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The DFG nerf was too harsh.

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Nana A Deviluke

Senior Member

10-18-2012

5% per 100 instead of 4% per 100 AP.
Base of 15 instead of 25%.
At 400AP that is a difference of 1%. (35% vs 36%)

If you're Veigar - where getting 500-600 AP isn't unheard of... you're suddenly even/better than you were.


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Akava

Senior Member

10-18-2012

Quote:
Morello:
Good idea, imo ;p


Are some burst champions, whose most used builds don't include DFG, balanced around the fact that DFG is a possibility?


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Morello

Lead Designer

10-18-2012

Quote:
Arrivederco:
Morello, please tell me you're considering the DFG nerf and the Eve nerf together.

Combined they are probably the single biggest nerf a champ has ever recieved in a patch.

Do you think this is reasonable? Eve has a really fun playstyle that shouldn't be completely gutted (again).


I agree - we'll watch this as closely as Sona.


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Panzerfaust

Emissary of the League

10-18-2012

Quote:
M0ngo Like Candy:
If this is your logic, did you try and delete Eve as well?


Yes, they deleted old Eve. Did you notice how her ultimate and stealth (the main problems) are completely gone? Sure the theme of old Eve is still there, but the champ itself is dead.


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Crownface

Senior Member

10-18-2012

Quote:
Morello:
No, we could fix her. This item has fundamental flaws based around the entire item's core design.


I still don't really see how it destroys item diversity though.

Are you upset because not enough people are building Morello's?


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Arrivederco

Senior Member

10-18-2012

Quote:
Morello:
I agree - we'll watch this as closely as Sona.

Thank you then, I hope you guys handle this properly but I am scared.

I want to believe you have grown since your last Eve "balancing".


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The McSmashy

Senior Member

10-18-2012

Quote:
Mxie:
Honestly my biggest problem is the CDR change. I fully agree that DFG was too powerful, but now it seems that APs that want CDR either have to build mana regen, which is great on some (Anivia), meh on others (Ahri), and a huge waste of stats on manaless (Kat).

So is there some new item coming for those that like the AP and CDR, but don't want mana?


If you want AP and CDR, Morellos Evil Tomb gives both in very large amounts (5 less AP, 5% more CDR, 300 gold less) and has an active ability that helps against heavy sustain characters like Vladimir and Swain and to a lesser extent Morganna.

If you really didn't care about the DFG active, you'd be building Morellos now! There's a wasted stat, sure, but if you act like the stat doesn't exist, it's a better option than DFG specifically for CDR.


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Gidoru

Senior Member

10-18-2012

Just delete DFG and revert Eve nerf.


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Stevev45

Senior Member

10-18-2012

Quote:
Morello:
Well, to be unpopular, they dialed down my suggestion. I wanted to remove it from the game.

I think that item's existence destroys diversity and interest - you should just use DFG on all burst casters, and all balance needs to factor in an extra nuke. There's no case where DFG is good and DFG isn't abusive - that basically is the definition of toxic.



Yes all burst mages should build it. But it is expensive, and burst mages need lots of items. (CDR, mana, DC, magic pen). It's also easily mitigated with MR.

Also, nearly every role has mandatory items?


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Tutskii

Senior Member

10-18-2012

Quote:
Morello:
No, we could fix her. This item has fundamental flaws based around the entire item's core design.


But Eve got fixed, and now she is solely viable based on a gimmick combo based on an item thats going away (play AP Eve without DFG as she is now, and see what happens).

AP with DFG was literally her only half viable build and not only is DFG going away, but she is getting nerfed again, too.

Remember that before this interaction, she was in the trash bin with the new twitch, and karma.

She was out for a few weeks based on a gimmick that in no way equals gg (she can burst down a champ once a minute and does absolutely nothing else!), and now both her, and DFG are getting gutted.

Shouldn't you have gutted one or the other?

It was good to get to play Eve for a while.