I'm trying out the new jungle in the pbe

First Riot Post
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Stonewall008

Senior Member

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Tetramaster

Senior Member

11-18-2012

Oh god.

That is disgusting.

That clear time. That sustain. THAT WARD COVERAGE.


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Deadmond

Senior Member

11-18-2012

I tried googling and everything, but, unfortunately, I couldn't find the highly antecipated answer. So, here it is, the billion dollar question: Stonewall, why do you hate Shaco?

PS: Sorry for the slightly off-topicness of this post.

Edit: Nervermind, an old video of yours answered my question.


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CiaphasCainX

Senior Member

11-18-2012

Bump for Stonewall's valuable insight. Good to hear that Rengar will be getting a video today, btw. Here's hoping he pans out well.


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ScarletDeviI

Senior Member

11-18-2012

I think anyone with a 'pet' is now pretty sustained, just tried Elise and Yorick and only had to use 2 pots on each of them.


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Majestic Fetus

Senior Member

11-18-2012

Pretty devo that Lee Sin's jungle sort of sucks now
I mean he didn't scale too well into late game anyway

Have you tried Amumu yet ?
I'd like to see how fast he clears


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Amariithynar

Senior Member

11-18-2012

What watching the vids from the PBE is showing me is that a lot of junglers are looking at a 4:45-4:55 clear time, much more stable with each other than before, and that even that should be all thrown out the window because you aren't doing proper tests following testing procedure whereupon you utilize as many non-variables as possible to illustrate just how each champ's variables affects the jungle specifically. Also loving how quite a few 4:45 champ clears were pooh-pooh'd but Darius getting a similar clear time gets lauded as amazing and better than anyone else. Rather disappointed.


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migty1joe

Senior Member

11-18-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Morello View Post
We also decreased lane minion gold, meaning most laners will see similar gold, but the difference in 30 CS won't be as big between players. This will also open up more cross-lane ganking.

The thing is these numbers are easy to adjust, and our expectation is that we'll be changing things a lot after it comes out. Not day-1 (as learning curve is a factor and I don't trust a first-day analysis due to low exposure), but we'll be pretty aggressive.
IMHO, you should increase gold income not decreased.


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Tesoros

Senior Member

11-18-2012

Increased gold gains in the jungle not starting until 11 minutes is pretty disappointing. Majority of games, you really only spend the first 6 or 7 minutes "farming" your jungle until you hit level 6. I put farming in quotes because often in the season 2 jungle, majority of the time, even during the first 10 minutes, was spent ganking. Most games you only would get maybe 2 full clears before the lanes start leaching your jungle camps. Going back to the Season 1 jungle though, I remember a common strategy was to farm your jungle until you hit 6, and then start to focus on ganking with your ultimate.

Under both scenarios, the actual amount of time spent farming the jungle always pretty much ended before the 10 minute mark. I think that gold increases beginning at ~7 minutes would make more sense. This would allow for 3 distinct strategies in the jungle:
First you have your ganking junglers, who focus more on ganks obviously. Depending on the champ they can either go for a pre-4 gank or go for a full clear before beginning their gank cycle. These champs mainly only clear jungle camps when there is no opportunity for a gank, or while they are on their way to gank a different lane.
Second you have your control junglers. These guys are focused on clearing their own jungle, as well as invading and shutting down the opposing jungler. They can take advantage of the increased gold rewards by stealing camps from the other jungler, setting them back in gold and levels, and crippling their opponent.
The third strategy would be the farm jungle. They play for late game, and try to clear camps and accumulate gold as much as possible.


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Xyltin

Senior Member

11-18-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Morello View Post
That's the breakpoint we're using currently since early gold gains aren't bad here - the later game ones are tragically low though. This may need adjustment as we look more, but it's a reasonable starting point.

Additionally, we do expect a bit more gold on "safer" junglers since they disrupt less for ganks.
What about the extra gold you need to get your jungle items now?
You get a more limited item choice for that one slot and you still need to spend some gold on the jungle stats.

I don't think junglers are weak now. They feel pretty strong. Still, it feels like you are using a lot of your income early only to make you jungle faster and safer.

Also keep in mind that if your jungler doesn't gank or camp a lane as often, the amount of CS in the lanes will go up a bit, leading to more gold in lanes.

I actually think that the problem could be solved if the jungler would get the full gold and XP from buffs that he smited and his team killed (blue buff when killed by the mid laner). The 50% XP loss is not too hard, but the amount of gold the jungler loses is actually worth a lot over the whole game.