@Riot A serious discussion about gender. Please read

First Riot Post
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Cameo

Recruiter

10-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by IronStylus View Post
I'm going to point out as a male player of this game, that I want to play attractive female characters... in armor... If we make a barbarian for example, whatever way we choose to make her look will be due to choices inherent to her design as a character, not to drive engagement with any specific group. The needs of the character are what counts. If the character appeals to you, congratulations. If it doesn't, congradulate aforementioned group who it happens to appeal to and indulge in the 100 other champions that may suit your fancy, or take a look at something upcoming which floats your boat.

There is no such effort to force ugly champions as we have decided and mentioned that we don't feel our traditionally "ugly" characters work on certain levels, but the past is the past. Our goal is to make the appropriate choices for a character driven by the goals that we establish early on, namely, again, what is best for the character in its context of theme, kit, etc. There is never an effort, nor an edict, nor an initiative to "de-uglify" or "up-uglify" our characters. They will be as "attractive", "sexy", "ugly", "monstrous", or whatever other subjective descriptors that exist as they need to be for their own unique cases.
To be fair, the new Soraka's facial features are completely different than the old one. She was definitely "de-uglified". Not that she was ugly in the first place, but now she just appeals to more people.


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Shaella

Senior Member

10-07-2012

your mom needs to be de-uglified
god i'm bored


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dead robit

Senior Member

10-07-2012

personally my favorite girl champ in lol is redeemed riven. so don't accuse me of being sexist and being a guy who likes skanky champs or skins.

but honestly ive seen more ****ttttyyy things at my college than the skins on lol. like cleavage is sexualized okay. hey its a girl shes being sexualized because she has boobs.

sadly in nowadays cleavage is normal and covering up is conservative that's just how it is now. sorry.


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Gunxlinger

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Senior Member

10-07-2012

No one explained this to me yet:
karma - So ugly no one plays her
shyvana - No hint of sexualization. Looks like a mutated human
soraka - Horn on her head. Looks like a teenager
Annie - I wouldnt 'do' her :/
Cassopia - Imagine a male champion who was a snake/ Would you count that as oversexualized. Not really.
Evelynn - Ugly Troll
leblanc - Mutated human demon
Morgana - Mutated human demon
Nidalee - Ugly
Syndra - Mutated human demon

only a FEW women are sexualized.


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MTaur

Senior Member

10-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Emailsúpport View Post
I don't find Zyra or Cassiopeia attractive at all, is it something wrong with me?
Could be personal taste, sure. If you claim you don't even think Zyra is supposed to be sexy, or that you otherwise can't tell what motivated the model design of her vs Mao, then you're probably trolling, so whatever.


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Shaella

Senior Member

10-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gunxlinger View Post
No one explained this to me yet:
karma - So ugly no one plays her
shyvana - No hint of sexualization. Looks like a mutated human
soraka - Horn on her head. Looks like a teenager
Annie - I wouldnt 'do' her :/
Cassopia - Imagine a male champion who was a snake/ Would you count that as oversexualized. Not really.
Evelynn - Ugly Troll
leblanc - Mutated human demon
Morgana - Mutated human demon
Nidalee - Ugly
Syndra - Mutated human demon

only a FEW women are sexualized.
People keep counting Karma as a champion, but i've never heard of her


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Crystal Castles

Junior Member

10-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rauhel View Post
If we aren't playing to jerk off, it should make no difference to you if they create a granny champion, so why do you care?

I don't care which is the WHOLE POINT. Why do you even care!? If they want them skinny and attractive then let them. No reason to complain about it.


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Emailsúpport

Member

10-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gunxlinger View Post
No one explained this to me yet:
karma - So ugly no one plays her
shyvana - No hint of sexualization. Looks like a mutated human
soraka - Horn on her head. Looks like a teenager
Annie - I wouldnt 'do' her :/
Cassopia - Imagine a male champion who was a snake/ Would you count that as oversexualized. Not really.
Evelynn - Ugly Troll
leblanc - Mutated human demon
Morgana - Mutated human demon
Nidalee - Ugly
Syndra - Mutated human demon

only a FEW women are sexualized.
I love how women keep thinking that they know what we think is sexy.
We have different taste too.


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notFREEfood

Member

10-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gunxlinger View Post
No one explained this to me yet:
karma - So ugly no one plays her
shyvana - No hint of sexualization. Looks like a mutated human
soraka - Horn on her head. Looks like a teenager
Annie - I wouldnt 'do' her :/
Cassopia - Imagine a male champion who was a snake/ Would you count that as oversexualized. Not really.
Evelynn - Ugly Troll
leblanc - Mutated human demon
Morgana - Mutated human demon
Nidalee - Ugly
Syndra - Mutated human demon

only a FEW women are sexualized.
I'd say nid is only ugly because she needs a rework


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get dat birdman

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Senior Member

10-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rauhel View Post
But Olaf is not aesthetically pleasing to most women.
As much as I agree with most of your post, it's really hard to take a post about generalization seriously, when one generalizes and speaks for a demographic in its entirety, whether one belongs to the demographic or not. Whether you, yourself, find Olaf in any form attractive is one thing. Whether that girl down the street does is another thing entirely. Moreover, not ever male that plays this game is white, or even straight. Myself, I actually do find Pentakill Olaf pretty damn hot. But then again, I also don't find Varus very attractive at all. That's as a non-white, non-straight, albeit cisgendered, male. I would also point out the ignorance of Ryze in this post, who has been just as shirtless as Varus has been, for longer.

