Let me explain you guys Zed's lore

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AboutTenPandas

Senior Member

11-02-2012

Yeah I understood the whole "the master wasn't killed during the torture" part on my first readthrough, but the part about him purposefully banishing Zen to become the evil counterpart to Shen is a really great idea.

The only part that I would change would be that instead of him stabbing Zen in the room, he simply opens the box, allowing whatever was inside to infect Zen transforming Zen into the evil he was destined to become. It is then this evil Zen that has no qualms about killing his master and throwing his head in front of Shen.


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Kinvaras666

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Senior Member

11-02-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by AboutTenPandas View Post
Yeah I understood the whole "the master wasn't killed during the torture" part on my first readthrough, but the part about him purposefully banishing Zen to become the evil counterpart to Shen is a really great idea.

The only part that I would change would be that instead of him stabbing Zen in the room, he simply opens the box, allowing whatever was inside to infect Zen transforming Zen into the evil he was destined to become. It is then this evil Zen that has no qualms about killing his master and throwing his head in front of Shen.
Zed, not Zen.


And yes, that works as well

And the act of throwing the head is to show "your master is dead, I am the new master of this temple"


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AboutTenPandas

Senior Member

11-02-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kinvaras666 View Post
Zed, not Zen.


And yes, that works as well

And the act of throwing the head is to show "your master is dead, I am the new master of this temple"

Oops, yeah sorry Zed. He's still new, I'll take a mulligan on that one lol.


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Cerubois

Senior Member

11-02-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by AboutTenPandas View Post
The only part that I would change would be that instead of him stabbing Zen in the room, he simply opens the box, allowing whatever was inside to infect Zen transforming Zen into the evil he was destined to become. It is then this evil Zen that has no qualms about killing his master and throwing his head in front of Shen.
I thought something similar as well before, but it seems Zed never found the box, from this part:

Quote:
Screaming in rage, Zed commanded his followers to slaughter the master's students and seize the box.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Kinvaras666 View Post
Shen is not exactly neutral.

* His order preserves balance.

* Zed seeks to destroy the order of balance, but he doesn't realizes that doing this, he is actually being part of the balance.


While someone tries to destroy the balance, someone needs to try and preserve it.
That's the real balance.

"Good" and "Evil" are labels. There is no real good or evil, they are just different point of views, but they both need exist.
I almost like this. But Zed never claims to want to destroy the balance. All he wants is the box to perfect his shadow techniques and to kill any 'false' ninjas. He says "Balance is a lie," but he doesn't seem to make it his point. He just wants his own power.


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Kinvaras666

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Senior Member

11-02-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cerubois View Post
I almost like this. But Zed never claims to want to destroy the balance. All he wants is the box to perfect his shadow techniques and to kill any 'false' ninjas. He says "Balance is a lie," but he doesn't seem to make it his point. He just wants his own power.
of course he does
Quote:
Zed rules as the Order's master, and his edict is simple: perfect one's technique, and kill all ninjas who refuse to embrace the shadows.

''Balance is a lie - we are the true ninjas.''
-Zed
Not destroy balance, but destroy the order of balance.


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Cerubois

Senior Member

11-02-2012

If you're viewing 'balance' (the idea of balance) and 'the order of balance' (the group that deems itself responsible for keeping the idea of balance) as two different things, then your point doesn't work. :/

If he wants to destroy balance, it's easier than easy to do so. Kill everyone. Not just the ninjas. Life. People, animals, plants. That'll wreak havoc on the idea of balance for sure. Shen may be talented, but he has yet to create life to counterbalance an unusual amount of death.

If he wants to destroy the order, well, that's actually edging into my view of it. He doesn't want to disrupt the balance persay. He sees himself as a true ninja, and he just wants to be right. And we all know the Noxian mantra "Might makes right."
If people don't view him as a true ninja, he'll destroy them and say "Ha. Told you so."
If he's not powerful enough, he'll try to become more powerful. Hence, he needs the box in order to destroy the Kinkou, the only ones left that stand in his way.

To put it very simply, Zed is still an angry child that only sees violence as a way to win an argument.


