Welcome to the Forum Archive!

Years of conversation fill a ton of digital pages, and we've kept all of it accessible to browse or copy over. Whether you're looking for reveal articles for older champions, or the first time that Rammus rolled into an "OK" thread, or anything in between, you can find it here. When you're finished, check out the boards to join in the latest League of Legends discussions.

GO TO BOARDS


Please explain to me how Riven nerfs are fair.

Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Spawnblade

Senior Member

12-24-2012

These threads...

They buffed her shield to compensate for the hp/5. Her ult cooldown was toned down to be more in line with other champs' ults. Previously, it was up twice for every one time most of her opponents' were at early levels.

I don't get why supposed Riven players are complaining when she is one of the champions who benefited the most, by far, from the S3 item rework. Black Cleaver and the Hydra were practically made for her. They upped the cost for defensive items and lowered the cost for AD items. She's one of the few champions who can build offensive and have it make her more tanky.

If you can't still stomp your lane with these nerfs, then you're just a bad Riven.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Irelia Bot

Member

12-24-2012

It really does suck. I know that it was comming but not to this extent and the 10 extra shield does not make up for the lack of health regen. I will not be using Riven much until she is fixed.

Well off to play Irelia, Olaf, Shen and I guess work on vlad who seems to still be viable no matter how much he gets nerfed.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Samwel93

Senior Member

12-24-2012

Quote:
These threads...

They buffed her shield to compensate for the hp/5. Her ult cooldown was toned down to be more in line with other champs' ults. Previously, it was up twice for every one time most of her opponents' were at early levels.

I don't get why supposed Riven players are complaining when she is one of the champions who benefited the most, by far, from the S3 item rework. Black Cleaver and the Hydra were practically made for her. They upped the cost for defensive items and lowered the cost for AD items. She's one of the few champions who can build offensive and have it make her more tanky.

If you can't still stomp your lane with these nerfs, then you're just a bad Riven.


My main problem with the nerfs is that Riot's logic behind them seems flawed. Statikk said that the nerfs to her hp5 were to stress the importance of using valor to trade, but any Riven player who had basic knowledge of the champion was already doing that and there were already many lanes that Riven loses trades in if you weren't careful. The nerfs aren't unjustified they are just excessive. Also building hydra on Riven is a huge waste of money her ability to deal dmg to multiple targets is already better than many other top lanes and that's really her only strength in a teamfight vs other tops and almost every top lane benefited from the black cleaver especially those who already had armor pen built in like Olaf, Darius, and now Vi(although Vi is better in the jungle than in lane) the only top really hurt by the itemization change is Irelia but her kit is just so good for what she does that it really won't matter in the long run. Also yes Riven's shield gets bigger from her AD but she is still the squishiest top lane that you see commonly by a pretty large margin.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

X74

Senior Member

12-24-2012

Quote:
Spawnblade:
She's one of the few champions who can build offensive and have it make her more tanky.



I never understood why people insist on saying this, since many champions labeled "tank" can actually do this. Like Galio, Malphite, etc.

As you all know health does not make you tankier. If you build all health, take a crit and have no armor to back it up, you're going to die in maybe 3-4 hits. I witnessed this when I was actually playing Riven against an all-health/AP hybrid Cho'Gath. He was killing EVERYONE, but as soon as I got IE, I burned my abilities on Cho and 3-shotted him with crits while my cooldowns were up and all of the sudden, Cho went from supertank status to squishy. But that's exactly what Riven's shield is: It's a health barrier, it doesn't make her "tanky" to be able to throw up some health every few seconds, especially when you realize just how weak the shield really is. Her AD does not give her more armor, it allows her to have a stronger health-shield for 2.5 seconds so she doesn't die as soon as she goes into a fight, and sometimes, will die anyway.

And it's not the fact that a good Riven player still won't be able to stomp their lane with enough effort, but moreso the fact that there is no reason behind the nerfs, at least to the degree they were done. Her hp/5 shouldn't have taken such a hard hit and neither should the ult. Although, I'm more worried about the hp/5 decrease due to bleeding effects or poison such as the ones Teemo, Draven or Darius can do. Teemo and Darius are already brick walls to break down at top lane; Teemo doesn't allow you to farm at all unless you're hyper-aggressive and can make him realize you're not scared of his poison dart. However, now that she has less ways in the means of recovering from the poison darts, since hp/5 will barely compensate for it, it will be harder to actually not be afraid of it and charge in to make him think twice about shooting you. Darius heavily outdamages Riven early in the game, and hemmorhage is the same thing as Teemo's poison; Riven won't be able to compensate for that damage.

