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[Math] For all the people saying that %Mpen first is better.

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Razy6trix

Member

12-05-2012

For all the people saying that the new calculations benefit the AP champs...

Quote:

Math for early game
New values: Enemy has 43 MR. you rush sorc shoes and coupled with your runes, you get 23 Mpen and 8% Mpen. Enemy now has 17 MR.

Old values: Enemy has 43 MR. you rush sorc shoes and coupled with your runes you get 29 Mpen and 10% Mpen, enemy now has 13 MR.

Status: Current values are worse.



Quote:
Math for late game with some MR + void.
New values: Enemy has 88 MR. you rush sorc shoes and coupled with runes, void staff and masteries you get 23 Mpen and 40% Mpen. Enemy now has 30 MR.

Old values: Enemy has 88 MR. you rush sorc shoes and coupled with runes, void staff and masteries you get 29 Mpen and 46% Mpen. Enemy now has 32 MR.

Status: Almost the same. But if you do the math again with anything higher than 88 MR it gets WORSE.


Quote:
Math for late game 200 MR enemy. void staff:

New values: Enemy now has 97 MR (Sorc / mpen reds / void / mastery)

Old values: Enemy now has 92 MR

Status: noticeably worse, and it gets even worse against targets with higher MR (it's supposed to get better... but no)


Tell me how are the new values so much better? You don't hit squishies (your primary targets) as hard as before. And against tankier people you see little to no difference. Oh, and against 150-200 MR targets you actually hit less.

Conclusions:

1. Without Void staff you hit less at any stage of the game.
2. Void staff is not an item to rush, maybe a 3rd or 4th item at best (not counting boots)
3. Having the Mpen runes and sorc shoes nerfed, while the MR runes were left untouched means that AP casters have a worse early game.
4. WITH Void staff you hit a little more on 30-60 MR targets (penetrate about 3-4 more MR than before), the same damage to 100 MR targets, and LESS damage to 150 MR+ targets
5. With Deathcap nerfed, it's harder to stack AP, coupled with the above nerfs, it adds up.

In short:

Mages are weaker early / mid and late game due to Mpen nerfs and AP stacking nerfs.
With void staff they only fill the gap to reach how it was before against >100 MR targets, still, they have less AP and do less damage to higher MR targets.

I'm aware that stacking MR is now harder, but that doesn't take away the fact that mages will be doing less damage early game because they just won't be able to penetrate all of a squishy's MR no matter how much they try.


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hashinshin

Senior Member

12-05-2012

you get less MR.

And they wanted to stop APs from 1 shotting anyone who didn't build MR. That was stupid. When you're not even fed 1 shotting squishies is somewhat retarded when all your shoe is AoE.

But, again. You get less MR. Noticeably so.


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HeartlessXiao

Senior Member

12-05-2012

Uhh... how about the fact that all armor/ mr values are nerfed?

T.T


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Razy6trix

Member

12-05-2012

I put it in bold for you guys.

Even if MR is harder to get, you are still doing way less damage pre-void staff, if you ever get it.

Also, MR is harder to get... but so is AP because Dcap was nerfed, so it kinda evens out.


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Fluffy1

Senior Member

12-05-2012

i assume you didnt play this game well before season 1 even came about, the % before flat was how it was originally but tanks had little incentive to build large amounts of mr so stacked health and squishies were getting owned early game by mages shreading their MR. so they changed the order around and everyone got way harder to kill if they bought even 1 negatron cloak and created the widely know tanky dps crisis which took 3 seasons but is finnaly reverting that horrid change. however this time squishies have better odds with lower values


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Ricky Spanish

Senior Member

12-05-2012

Guys. Razy thread.


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Razy6trix

Member

12-05-2012

Welp, what a bunch of *******.

You've got to be blind or brain damaged to not see how big of a nerf this is.


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Cyraknoss

Senior Member

12-05-2012

Something to point out to you, lower numbers are lower.

Yes you result penetrating less now but that's because the total values changed, NOT because of the %value calculating first.

To use your exact example an enemy with 43MR against your 8% and 23 flat = 16.5 MR remaining. In the old system that same enemy against the same numbers but now calculated 23 flat and 8% = 18.4 MR remaining. Swapping the calculation was a buff they simply made penetration harder to get. But they also made AS, MR, and Armor harder to get so there's no direct nerf you're just inline with the new gold values on items.


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livedevil

Recruiter

12-05-2012

If you want Mpen that badly you can get the quints too.


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zarst

Senior Member

12-05-2012

Quote:
Razy6trix:
Welp, what a bunch of *******.

You've got to be blind or brain damaged to not see how big of a nerf this is.


And you think this is BAD? Sorry to hear that. Its a game mechanic adjustment, not a nerf.


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