The Altars..

Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

ArgusNavis

Junior Member

10-19-2012

Altars isn't the 100% of the new TT, maybe 10% or 15%. They help to improve a more fast-paced game.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

GRRgamel

This user has referred a friend to League of Legends, click for more information

Senior Member

10-19-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by ArgusNavis View Post
Altars isn't the 100% of the new TT, maybe 10% or 15%. They help to improve a more fast-paced game.
i'm gonna assume you haven't played this since you don't realize how much time your focusing on capturing these points... and if you're not, you're losing every match because the enemy team has an unholy advantage from capturing both.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

fiddlesticksssss

Senior Member

10-20-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by ArgusNavis View Post
Altars isn't the 100% of the new TT, maybe 10% or 15%. They help to improve a more fast-paced game.
Altars are dragon buff spawning at 3 mintues, once you get it, you NEVER lose the buff. You will just be way to powerful.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

urinetrouble

Senior Member

10-20-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by CountMoriarty View Post
Alters
I'd leave the rest of your post, Count, but for the sake of this post not being monstrous I'm abbreviating to just quoting you're post as "Alters". The quote that CountMoriarty left on the top of page 5 is what should we have in this post, and I highly reccomend reading it. I find that these posts bashing alters in general are distasteful.

I do agree that the stance Riot has on alters being in the new TT isn't the best way to implement more objective based play, and that the alters give too much of an advantage, but I propose that if you want them changed, make a valid argument as to how we can change it other than just removing it. Riot has stated on the PBE forums that this is the new frontier for threes and they are not going back to the original play style. However, since this is in PBE we as a community can give solid feedback as to how alters could be implemented so that they do not turn the game into just skirmishing in the jungle with the tankiest fighters you can so that you have a predominant start to the game that snowballs into a huge gap between the two teams in which comebacks are impossible. This way Riot has the change that they want to bring to threes without it being a complete abomination. I'm not too familiar with how often Riot takes criticism on their work and alters it accordingly, but if I were a game developer I would place more value on well constructed thoughts of few than mob-like frustration and rants of many.

In my opinion, there are three things that should be changed to the new threes. Be wary that this is coming from a player with not a lot of threes experience, and hasn't tried the PBE version of the new threes:

1.) The speed buff.
I believe that this is doesn't rightly fit in this game mode. Now, I haven't fully experienced it on the PBE, but considering that the new threes map is condensed and no longer has wards, The speed buff makes ganks too easy for the one ganking, and almost inescapable for the player getting ganked. This is the only object that I feel should be removed entirely. It takes up a good chunk of space that could be used for a larger jungle (so that the jungler has more farm at his/her disposal).


2.) The Altars
The alters, as they are now, are way too important. The bonus gold per kill is okay in my eyes, because both teams have an access to this. What I see as a major issue is when one team wins a teamfight, caps both alters, and becomes nearly unstoppable. One teamfight should not be the major deciding factor to the new threes. I would be very fearful of losing my alter and would almost have to have a player babysitting the altar at all times instead of ganking or pushing. This seems counterproductive, and would presumably make a game drag longer than it should. I feel that the altar should be a counter to the team taking the spider. The spider is a very powerful buff that (with attack speed and cdr) would make pushing and winning the game a breeze. The altar, in my opinion, should be a counter to a team killing the spider, and would also be a counter to a snowballing team. In accordance to it being a counter to the spider, it should be unlocked right around the same time that the spider spawns. I say "altar", because I think there should be only one altar, and that it should be where the old red buff was. The stats that the tower would provide could be something like a small buff that passively gives the team a small amount of exp, a smaller bonus gold per kill, and some overall damage reduction to the team that possesses the altar (all the numbers could be tweaked accordingly). The altar should be visible to both teams, and should be taken similar to a tower in dominion. Tanky teams would easily be able to control the altar the way it is now. Instead, it should have the channel way of taking it that dominion has on its towers. That way ranged characters/ abilities could counter by poking and interrupting the alter being taken. It also makes the team to take one of three options; Do I take the tower, cap the altar, or group up with my team and take the spider. In this case (and only in this case) I find the removal of wards to be a good thing. It adds a mystery into every encounter and decision.


3.) The Jungle.
I personally like the idea of a centralized jungle. It makes counter jungling more prominent, and makes it easier for the jungle to get to both lanes. I feel that this change makes the jungle even more of a dynamic battle ground than before. What I have an issue with is how spacious it is. The top section of jungle in TT had a multitude of walls and escape routes, that made juking a lot easier. I haven't played a lot of threes, but from what I've played I know that a flash juke over a wall or maneuvering through the brushes was a very rewarding feeling. I feel that with the new jungle takes away from being to out maneuver your opponent, and feels generic. With the proposed altar being in the middle there would be more space to add more idiosyncrasies to the jungle for jukes and tricky maneuvers, and perhaps another camp for the jungler to farm. The new camp would help give more sustain to each jungler.

