If you analyse M5 games played...

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Destrucshot

Senior Member

10-06-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by sarrastro View Post
I agree. Alex Ich has played so many champions since I first saw M5 at IEM Kiev, and all I have seen Froggen play is a farmfest Karthus or Anivia.
And thats the thing about CLG.EU which is their biggest weakness; everybody knows what their strategy is: Stall the game until the later stages of the game.

If World Elite can manage to pull off a successful early game and follow up on that lead to close the games then CLG won't be able to do much about it.

M5 have more than one strategy and more than one way to do each strategy, and for the most part it works, as well as being awesome to watch.


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Disillusion

Senior Member

10-06-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by celloguy View Post
Darien is their "weakest" and he's still solid
I don't think he's the weakest, I thought he was MVP in Kiev and maybe Hanover, but then again, that just proves the OP's point. If it's arguable who is their best or weakest player, then they are all equally strong. Darien is easily better than any NA top laner. Voy is the only one close to his level. I think he's better than Wickd.

I think Alex has a great sixth sense for knowing where and when to be to clean up someone who just narrowly escaped with his life from a bottom lane M5 gank. They use their flash, dashes and shields, and think they just got away with 100hp when the jungler ganks bot, and then Alex appears and finishes them off. When I watched Frost vs CLG.eu at OGN finals, there were lots of Frost ganks down bot where yellowpete narrowly survived and escaped. If Alex was there, he would have cut off his escape by going through the jungle and securing the kill. M5 has that five-people-one-mind synergy that most teams lack.


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Disillusion

Senior Member

10-06-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xyltin View Post

SK and Fnatic never destroyed any NA team after S1. Both are great teams, but not better than NA teams.
You must have forgot about IEM NY, which was season 2. Both teams made it to the final against each other 5-0. CLG got crushed 0-1 to Fnatic in group stage and got crushed 2-0 by SK in the SF. They even lost to Sypher in the 3rd place match.

IEM NY had 5 NA teams and 3 EU teams... and the 3 EU teams took the top 3 finishing places, LOL.

Also, CLG.na is not as good as CLG.eu.


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DUNKED

Senior Member

10-06-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Destrucshot View Post
Even then he is still considered one of the best top laners.

In that match where he was Xin, he was denied hard in lane due to the lane swap and still managed to more than pull his weight come team fights, pulling off excellent initiates.
That team fight at the river near baron, I have to say Xin Zhao was the MVP for that initiated.


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LimitlessChaos

Senior Member

10-06-2012

I think a lot of it is also their rapport. I have read a lot about why the Korean teams are successful and I think one of the things is that they aren't like...Curse or SK - you lose and someone is telling you how **** you are or blaming you or just showing their anger at it. Azubu and other Korean teams (probably just the larger gaming collective as this seems cultural) are supposedly more prone to constructively reflecting and trying to keep morale up when bad things happen.

I think that M5 kind of sticks to this too; they want to win and none of them are dumb enough to think that if they're not all of one mind and feeling that they'll still win. If Alex Ich is having a good game and Darien isn't; he isn't going to sit there destroying the morale or breaking rapport by going SaintVicious on him.

I can't say if this is 100% true but I've read a bit about the differences in the cultures of EU and Korean players and it seems like we North Americans (and others I'm sure) tend to reflexively or instinctively wish to berate our fellows (even when they're the best of bros outside of the game) when they make mistakes or a collective failure happens.

I hope Azubu Frost and Moscow 5 meet for the world championship match - it's probably got the most potential to be a really, really good match.


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xXGospellXx

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Senior Member

10-06-2012

I am a fan of M5..but had to admit than they have problems still on lane phase..but after they begun to teamfight they win the match...but in lane phase they still need more work...to dont give firsts kills to others.


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Disillusion

Senior Member

10-06-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xyltin View Post
Nope. There were 2 tourmaments where they battled each other.
One CLG.EU kicked M5 into the lower bracket, but lost to them in the finals pretty hard.
The second one M5 won against CLG.EU 2:0.
And in the third one M5 lost 0:2.

That would make it actually 2:1 for M5, a team that plays 5 times better at any important LAN event, while CLG.EU played always worse at such events.
CLG.EU also lost to SK in the regionals. SK trained with M5 to do so, and it worked. So it seems that M5 pretty much knows how to beat CLG.EU pretty easily.
Alex said before that match that SK will stomp CLG.EU after training with them, and it happened.

CLG.EU international: http://leaguepedia.com/wiki/2012_MLG_Pro_Circuit/Spring

You are very overestimating CLG.EU and underestimating the serious play of M5.
He said major tourneys only. CVC and KOE are online tournaments paying a few grand
to the winner. Those don't count.

Online tournaments are irrelevant. Two french dudes hosting a private tourney and paying 1200 euros to the winner doesn't count as a real tournament. They also lost one Curse invitational to Na'vi.

ECC Poland and Dreamhack are major tourneys, but it should also be noted that CLG were knocked out of the online qualifiers for Dreamhack and only got to be there because their fans financed their trip to enter an offline qualifier. That's the only LOL tournament that ever had an offline qualifier, and the teams which eliminated them online (Teamless and Na'Vi who were also knocked out of online quallies) were not lucky enough to have generous fans who would pay for their trip as well. So for me there will always be a big asterisk next to the Dreamhack win.

Counting only LAN tournaments, they are 1-1, though in maps it's 4-2 in CLG.eu's favor.

In titles won though, there is a big disparity.

CLG.eu entered 5 tournaments (MLG Anaheim, Dreamhack*, OGN summer, ECC Poland, EU Regionals) and have one title (20% title win rate) and 2 runner up finishes.

M5 entered 5 tournaments (Kiev, Hanover, Dreamhack, ECC Poland, EU Regionals) and have 4 titles (80% title win rate) and 1 runner up finish.

CLG.eu also never knocked M5 into loser brackets. The one you're talking about is Poland where they did beat M5 in the group stage, but both teams still advanced out of their group into the knockout stage. M5 played standard in that game and knew they didn't need to win. They wanted to keep their anti-turtling strategy secret for a rematch in the finals. If they revealed their hand early, CLG might have been given a chance to adapt to it, so losing in the group stage (or rather, not going out of their way to win it) was a smarter thing to do.


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Disillusion

Senior Member

10-06-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by TLT Phenomen View Post
M5 - CLG.EU 2:1 LAN right now with 5 games won by M5 and 2 games won by CLG.EU.
Where is this? Are these scrims?


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octavian1127

Senior Member

10-06-2012

CLG.eu relies entirely on stalling the game while Froggen farms. Najin Sword put on a clinic on how to beat them. I'd say they have a chance of making it past WE (wasn't impressed by past WE showings), but Frost is gonna kick their teeth in for them.

M5 is very strong, but against teams like TPA and Frost that are just as coordinated AND have a strong early game they're gonna have issues. Honestly, M5 doesn't have the clear cut road to winning that people think they have. TPA is strong, Frost is very strong, and CLG.eu is close to being their cryptonite. I predict M5 doesn't win it all unless they face WE for the finals somehow.


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Shiralune

Senior Member

10-06-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by octavian1127 View Post
CLG.eu relies entirely on stalling the game while Froggen farms. Najin Sword put on a clinic on how to beat them. I'd say they have a chance of making it past WE (wasn't impressed by past WE showings), but Frost is gonna kick their teeth in for them.
How did CLG.EU play vs Frost earlier, anyways? I missed it, but I do know they put up a very good show.