@Morello, can you explain the design philosophy used for nerfing champions?

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Morello

Lead Designer

12-19-2012
29 of 32 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain America View Post
It's all for sales. Think they'd release a super UP champ so no one buys them? Major UPness is very rare. Extreme OPness is easy to see and usually the case.
Burden of proof is on the state. Show that pattern if you would.


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Morello

Lead Designer

12-19-2012
30 of 32 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Noobgrenade View Post
Tinfoil hat time!
Mmhmm!


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Best Furry NA

Member

12-19-2012

Morello.

Sound sense, great attitude, and best of all...

Noxus Hunter Anivia as an icon.... Frick yeah. (Currently in a thread trying to get 2k upvotes for Team Spirit, but guess which skin I use now :P )


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Skaarrjj

Senior Member

12-19-2012

http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/....php?t=2919441

Read that Morello, don't reply to it as I dont want to take away views from this thread, but I kinda see a pattern developing that I think is hurting balance more than it is helping it.


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666AlucarD666

Junior Member

12-19-2012

Morello, you saw "The Tear of the Goddess" on this item is designed that the ability cooldown is 3 seconds but can be repeated and no matter the cooldown. Why? You Can spamming it


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KevinDelMarr

Senior Member

12-19-2012

Morello, am I wrong or misguided in my firm belief that Jax is just a glorified melee Carry? He has a strong AS steroid (84% late game with max stacks) and his Ult gives him a good damage burst every few attacks (along with his W). What sets him apart is his defensive steroids on his Ult and hard CC and more defense in Counter Strike.

Imagine if Master Yi's Ult gave him increased resistances, or Wuju style block the next CC when activated. Or Tryndamere, if his Ult reduced the effectiveness of slows, maybe Blood Lust gives him a more meaningful heal with less drawback. Fiora would gain enhanced durability and utility as well.

While I am sure I'm forgetting key features here, overall I just see Jax as a melee Carry who Riot was generous enough to give non-gimmicky survivability to, steroids and defensive boosts you would expect on a Bruiser and melee carry seperate, not combined. Are you guys afraid you would have a bunch of Jax's running around if the melee carries got extensive love? Or is there something I'm missing? (Olaf seems to be the same)


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RockJockey

Senior Member

12-19-2012

Dear Morello,

Since we are talking about champion nerfs and buffs: There are several champions which I play that make me think, "Boy, if this guys had an AD or an AP ratio on this x skill, it would be great".

A historical example would be Twitch. I believe he was one of the older champions, and some people complained about his Ability power ratio on his E Expunge. (Why have an AP ratio if he scales better with AD) And of course, Riot heard us and eventually gave us an AD ratio on his E. Thank you for that.

Champions I would consider adding a ratio include:

Mordekaiser: an AD ratio on his E Syphon of Destruction. I like to play AD Mordekaiser, even though it's considered troll build. If he had even a super low ratio it would make it possible. I know his kit is geared towards AP, and this might affect his gameplay massively. Please consider.

Gangplank: an AD ratio on his Ultimate. Gangplank deals pitiful damage with his Ultimate, and on top of that its unreliable (random on purpose). Essentially its a giant slow. An AD ratio would give him a little more bite.

Leona: AD ratio on her Q or W. it would make her more viable in another role besides bot support. She is pigeon-holed into that role, as much as I love it.

Rammus: Move the damage portion from Q to his E. Rammus has a lot of utility, but damage isn't part of it outside of his ultimate. Since no one builds AP Rammus, building Ability Power or Magic Penetration is generally considered useless. Since everyone maxes his E first, would Riot consider giving it some damage?

Fizz: AD ratio on his Q, not necessary, but would be nice since a number of people do play him that way.

Any of my suggested changes may or may not change gameplay on the above champions, but I would like to hear your thoughts.

Sincerely,
Rockjockey


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Morello

Lead Designer

12-19-2012
31 of 32 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by KevinDelMarr View Post
Morello, am I wrong or misguided in my firm belief that Jax is just a glorified melee Carry? He has a strong AS steroid (84% late game with max stacks) and his Ult gives him a good damage burst every few attacks (along with his W). What sets him apart is his defensive steroids on his Ult and hard CC and more defense in Counter Strike.

Imagine if Master Yi's Ult gave him increased resistances, or Wuju style block the next CC when activated. Or Tryndamere, if his Ult reduced the effectiveness of slows, maybe Blood Lust gives him a more meaningful heal with less drawback. Fiora would gain enhanced durability and utility as well.

While I am sure I'm forgetting key features here, overall I just see Jax as a melee Carry who Riot was generous enough to give non-gimmicky survivability to, steroids and defensive boosts you would expect on a Bruiser and melee carry seperate, not combined. Are you guys afraid you would have a bunch of Jax's running around if the melee carries got extensive love? Or is there something I'm missing? (Olaf seems to be the same)
Jax is a fighter, and the distinction is the tools we let him have - things like a stun and beefiness (as well as non-DPS build paths that make sense) make him a fighter. I'm actually worried that by making those guys so good, we can't make glass cannon melee good.


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NotBuzzJack

Senior Member

12-19-2012

Glass cannon melee equates to assassin sadly.


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KevinDelMarr

Senior Member

12-19-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Morello View Post
Jax is a fighter, and the distinction is the tools we let him have - things like a stun and beefiness (as well as non-DPS build paths that make sense) make him a fighter. I'm actually worried that by making those guys so good, we can't make glass cannon melee good.
Do melee glass cannons (like Fiora, Master Yi, Tryndamere) have to exist? Like is there an omnipotent rule that this type of class can never be removed? A class with what seems to be so many underlying problems. Do you believe their problems can be fixed, is it worth the effort? Would changing Fiora, Master Yi, Tryndamere into fighters, along the direction of Jax in some regards ruin the diversity and customization we all love? Am I asking too many questions? This seems to be more relevant to another Thread (something I would be very interested in having) so I won't continue after this. I just can't shake the idea of Jax being a strengthened carry. To each his own