I'm trying out the new jungle in the pbe

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Fox P McCloud

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Senior Member

11-17-2012

Once all the dust settles, it'll be interesting to see what junglers can start with something other than machette.

I'd also love to know if Shaco can start with boots+3 pots and do the red->smite wraith path or if that's not going to work anymore.


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herpderptastic

Senior Member

11-17-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fox P McCloud View Post
Once all the dust settles, it'll be interesting to see what junglers can start with something other than machette.

I'd also love to know if Shaco can start with boots+3 pots and do the red->smite wraith path or if that's not going to work anymore.

Just got done with Shaco on the PTR.

It's possible but it's going to slow down your jungle considerably as you're more reliant on having boxes down.


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Stonewall008

Senior Member

11-17-2012

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Originally Posted by Mmimzy View Post
I dont know. Control jungles and farm jungles just dont seem like they'd be very effective.

Control jungles only serve to really shut down the farmer. Becuase the control jungles can't start doing thier thing before level 4. Which is where you have to stop a gank jungle. Once a gank jungles got his ganking tool in hand (his CC skills). Hes done being in the jungle forcing the control to chase him around the map all game. This control jungles need to do well early as late game they dont bring very much to the team. Furthermore, If a control jungle can rangle in a ganker, he has applied no extra preasure onto the lanes, thus his team will have to have strong match ups.

I get the idea of rock paper scissors, but a farmer jungle doesn't beat out a ganking jungle. As that just means the ganker has even more free rain over the lanes, allowing the jungler to apply his pressure to all lane unstopped. Further more alot of the gankers like maokai and shaco are so strong that they can just go kill a farmer as well. If the ganker can't kill the farmer on his own. A successful gank can easily result in a raid on the enemy jungle.

Therefore, really you're just left with the ganker jungle. I say this to not say that your wrong mr. stonewall, but to express my concern..
It is rock paper scissors though. It's an easy explanation but keep in mind some junglers were able to adopt to multi task and threw the triad for a loop (somewhat).

The farmer loses to the ganker because the ganker forces the farmer to leave the jungle and intervene. This allows the ganker to pierce the gold gains of the farmer and gimp them for the rest of the game.

The ganker loses to the controller because the controller is hounding them and preventing them from earning not only their murder gold but the few scraps of farm jungle they have. Hell the controller is also warding the map and making his laners harder to gank without him being around.

The farmer junglers usually snowballed like hell in the jungle so the controller couldn't keep up in some cases. To add to that the farmer wasn't looking to gank anyone so the controller's wards weren't being put to the best use (in most cases) and they kind of just did nothing. The farmers also had item advantage at some point and could probably kill the soft controllers. Keep in mind Shyvana came later and she wasn't so soft or weak.


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Fox P McCloud

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11-17-2012

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Originally Posted by Stonewall008 View Post
That's exactly my concern. Teammate intervention and the requirements of the game disrupting your jungle. What good is a gold increase if your teammates keep stealing it or flushing you out of the jungle because they need to be babysat or team fights are starting right away. If fighting is happening already then you'll likely have to submit your farm to your more important teammates like the carry :/
Yeah, this is going to be extremely hard to avoid and is something that happens in other MOBAs (ie: DotA); while the jungle is dominated by the ....er, jungler early game, it just becomes something for the carry to farm mid game on for quick exp+gold while the jungler transitions into a quasi-support role (unless you're Lycan).

The thing is, due to how LoL champs work, if this happens in LoL, there will be a lot less viable junglers in long term if the same thing happens in LoL, as they'll have to have ridiculous amounts of utility and power without much gold.

I dunno, I think it's way too early to tell, but as you said, if you have to babysit, your gold gets taken, or team-fight phase starts early, you're kinda boned....on top of getting stuck with an item you're forced into buying.


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Jordian

Senior Member

11-17-2012

Do you think farming junglers will make a come back in season 3? Mostly just Tryndamere and Yi. I have tried Tryndamere same speed as before around 3:40 but the new items and masteries give him a huge boost also that Avarice Blade.


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Stonewall008

Senior Member

11-17-2012

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Originally Posted by Jordian View Post
Do you think farming junglers will make a come back in season 3? Mostly just Tryndamere and Yi. I have tried Tryndamere same speed as before around 3:40 but the new items and masteries give him a huge boost also that Avarice Blade.
I want to test them out more before I give you a statement on that. I truly love those characters and I have almost all their skins <_<

However I can tell you that a jungle carry can only function if the laners can let it function. These guys need farm and need to not be disturbed while farming as well as requiring a team to be built around them because they're melee.


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Jordian

Senior Member

11-17-2012

Tryndamere is my favorite champion and I don't use him much anymore duo to fact nerfs. But I still jungle as him in S2 time to time. His clear time is all good his ganks r pretty good but most of the time u have to use ghost to get any good ganks. After he hits level 6 he turns into alistar besides the fact u have to chase them down instead of cc them. I just hope he becomes at least "more" viable again in the new season

<3 Tryndamere


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KevinDelMarr

Senior Member

11-17-2012

Junglers seem to have more of a consistent Jungle time, somewhere between 3:50 and 4:00 minutes for the first 4 levels, which I like. it will be nice to know that the 4:20-4:30 mark (20-30 seconds to move from last camp to lane position) is when to expect a gank.


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Protect me Tomoe

Senior Member

11-17-2012

What's it like, Stonewall? Knowing you, yourself, currently hold the only viewable copy of Season 3 Jungle- The Dark Horses?


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Kingbob12

Senior Member

11-17-2012

i was really hoping for a one full clear to lvl 4 jungle again, with the damage to match. having a deadly early jungle is something i miss a lot. any chance this will make a greater comeback?