A full look at the potential DFG nerf w/ solutions. (Please read)

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Skunkers

Junior Member

10-18-2012

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Preface:
I talk about making champions no longer viable. This is an extreme, I know. Some teams will find ways to make them work. However, the strength of many of these champions are severely limited with this update, so the viability can be challenged, not necessarily present or gone.

Also, I'm not a professional gamer nor statistical expert. I'm trying to give my view on the issue.
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Table of Contents
I. Preview
II. Why DFG was a problem
III. Did it work?
IV. Impact on other champs
V. Impact on the Meta
VI. Proposed solution

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I. Statistics Preview
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Deathfire's Grasp (Pre-Nerf):
+80 AP
+15% Cooldown Reduction
+Active 20% (+5% per 100 AP) targeted damage

Deathfire's Grasp (Proposed-Nerf):
+80 AP
+Active 15% (+4% per 100 AP) targeted damage
CDR removed

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II. Why DFG was a problem
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I saw absolutely no issue with DFG before the swarm of AP Evelynn mid. Once she became an all-elo permaban, however, Riot was left with a decision: what should be done about her?

Riot did well with this set of updates. Rengar, Ezreal, Sona, Jayce, and Evelynn are all receiving balancing updates (as well as some others that aren't as prominent). I do not believe a single one of these kit/stat changes will make these champions no longer viable (while there are changes I'd make, I won't discuss those here).

However, the problem with Evelynn was that she needed only one skill to destroy a squishy champion. Deathfire's grasp and Agony's Imbrace alone could kill the opposing AD Carry, which was incredibly easy because of her stealth and major speed steroid. I wouldn't call myself an expert Evelynn player, but I've used her a fair amount, and find it's incredibly easy to snowball. Having a major lead against champs while having magic penetration or them without magic resist meant almost immediate instakills (as a rule, it usually took the aforementioned combo with a hatespike or two). The kit change was welcome, but the impact was not incredibly drastic (a change of .01, since most the damage is base anyway). With the current deathfire's grasp you'd still deal about 3/4 damage in the same situation (and Evelynn has fantastic chasing potential with Rylai's Crystal Scepter or red buff, so cleanup is a breeze) so it's obvious more changes would have to be made. Instead of changing her kit further, the solution was a DFG change.
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III. Did it work?
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For it's intended purpose, yes. It essentially made Evelynn useless. It didn't halve the damage by any means, but the change was ridiculously significant (I went from a 100-0 burst to a ~65% burst). Suddenly, the perfect assassin has just been overshadowed by every other strong burster. Her only saving grace is that she can chase no-escape squishies with limited crowd control, but she's likely to die as she gets divulged upon from every angle since her damage is so limited outside initial burst (strong, but it's not as strong as either sustained damage or sustained CC champs) that she's unlikely to instakill anyone without a ridiculous lead.

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IV. Impact on other champions
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Deathfire's Grasp was basically a requirement for any burst oriented champion. When Ahri received her base-damage nerf to avoid people from building her either ridiculously strong or AP Tanky DPS (or whatever the equivalent would be), many considered DFG to be the item that would allow her to remain viable. It was the only way to keep burst oriented champions viable into the mid-late game transition (it was the only way to keep Veigar, LeBlanc, Annie, etc. champs viable period).

DFG was a staple for a very large amount of AP casters, so this change is suddenly removing viability (or at least a large amount of strength from) half of our champions.

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V. Impact on the meta
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The only way to now keep burst oriented champions viable is to end the game as early as possible. Their late game viability is suddenly gone now that another source of damage is gone (Meaning, you won't be playing them against CLG.EU). We can officially say goodbye to Annie for good, Kassadin will no longer be a low-elo permaban, and the mid lane will be left to sustain/utility champs (Orianna, Cassiopia, etc.) This seemingly little nerf has the potential to completely change the meta for mid laners. This is my interpretation, but of course, I can't predict the future. Single target assassination was already pretty much dead because of an initiation-heavy, offtank/bruiser meta, but now I feel it will be quite a long time before we see champs like Akali reintroduced into professional play.

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VI. Proposed solution
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Part of the issue was the mPen build; you couldn't itemize well against Evelynn because her damage was percentage based and could scale with magic penetration.
Solution one: Keep scalings and base damage as is, make it not scale with magic penetration.

Another issue is the ridiculous amount of damage that it offers in ganks and lane control at early levels (You can easily have DFG at 10 or 11 if you're a strong farmer or roamer.) However, this nerf takes out viability for both early and late game damage. I feel that DFG was the only way to keep burst based champions (primarily melee/short ranged) a viable pick.
Solution two: Keep the new base damage while retaining the scaling. This allows burst heavy champs to remain useful late game while taking out their complete dominance (something they excel at without DFG in the lane phase)

Or:
Solution three: Don't change anything!
This nerf was targeted toward Evelynn alone. No one complains about DFG with other champions because it has been established it's almost necessary in most cases; I believe it was mentioned at MLG Raleigh that it's a staple on champs like Gragas to keep them in the game without becoming straight utility. If Evelynn is the problem, work with her. Not the item that makes many champions playable.



Guys, thanks a lot for reading. Spread this around and vote if you like it. I very much do not want DFG to become a near useless item, nor do I want Evelynn to become useless after so quickly becoming prominent again. All comments, feedback, and criticism are welcome!
Riot, when something becomes popular, don't nerf it to hell. Buff other things. Make new things. Give us compromises between champs, don't run FOTM and nerf it when it doesn't work out.
I'll smooth this out and edit later. Just don't have the time right now.

TL;DR: This nerf has potential impact that can completely change the meta and ruin a lot of champs.

~Skunkers.


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cerabrete2

Member

10-18-2012

Is this a real change or a suggestion. If its real can you post some links to where you heard this info.

Math:
DFG 25% +4%/100AP
Agony's Embrace 25% + 2%/100
Total 50% + 6%/100
Need 834AP to do 100% damage. This is with 0 MR.

I don't think DFG is the reason eve is strong. Most other casters can deal more than 25% hp or even 40% hp to an ADC with their ultimate. Even Lux can easily burst down a ADC if they get the opportunity to get close enough. A lot of casters buy DFG other than eve. Viegar has always been a fan of DFG since the old days. Let him take enemy champions from 100 to 0 even if they were tanks. Annie does this all the time at 6 with tibbers combo.


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Skunkers

Junior Member

10-18-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by cerabrete2 View Post
Is this a real change or a suggestion. If its real can you post some links to where you heard this info.

Math:
DFG 25% +4%/100AP
Agony's Embrace 25% + 2%/100
Total 50% + 6%/100
Need 834AP to do 100% damage. This is with 0 MR.

I don't think DFG is the reason eve is strong. Most other casters can deal more than 25% hp or even 40% hp to an ADC with their ultimate. Even Lux can easily burst down a ADC if they get the opportunity to get close enough. A lot of casters buy DFG other than eve. Viegar has always been a fan of DFG since the old days. Let him take enemy champions from 100 to 0 even if they were tanks. Annie does this all the time at 6 with tibbers combo.

http://www.surrenderat20.net/2012/10...les-patch.html