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How to build Zilean - post nerfs

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The GZA

Member

10-25-2010

For some reason it keeps saying access denied when trying to search the forums so I appologize if this has been discussed before.

I took a break for several months, and have recently came back. Since then Zilean has received an AP nerf as well as some cooldown changes/nerfs. My previous build used to be Something like 9/0/21 with Mana regen and CDR runes to 9%. This gave around 15% total.

For items id go mostly AP and a frozen heart to hit 40% cdr. The general build would go:
Rod of ages piece
Mobility boots
Soulstealer
Finish rod
Frozen heart piece
Finish heart/banshee veil/the 40% penetration wand depending
Zhonyas

Recently, I've found that the AP ratio nerf affects bombs a lot, which hinders farming which snowballs into less items in the midgame. Similarly, the CDR doesn't affect rewind as well, because of the change to it's cooldown and mechanics. Zil seems to be strictly support now.

What are others doing as Zilean? Can he still be successful as AP, or should I focus more on Support items?


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xPhantasm

Senior Member

10-25-2010

search function hasn't worked in the LoL forums since I started playing, theres no such thing as double posts on these forums.


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xahhfink6

Senior Member

10-25-2010

Dear god no... Get AA over RoA and DFG over Frozen heart...

and never EVER get anything besides mercury treads


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The GZA

Member

10-25-2010

Ok... so are you implying to stick with an AP build? What other item would you suggest for the last 10% CDR?

I always liked the RoA over AA staff for the extra health, plus the first piece (catalyst I think) is good for laning. But it more recently it's been taking forever to farm for RoA, which makes it that much less useful, so AA may indeed be a more reasonable choice.

As for boots, unless they've got an excessive amount of disables, I'm going Mobility. Being able to catch an enemy, or make a clutch save from halfway across the map is very valuable. I always roll with cleanse in case I need to break stun to cast ult.

Back to the topic tho, would you say that AP is still viable? Or is it more worthwhile to just go full support?


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Everspace

Senior Member

10-25-2010

I think either one is still viable.

The extra HP on R is nice, and bombs are so boss.

I would do a meeting in between the two, grabbing 1/2 this and 1/2 that.


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Wonton55

Senior Member

10-25-2010

Zil's my main and here's how I built him 2 weeks ago:

Magic Pen Marks
MP5/level Seals
CD/level glyphs
2 CD/level quints, 1 health quint
9/0/21

Above gives me a little over 20% CDR at level 18.

Clarity + Clairvoyance

Meki Pendant
Tear of the Goddess
Merc Treads
Archangel's Staff
Glacial Shroud
Guardian Angel

40% CDR, lots of mana, free revive for lulz. Game ends by this point in 19 cases out of 20, but if it doesn't, i get Zhonya's or Banshee's, depending on how cocky I'm feeling.


Now, recently, I've found this built has two flaws:
a) Zilean has the 3rd-lowest armor (after Heimer and Fiddles) and close to the lowest health in the game. This makes me squishy early game and I die early a fair bit.
b) Because of Shroud and Guardian Angel, late game I end up with close to 200 armor, and only 60 MR. This is usually impractical, because about 70% of teams output more magical than physical damage late game.

Haven't figured out the best solution to that yet. Perhaps Kindlegem + Spirit Visage? Or Fiendish Codex + Soul Shroud and flat cooldown glyphs? Dunno. Will need to test these ideas.

P.S. Before you post "lol nub, needz moar AP", I mostly play with friends, so i can safely play support and expect them to dish out most of the damage. In solo queue, where you can't trust your teammates as much, this may work as well.


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Larson McMurphy

Senior Member

10-25-2010

Don't get DFG, glacial shroud is the most efficient CDR item in the game. If you're not dieing to auto-attacks all the time there is no need to upgrade to a frozen heart unless you have full inventory and nothing else to upgrade. You need to get close to the cap as soon as possible though.

Don't rush Archangels either, let that tear sit in your inventory for a while.

AP is still good because it affects Zil's ult so much. With a few hundred AP you'll be bringing people back to life with most of their health, which will make a big difference in a team fight.

Overall, I would say the order of importance of stats for Zil would be Mana (and mana regen), CDR, AP, survivability (but you get get plenty of survivability attached to items that offer the aforementioned stats).

Alternatively you could rate survivability higher than AP. However, if your going for glacial shroud for mana and CDR, you'll have plenty of armor, so if you just get some mag res you won't have to worry as much about getting health and you'll be pretty tough to kill. I like to get abyssal scepter and merc treads for that purpose.

So basically he really is mostly a support champ, but AP is still a good enough boost that you should get plenty of it.


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Wonton55

Senior Member

10-26-2010

I agree with everything Larson just said. I've found that if I keep Tear till the 25th minute, I'll STILL be gaining mana from its passive, and it stacks with Archangel's, so you want to squeeze as much out of it as possible. Get your first CDR item before you finish Archangel's. Also, AP Zilean doesn't really work anymore with the reduced AP ratio. Sure, you can still steamroll if you're fed, but who can't? Being able to carry if fed is not a good definition for a good AP champion. Zilean is now primarily support, so your priority should be to have:

1a) 40% CDR as quickly as possible.
1b) Equally as important, enough mana and mana regen to be able to spam your spells even with 40% CDR. A high-level Zil is burninig 270 mana every 3.6 seconds. If you have to return to base every 3 minutes to get mana back, you're useless to your team.
2) Survivability. If you're having to constantly revive yourself with your ultimate, you're even MORE useless to your team (not building AP, remember?), as then you're really only a haste/slow machine.

And Glacial Shroud is by far the most CDR/gold you can get from items. It also gives armor and mana, two things Zilean definitely needs (though MR is very important to get too).


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