As stated before, I'm not too experienced with the current threes situation, nor have I tested the threes on PBE, but that's my two cents on the discussion at hand.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roman View Post
why don't you take the time to appreciate that riot actually fixed most of the flaws that prompted the remake anyway and appreciate that 3s is actually being paid attention to..

i agree that the altars are a ridiculous idea but you should start helping them out and suggesting new ideas that could potentially replace it


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

CountMoriarty

Senior Member

10-20-2012

I'm mostly posting because you mentioned my post, and who doesn't love an ego bump.

http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/....php?t=2696149

Heres my post on Wards, Speed Bost, and the Alters in case you wanted to read that. Also Riot has stated that it is likely Alters will be very different when released, and that they are testing different fixes for wards.

The problem with the Dominion Channeling is that it'll make Alters feel more like dominion points (despite being very different) and thus you'll get more anti dominion raging despite it possibly being a better solution. I would like the capture method of Alters to be adjusted so that it would increase the value of smite. Maybe if the Alter had a Gargoyle thats health bar ticked down like a timer when you stood on the alter (identical to current capture method) but could be smited away, or even hit by a nice skill shot (increasing the value of smite, and champions that can't just stand in one spot, but might be able to snipe it away)

Ultimately the best solution might be to put a Jungle camp ontop of the Alters, it''ll feel the most familiar to players. I wouldn't want to remove the Alter, I feel like they are flavorful, and allow for some good jukes.

Also want to mention that Riot has thought about adding a camp where Vilemaw spawns before he spawns (him devouring the camp if its there at 10min) This might excite some players who believe there isn't enough choice, now there might be a camp the enemy can steal away before 10 min if they see you bot.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Hi Guys Danger

Senior Member

10-20-2012

Most of us don't like the addition of Altars in general so how is that not a potential way to fix it... by removing them?


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

CountMoriarty

Senior Member

10-20-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hi Guys Danger View Post
Most of us don't like the addition of Altars in general so how is that not a potential way to fix it... by removing them?
Some people don't like them, some people do. Removing them is certainly a way to fix them, its an extreme fix and and unlikely fix. Especially given the reasons people don't like them. For example what if Alters were removed and replaced with wolves/wraith buff. That is a suggestion many people have been proposing. But there is no reason you can't tweak alters so they function identically to wolves/wraiths buffs and keep all the flavorful fun interactions, cool visuals, and terrian to juke around.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Godr´x

Member

10-20-2012

I win games with the other team capping both alters ppl stop blaming the alters for your losses if you lose its because you forcing YOURSELF to fight and capture/defend an alter. nuff said


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

fiddlesticksssss

Senior Member

10-20-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by CountMoriarty View Post
I'm mostly posting because you mentioned my post, and who doesn't love an ego bump.

http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/....php?t=2696149

Heres my post on Wards, Speed Bost, and the Alters in case you wanted to read that. Also Riot has stated that it is likely Alters will be very different when released, and that they are testing different fixes for wards.

The problem with the Dominion Channeling is that it'll make Alters feel more like dominion points (despite being very different) and thus you'll get more anti dominion raging despite it possibly being a better solution. I would like the capture method of Alters to be adjusted so that it would increase the value of smite. Maybe if the Alter had a Gargoyle thats health bar ticked down like a timer when you stood on the alter (identical to current capture method) but could be smited away, or even hit by a nice skill shot (increasing the value of smite, and champions that can't just stand in one spot, but might be able to snipe it away)

Ultimately the best solution might be to put a Jungle camp ontop of the Alters, it''ll feel the most familiar to players. I wouldn't want to remove the Alter, I feel like they are flavorful, and allow for some good jukes.

Also want to mention that Riot has thought about adding a camp where Vilemaw spawns before he spawns (him devouring the camp if its there at 10min) This might excite some players who believe there isn't enough choice, now there might be a camp the enemy can steal away before 10 min if they see you bot.
So you are saying to make a jungle camp on top of altars. Tell me how putting 1 creep that gave a team wide buff or 1 man buff that was powerful, but still important. Everyone loves creeps. Everyone loves killing them, fighting over them, and stealing them. What is wrong with having a top jungle too? I just don't understand. You're fix is saying keep the altars, just to take up space. Also if you are curious, trundle kennen singed and teemo make the speed shrine over powered. They have their move speed "trundle slows you before you get to it so he can escape" then they have there buffed movespeed hit that shrine and they evolve into rammus. Honestly why would you want to take out the strategic play of old TT and replace it with "go here and fight whoever wins gets to become a snowball and in 90 seconds you will attempt to steal it back, but probably lose". Creep monsters with buffs were as much a objective as they were fought over. No one even hates creeps that much. It encourages jungling and smite out the ass with a mini boss, however, its not so important that you can ignore it and not get punished by immediate defeat.

Edit: also wards are to powerful, because riot wants you to "stealth steal the enemy altar, having a ward would destroy that purpose", but if you put creeps back and make a top jungle, you keep old TT play with strategy and get a nerfed version of vision wards "because i do agree that those ward sights were too huge".

Quote:
Originally Posted by Godr´x View Post
I win games with the other team capping both alters ppl stop blaming the alters for your losses if you lose its because you forcing YOURSELF to fight and capture/defend an alter. nuff said
Fighting bots, and complete scrubs doesn't count. You obviously never played TT before this.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Hi Guys Danger

Senior Member

10-20-2012

unfortunately, your pleas will not be heard.