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Kinvaras666

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Senior Member

11-02-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cerubois View Post
If you're viewing 'balance' (the idea of balance) and 'the order of balance' (the group that deems itself responsible for keeping the idea of balance) as two different things, then your point doesn't work. :/

If he wants to destroy balance, it's easier than easy to do so. Kill everyone. Not just the ninjas. Life. People, animals, plants. That'll wreak havoc on the idea of balance for sure. Shen may be talented, but he has yet to create life to counterbalance an unusual amount of death.

If he wants to destroy the order, well, that's actually edging into my view of it. He doesn't want to disrupt the balance persay. He sees himself as a true ninja, and he just wants to be right. And we all know the Noxian mantra "Might makes right."
If people don't view him as a true ninja, he'll destroy them and say "Ha. Told you so."
If he's not powerful enough, he'll try to become more powerful. Hence, he needs the box in order to destroy the Kinkou, the only ones left that stand in his way.

To put it very simply, Zed is still an angry child that only sees violence as a way to win an argument.
But Zed doesn't "wants" to be evil.
He just wants to perfect the forbidden technique and kill the ninjas of the order of balance.
Right? But you gotta agree, while doing this, He fulfills his role as "evil".

Shen however, he doesn't wants to be "good"
He wants to preserve balance and protects the ninja of his order.
Again, by doing this, he fulfills the role as being "good".


As long as both exist and do things the way they want, they are both being part of the balance.

Shen by actually wanting to balance things
Zed simply as consequence (and without noticing he is part of a role)


He was banished from the order of balance, so he doesn't understands balance very well.
If he truly wanted to destroy balance, the only thing he needed to do was suicide.

This would break the balance, leaving no "evil" part, and possibly leading the evil sealed in the box free,
causing chaos in the world.


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MrHarz

Senior Member

11-02-2012

They really need to elaborate more on the box, because seriously, all it seemed to do was grant Zed his powers, and how is having the power to create shadow clones of yourself "evil?"

Or alternatively, why is it "forbidden", while teleportation, stealth, and the other abilities the ninja trio have are not?


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Kneesurgery

Senior Member

11-02-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kinvaras666 View Post
But Zed doesn't "wants" to be evil.
He just wants to perfect the forbidden technique and kill the ninjas of the order of balance.
Right? But you gotta agree, while doing this, He fulfills his role as "evil".

Shen however, he doesn't wants to be "good"
He wants to preserve balance and protects the ninja of his order.
Again, by doing this, he fulfills the role as being "good".


As long as both exist and do things the way they want, they are both being part of the balance.

Shen by actually wanting to balance things
Zed simply as consequence (and without noticing he is part of a role)


He was banished from the order of balance, so he doesn't understands balance very well.
If he truly wanted to destroy balance, the only thing he needed to do was suicide.

This would break the balance, leaving no "evil" part, and possibly leading the evil sealed in the box free,
causing chaos in the world.
Ok, so a few things.

1. Zed doesn't think of himself as evil, but he is an evil character. Good characters don't walk into the temple devoted to preserving true balance between good and evil and behead the leader. Reference your d&d, killing a true neutral character lowers your alignment.

2. Shen isn't a good guy. The triumvirate of Shen, Akali, and Kennen perform any, and I mean any, action required to maintain balance. "Order, chaos, light, and darkness -- all things must exist in perfect harmony for such is the way of the universe." This means that were light to gain an advantage over darkness, the kinkou would act in favor of the dark, were it the other way around, they would act in favor of the light. Self-preservation of a completely neutral order of ninja's is, well, neutral. This means, yes, that Zed is evil because of his acts in conflict with the kinkou, but the kinkou are still neutral for repelling said acts.

3. Zed was a star pupil of the kinkou. He would certainly have understood balance perfectly well. He just disagreed with it. It's also worth pointing out that he is far from being the only evil influence on Runeterra. Were he to commit suicide, nobody would care.

I'm convinced that Zed cares more about preserving the art of the shadow than war with the kinkou. Because of this he trains pupils in a remote temple instead of engaging in constant battles with the kinkou on the world's stage.


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Elite Midget

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Senior Member

11-02-2012

But Shen isn't good, he's True Neutral.

Zed doesn't care for balance and isn't going to preserve it. Shen will preserve balance whether he's seen as good or evil by doing it.


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