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Looking for Sejuani Feedback

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2pudge1cup

Senior Member

12-15-2012

Quote:
Meddler:
Hi folks,

We’re considering making some gameplay changes to Sejuani at the moment. As a result I'm looking to gather some thoughts on her current gameplay, in particular:

1. What do you like about her current kit/what would you be saddened to see changed or removed?

2. What do you dislike about her current kit?

3. What would you like to see tweaked or added?


Feedback much appreciated, this sort of discussion's been really valuable when doing previous gameplay changes. I'll be reading through every response here, though I won't have the time to respond directly to most of the posts unfortunately. I'll also be reading through a bunch of previous Sejuani discussion threads, wanted to create a new one though to get people's impressions in light of all the recent pre-season changes.



1) Her ultimate

2) It feels like a bunch of things that were done before only with this ice mechanic thing added. Her gap closer was seen a bunch of times, only this adds ice. Her passive is junk only it adds ice. Her W doesn't add ice charges which is a bit counter intuitive to the rest of her kit. Her E just feels kind of weird since it can only apply to those who have ice, but she can only get ice from attacking or using her initiation/escape move. It doesn't really have a lot of synergy aside from being a walking ult in teamfights. I also find it very difficult to justify the 6300 ip price for a champ which just looks like quite a few things that we've seen before.

3) Some kind of mr/ar steroid maybe attach it to the W or E depending on how may targets are perma-frosted? Maybe her passive automatically swapping to perma-frost if she attacks a target x amount of times? I don't really know. If you ask me she's going to need a total rework because if the slow numbers are increased on her kit she'll be overpowered and impossible to deal with. If she's given a reliable steroid again she has it in her to be a considerably more annoying version of amumu. Her whole synergy thing is cute, but it doesn't really give her a niche that other junglers can't do. She doesn't have a tank steroid either plus W scaling with bonus hp is really wonky in general. Damage should rarely if ever scale with defense and vice versa. That's why there's quite a few problems like riven who gets everything from just AD.


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Aaron Sharp Jr

Junior Member

12-15-2012

Her ult is really strong, maybe a stun on her charge instead of just applying her passive, her passive i feel is really underpowered, maybe make it sort of like twitches where it can stack, maybe 10% per stack capping at 3 per enemy champ, and make her permafrost work with that?


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Valenten

Senior Member

12-15-2012

i like her "you arent getting away from me" aspect. the slows are awesome her kit synergyzes well. one thing i can think of that would help her out more is if her w applied the slow that you can use your e with to permafrost them. dont change her ult its an amazing initiation tool. one thing that could be changed is that she has like a defense steroid on one of her skills so she can be tanky without having to build so much for it. those are really the only things i could suggest other than upping her damage a little so if she gets into a fight she can actually defend herself. As she is right now she is heavily reliant on her team to be able to get kills unless you are chasing them forever.


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Fire Fist Fenix

Senior Member

12-15-2012

I think a movement speed buff would be nice, shes a bit on the slow side and the passive should slow by at least 12 percent not 10.


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Rabbi LilGandhi

Junior Member

12-15-2012

I thought that being able to break through Anivia and J4 barriers was a great mechanic, and for some reason you guys removed it.


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Telzin

Senior Member

12-15-2012

I like her ultimate and the interaction between her W and passive.

Her E is considerably powerful, but has, I think too steep a mana cost for what it does.
Maybe tweak the cost, or maybe keep it the same but have it affect non-frosted enemies by applying frost to them (rather than permafrost)?

The only complaint about her Q is that the cooldown is incredibly long for what it does and costs.

Her passive also seems to be a bit weak, numbers-wise. 10% slow just doesn't cut it, and her cooldowns and mana costs make applying permafrost something that won't happen as much as you'd want.

All-in-all I'd say just some number tweaks on her passive, Q, and E. W and R feel just right where they are.

My two cents anyway.

EDIT: Maybe you could even have her passive be a stacking one. Maybe something like 10/15/20% slow, and have intensifying effects on her W and permafrost from E?


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volaju

Senior Member

12-15-2012

She has no one point wonders, every skill needs to be maxed to be useful.

Her E is all of her CC, but it's not strong until it's maxed out, so it demands maxing first, otherwise your ganks contribute very little outside of ulty CD. Her W is pretty much all her sustained damage, and not only that, but the scaling on it improves with levels as well, it's not even flat scaling, which again means you need to dump points in to do meaningful damage. Then her Q, which applies frost to all her targets which is important for the rest of her kit, and is her significant gap closer / escape has a ridiculous CD of 19 seconds at rank 1, which is absurd. You need to level it to get that down to a reasonable CD, and atm, it gets maxed last. This means that since for whatever reason, all her abilities need levels, you're stuck with a once per fight Q the entire game as a result, since you had to level W and E. No one point wonder to work with.

I'd suggest you just make her Q have a flat low CD from rank one, and just improve the damage scaling with levels, like Gragas body slam.

