So I wanna propose a change to DFG...

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The SHP

Senior Member

10-07-2012

...to restore the item's original intention.

It was meant to deal with hp-stacking tanks/bruisers, those that could survive a mage's burst and effectively counter them because of it. It was supposed to be a way for mages to counterbuild tankiness.


But what has it become instead? An additional generic nuke. An assassination tool, used to add enough burst damage to eliminate (more frequently than not) a squishy damage threat, not a tank/bruiser. The reality is DFG with followup still isn't usually enough to deal with actual bulky enemies (since they'll still have MR), and it's far more effective for the sake of the the team to simply -eliminate- one damage threat rather than -weaken- one bruiser/tank.


So I'd like to see it changed, to actually deal specifically with tanks/bruisers/hp-stackers, like it was meant to. How?



Simple. Make it scale based on a percentage of the target's bonus health, the health they receive from items/runes/masteries/buffs (if possible, it wouldn't be bad to include shields in this calculation as well, as a means to counter them that currently doesn't exist). This would still scale with AP. But it would no longer be dependent in any way on 'current HP', and would no longer give any caster a simple way to eliminate a damage threat in a heartbeat.

Now i wouldn't want it to be completely useless against someone with no bonus HP. I still think it should do *something* against them, but it should be suboptimal, a relative waste of its active when compared to the intended use. DFG currently has a minimum damage of 200, so lets say this new active deals a flat 200 damage as well (no longer a minimum, just a flat portion on top of the % bonus hp scaling).



I'm not quite sure on the actual base % or scaling by AP. It should be higher than the "25% + 4% per 100 AP " it currently has, but idk what i'd set it at. My estimate would be 35% + 6% per 100 AP (+200 flat damage).



TL;DR: Change DFG's active from "% current hp" to "% bonus hp" (with tweaked scaling and a flat damage portion".



Thoughts? Post and bump if you've got an opinion, please



*edit*

so i didn't suggest any stat changes or anything in the original suggestion, because all i wanted to address was the active. But now the CDR portion will seemingly be eliminated, and when i think about it, that would make sense for my version too... after all this version would be a niche counterbuild item, and putting cdr on an item whose usefulness is determined by your opponent's choices, and not your own, doesn't seem to fit.

So i guess i would leave the cdr out of the item as well, and either lower the upgrade cost, or add in something like health (drop the upgrade cost and add a ruby into the recipe) into the build. Health would make a little more sense than cdr, imo, since it's a bit more easily available in other viable sources and works as a better counter to the bruisers/hp-stackers than cdr typically would.

And in response to the lower number of universally-viable cdr items, we could potentially see new AP items for cdr added to the game, ideally.


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DrMrSisterFister

Senior Member

10-07-2012

Actually not a bad idea at all.


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xzarion

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Senior Member

10-07-2012

You do know that's what it did before right?

It's purpose didn't change, its accessibility did.


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Fiora Mid GG

Member

10-07-2012

i like


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SirOns1aught

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Junior Member

10-07-2012

Viegar doesn't approve... But it is a solid idea none the less.


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Vedr

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Member

10-07-2012

Sounds really useless unless the enemy mid decides to go triple RoA or something.


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The SHP

Senior Member

10-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vedr View Post
Sounds really useless unless the enemy mid decides to go triple RoA or something.

it wasn't ever *supposed* to be an anti-mid item. It was meant to be an hp-stacking counter. This just makes it so in reality.


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Magik

Senior Member

10-07-2012

what are you going to do against tanks like galio then. who just stacks MR

some mids still get roa or rylais, some ppl may get both on 1 champ. not to mention some champs will run hp/lvl seals in addition to those items

it really wont help, plenty of tanks will just abuse mr and ar in that case

dfg is fine really


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IS11d6327cb35cafc124891

Senior Member

10-07-2012

well it basically reward people for going glass canon with magic resist. it would be very moronic to buy defensive item where you can buy offensive item without sacrificying your survivability.

so basically gardian angel+dps would be very op and guess what ? it is currently the metagame.


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The SHP

Senior Member

10-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fellnine View Post
what are you going to do against tanks like galio then. who just stacks MR

some mids still get roa or rylais, some ppl may get both on 1 champ. not to mention some champs will run hp/lvl seals in addition to those items

it really wont help, plenty of tanks will just abuse mr and ar in that case

dfg is fine really
that'd be a reasonable point... if the game were actually 1v1. If opponents are stacking MR instead of health, you buy a void staff and make their purchase painfully inefficient (more so than it already is to stack mitigation with no health), or you get your physical champs to do them in.

This active is in concept very similar to void staff or last whisper: you're buying it to actively make your opponent's purchase of a defense less efficient. You don't bother with it if your primary threats aren't stacking hp, the same way you don't bother with void staff if everyone of relevance on the opponent's team isn't bothering to get MR.


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