Riven is not tanky no matter how much AD you give her, if you've seen her get focused you'd know this.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Souldier

Senior Member

12-24-2012

The point is that Riven's advantage comes from her early power. By cutting her hp5 not by 1, not 2, not 3, but by 4, and only increasing her shield by 10 to compensate, it is completely unfair and hurts her potential to snowball (and she needs to snowball to be useful)

AND her increase cd on her ult ALSO hurts her ability to trade an since her only ranged attack is her ult (which is an execution) she will have a impossible time trading.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Ogaflow

Senior Member

12-24-2012

The argument she isn't better then jax or irelia is faulty at best. Do you guys not remember that irelia and jax are the reason top lane is so messed up? Riven beats nearly all other top laners if played properly despite how well the enemy plays. If her power is lowered, it just means it will be easier to lower the power of jax and irelia without the worry of riven becoming the new terror of top lane.

Though to be honest they could give her back 1 or 2 hp5 and it shouldn't be a problem.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Souldier

Senior Member

12-24-2012

Quote:
Ogaflow:
The argument she isn't better then jax or irelia is faulty at best. Do you guys not remember that irelia and jax are the reason top lane is so messed up? Riven beats nearly all other top laners if played properly despite how well the enemy plays. If her power is lowered, it just means it will be easier to lower the power of jax and irelia without the worry of riven becoming the new terror of top lane.

Though to be honest they could give her back 1 or 2 hp5 and it shouldn't be a problem.


To be clear, I never said "OMG WHY YOU NERF GO NERF DARIUS QQ"
To sum it up, they shouldn't have nerfed her so hard. I agree wih your
"Though to be honest they could give her back 1 or 2 hp5 and it shouldn't be a problem."

And her ult needs to be only 10-15 cd increase not 35.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

X74

Senior Member

12-24-2012

Quote:
Ogaflow:
The argument she isn't better then jax or irelia is faulty at best. Do you guys not remember that irelia and jax are the reason top lane is so messed up? Riven beats nearly all other top laners if played properly despite how well the enemy plays


Any champion beats any other champion "if played properly". Otherwise, they wouldn't be playing them properly in such an instance. Also, I can name plenty of instances where a Jax has absolutely destroyed a good Riven, same with Irelia. It's all about counterplay and skill level. There are no champions that beat other champions indisputably just because of the fact that they're "that champion's counter", and I don't care what you say to try to prove it. "Counters" also only apply to early game matchups, because where a good Riven may beat Jax early game, which is debatable due to the above statements, if that Jax is good, they may learn to annihilate that good Riven later. There is no single champion that is responsible for the instability of top lane, it's the fact that top lane is the most aggressive lane where a champion gets fed quickly, or turns useless quickly; the snowballing factor.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

1LL0G1CAL

Junior Member

12-24-2012

Quote:
X74X:
as soon as I got IE


You build Infinity Edge on Riven... that's just wrong. BT is not only cheaper, but also a more reliable source of damage. And on top of that, it gives you sustain- lifesteal.

Quote:
Riven is not tanky no matter how much AD you give her, if you've seen her get focused you'd know this.


You're supposed to build according to the enemy team. Get a hexdrinker. Get an Atmas, Randuin's or Frozen Mallet, well you can actually get all three now that Randuin's gives some decent health, and build to counter your enemy.

Quote:
As you all know health does not make you tankier


Building health prevents you from being bursted down. Its why supports in all the major championships used to build heart of gold instead of philosophers stone first. Supports are squishy and bursted down easily.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Samwel93

Senior Member

12-24-2012

Quote:
You're supposed to build according to the enemy team. Get a hexdrinker. Get an Atmas, Randuin's or Frozen Mallet, well you can actually get all three now that Randuin's gives some decent health, and build to counter your enemy.


Just wanted to tell you that every prominent Riven player says that frozen mallet is a supreme waste of money on Riven, she has no need for the slow as she is already fantastic at sticking on a target. Atma's is also a wasted slot on almost everyone now, with 3k health which is something that is realistically obtainable on Riven she will only be getting 45 dmg which is the same as a bfs where your money would be better spent.