Beyond that, I think her kit requiring her frost passive to do everything is kind of lame. W does little damage to anyone that isn't frosted, and permafrost doesn't even effect people that aren't frosted. It would be better if her E applied permafrost to all targets in the AoE range of it regardless, and allow that permafrost to enable the damage bonus on W. Bam, now she has two ways to apply frost to AoE targets easily, and the interaction is still there for at least one ability, W. You no longer have to struggle with trying to auto attack everyone, or use a 19 second CD Q to AoE frost targets before you can get off your only non ulty CC, permafrost.

Also it goes without saying her passive is terrible. Either give her a little bonus damage on auto attack from it like how Naut's passive onhit contributes to his damage, or make the slow scale from 10% level 1, to something like 20% level 18.


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GasPoweredSt1ck

Senior Member

12-15-2012

1. What do you like about her current kit/what would you be saddened to see changed or removed?

Well, I like the mobility and damage that her kit has potential to have in the late game. The way that I see it, every good tank has 3 to 4 of the 5 things that makes tanks strong. These things include defense steroids, sustain, mobility, tank scaling damage (Damage that gets better or is high naturally when you're built tank), and CC. Sejuani has 3 things, but to be honest, they are all decently lack luster. I would be very disappointed if they removed her health scaling damage. Health is very strong and plentiful in Season 3, so she has received a buff. (Not one big enough to make her viable in competitive play.)

2. What do you dislike about her current kit?

High cooldowns in the early game is my main complaint. Mainly on her Q. I don't really want to make comparisons to other champions, but the cooldown on the skill is really high for what it actually allows you to do. The AOE for the slow application is fairly low and certain champions have similar dashes that do more on a similar cooldown. (Shen's taunt) Stopping on the first person hit is also a problem with it since it makes it so her mobility can't land her into the back lines where she needs to be. If she isn't in the back lines, she melts due to the lack of a defense steroid.

3. What would you like to see tweaked or added?

I'm just going to list a couple things that can be done to buff her. Not all of these need to be done together. 1 or 2 would be good.

defense steroids - I believe that some sort of % damage reduction based on which champions are slow, stunned or snared that is attached to her abilities or passive would help her in the jungle and in fights. Attaching it to her passive makes her passive stronger and make it scale through levels. If you attach it to an ability, it allows for more variety in what to max first if the % scales well enough, but it is potentially dangerous if the % is too strong when it actually is maxed in the mid game.

mobility - I already mentioned that her Q needs a shorter cooldown and go through units somehow. Also, a buff to her base movement speed or some sort of % movement speed buff on her ability would be good. (Like a passive on her Q to give scaling % ms. Like 5% at max level.) With the loss of FoN, itemization for full tanks to get Movement Speed is minimal.

CC - Adding a TINY knockback on to her Q would resolve both her problems with mobility and give her a bit more CC. Alternatively, you can add a mini-stun (.5 second stun) to her E to allow her to have hard CC outside for her ultimate, but it would be really hard to balance due to the late game cooldown of her E. If the stun is half a second, it is essentially not even noticeable against someone with tenacity.

Remember that all of these buffs are not to be seen together and can be toned down. And Sejuani only needs buffs to see competitive play, but otherwise, she is just fine other than her underwhelming state.


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Krampus Claus

Senior Member

12-15-2012

1. I like her health ratio on W, it's like a reverse amumu W (scales off your health instead of their health), I like that her kit has some apparent synergy between the abilities, and I like that she has high base armor now!

2. I dislike her lack of sustain/shield for the jungle, her low base stats for an AP bruiser, her high cooldowns, and the fact that it's hard to maintain her passive on multiple targets for the purpose of nothern winds. What it comes down to is that she is outclassed by junglers like Mundo, Maokai, Malphite, Amumu and Cho'Gath, each of which have [1] more utility, [2] better base stats, [3] sustain/mitigation and/or [4] more damage, and all of which have much safer first clears. Also her E isn't really a satisfying ability.

3. Tweaks?
- Buff her health regen per lvl, maybe also her health per lvl
- her passive: 10% slow is pretty lame for a passive, make it scale with lvls, up to 15-20%
- her Q: the problem is it's a low damage spell with low AoE, low range, and low CC on a high cooldown. Reducing the cooldown is important since it's the only way to keep up her damage on northern winds, but buffing any of those other areas would be nice
- her E: feels awkward, why level it up when you need more damage on your W and reduced cooldowns on your Q? Consider reworking this spell to fix some of her low CC or low sustain problems (have it give her a small shield that scales up to a cap for each unit effected?).


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KorgothBarbaria

Senior Member

12-15-2012

1. I love how all of her kit works around her passive, one of my favorite ults in the game.
2. Cooldowns on Q and range on E.
3. Decrease the cooldowns on Q at lower rank and increase the range of her E.

oh and a new skin would be great :3 (I dont like her current skins XD)