item back for 50% of the total price.

So I argue against Greed, unless as one person said, they really have no other place to put a point.


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Eviant

Senior Member

01-13-2010

And also, I forgot to point out, that Archmage's Savvy, (+0.2 ability power)
Is a per level ability. Meaning it's +3.6 when you reach level 18.
So with three simple skill points, it becomes 10.8 at 18.
While that alone is not much, those abilities come in very handy when you factor attack speed,
All the other little bonuses, and the fact that they really save those item places/early gold.

And Brute force is great for an early starter, making those kills just a tad bit easier to make.


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Aregionius

Senior Wrenchman

01-13-2010

I agree with you on Greed, even if your game lasts an hour, you only get 360 gold over that entire duration.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eviant View Post
And also, I forgot to point out, that Archmage's Savvy, (+0.2 ability power)
Is a per level ability. Meaning it's +3.6 when you reach level 18.
So with three simple skill points, it becomes 10.8 at 18.
While that alone is not much, those abilities come in very handy when you factor attack speed,
All the other little bonuses, and the fact that they really save those item places/early gold.
This one not so much. Archmage's Savvy is +.6 AP per level. Which maxed out gives you 1.8 AP at level one and 32.4 AP by level 18. If you're a caster trying to squeeze every last bit of damage out, or if you don't use Exhaust or Smite, it's better than nothing.

Really though, in the same vein as Greed, even a champion with decent AP ratios like Veigar will get only ~2 additional damage at level one on Dark Matter or ~40 damage to his ult at level 18. Neither one of those is really going to make any difference.


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Phi Trigger

Senior Member

02-26-2010

Greed and avarice should give you gold straight up at the start....THEN they would be interesting. Perhaps each gives +50 gold at start. Then it would be much more of a consideration.


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Eviant

Senior Member

03-04-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aregionius View Post
I agree with you on Greed, even if your game lasts an hour, you only get 360 gold over that entire duration.



This one not so much. Archmage's Savvy is +.6 AP per level. Which maxed out gives you 1.8 AP at level one and 32.4 AP by level 18. If you're a caster trying to squeeze every last bit of damage out, or if you don't use Exhaust or Smite, it's better than nothing.

Really though, in the same vein as Greed, even a champion with decent AP ratios like Veigar will get only ~2 additional damage at level one on Dark Matter or ~40 damage to his ult at level 18. Neither one of those is really going to make any difference.
No, but that's 3 skill points, out of 30. The point in the tree, or in the runes, is not to make an amazing ability all on their own. For example, 9 greater glyphs of force, (0.17 AP/level) Equals 27.54 AP at level 18. Archmage's Savvy, for a tier one mastery, provides 0.6 AP/level, totally 10.8 at level 18, which beats out 3 glyphs of force. Yet, everyone looks to grab a full page to match their champions, but become less concerned with masteries.

And to the OP, yes, you are right, brute force is 1/3 of a cheap item, but than again, items will always outweigh masteries and Runes, simply because they are the last and often times, most crucial parts in hero customization.


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Kilrog1

Junior Member

05-31-2010

I want to point out one thing you may not be aware of, frozt:

Harden skin in the defence tree is very good if you just upgrade it once.

Level 1 - Blocks 1 physical damage
Level 2 - Blocks 1.5 physical damage
Level 3 - Blocks 2 physical damage

So at level 1 it gives 1 boost and level 2 and 3 it just gives 0.5 boost.

Maybe add that as a tip as well?


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Addrämelech

Junior Member

04-25-2011

very useful thank you


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