Quote:
• Officer Caitlyn is in many ways the most disappointing. She is in a position of authority. She is the Sheriff of Piltover. But, she gets a stripper cop outfit. Riot Graves, and outlaw, actually looks like a real cop. No officer in real life dresses like Caitlyn. They’d never be taken seriously. She could have been a badass. Real missed opportunity, here.
While I'm not disagreeing with this point, I would look at her default skin too; that's the one she uses AS the sheriff of Piltover, not Officer Caitlyn skin.

Quote:
• Sandstorm Katarina is a belly dancer.
She also has more clothes on than actual belly dancers. On this one, your point is kind of invalid.

Quote:
Not a single male champion has a stripper skin. If I missed something, please let me know. You could have a sexy fireman or something. It’s something exclusive the female champions. It’s just one of the ways that women are treated differently.
Would totally buy a Chippendale Graves/TF/GP/J4/Garen skin. Just sayin'.

Quote:
• Evelynn is wearing lingerie. She is literally walking around the fields of justice in her underwear. I guess she is relying on her stealth.
Like Ahri (and to a degree, Zyra) there is lore justification for this. She goes around seducing men in order to kill them, both on and off the Fields of Justice.

Quote:
• Cassiopeia may not be human from the waist down, but if you are arguing that that disqualifies her, then you are arguing that mermaids are not a sexual fantasy to millions.
Again, lore justification. Her skin hardens enough that she doesn't actually need armor.

Quote:
• Janna even makes a phone *** reference, solidifying the portrayal of women as adult entertainment workers.
There's a point where sometimes it's just because. With this one it seems like you want it either all or none - either ALL champions get it or NONE. Remember, I have zero attraction to the female gender, but I think with Janna you're taking it too far. It's like you're saying that it's not okay AT ALL for female characters to have this. It's also as if you feel Riot ONLY makes a point to have their female characters be stripper-esque. I don't feel that's the case. I honestly think Janna is meant to be a tongue-in-cheek humor in this regard (though I would also like to point out her Victorious skin has her pretty well covered up - even more so than her Hextech skin).

Quote:
• Soraka’s old art was all about the side boob. Her new art is better, but still very sexy.
Uh, if you say so. If that's the only thing that caught your attention on that splash, then you were honestly just looking to say "Hey, this is where it looks like they're trying to do x." I don't think that's fair, because personally, the big thing that caught *my* attention in her old splash was always her weapon. If anything, I just found her clothing kind of odd. But then, maybe because I wasn't specifically looking for things that were "supposed to" make her sexually attractive to straight men (or non-straight women, for that matter).

Quote:
• Varus. The only male champion that makes the list. More on why, later.
Meaning, "the only male champion that I personally find sexually attractive, and the only one that I personally feel Riot has gone out of their way to appeal to people." Not everyone shares your opinions. I'd actually say that Hired Gun Graves and Augmented Singed fall into this category.

Quote:
• Kayle is perhaps the best portrayed female. Her armor is actually practical. No complaints.
I find the notion that everyone has to be covered up at all times actually kind of ridiculous. Taking it to extremes is absurd at best.

Quote:
• Diana’s default look is fantastic. I am not thrilled about her Dark Valkyrie skin.
I would actually like to point out that if you look at it closely, it's actually not far off from Battle Bunny Riven. Yeah, there are some fairly subtle differences (like a bit of armor on the legs and chest, as well as gauntlets), but on the whole, it actually isn't too much added.

Finally, I would like to point out a counterpoint to Battle Bunny Riven in Riven's DEFAULT skin, Crimson Elite Riven, Redeemed Riven and Championship Riven. Do these skins not count? Are they also not part of the champion? Since when does Battle Bunny Riven - one skin out of five - count as a champion? What about Vayne's other skins? Or do you mean to say that one skin of Vayne's counts for the champion as a whole? (Though I would agree her default skin fits into this category based on splash but not game model, her other two skins do not.)

Quote:
• Pentakill Olaf is not going to turn anyone on. He still caters to straight guys’ tastes.
Generalization is not okay.

Quote:
• Lee Sin is shirtless, and not hideously muscular. But his shirtlessness is more about him being a martial artist. It serves a practical function. It’s not about being seductive.
But he could just as easily do it in a shirt. In fact, if we wanted to be PRACTICAL about it (one of your bigger points), he actually SHOULD be wearing something to protect his vital parts (wasn't that the argument you used about Sivir's armor?).

Quote:
Now, Varus made the sexy list because he has an attractive physique, and his nakedness doesn’t seem to serve any apparent function other than fanservice. Still, he is the only example I could find that meets these requirements. That is one male champion out of 28. That means 3.5% of male champions are sexualized, and 78.5% of female champions are sexualized. How can you tell me that there is no disparity? That everything is fine. How can you deny the fact that women are treated differently?
"Sexualized" really is based on what you make of it. Again I would point out Ryze. Where is the practicality in him being shirtless while wearing a scroll on his back? None. I would probably also say Djinn Malzahar could go here. Pre-Void Kassadin. And while I agree that I don't think the artist was going for sexualization with Ruthless Pantheon, if you want to include old Soraka artwork, I think it's fair to say Ruthless Pantheon. While still a relatively lower number compared to females (some of which I still disagree on), it is more than you are saying. You also are not accounting for the fact that not everyone shares your taste.