@Riot A serious discussion about gender. Please read

First Riot Post
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TÅ ERNOBOG

Member

10-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by IronStylus View Post
This response might be curt because I'm bordering on brain-dead at the moment, nothing personal, just super tired:

Critical is fine, that keeps us thinking. I agree that there are incongruities with the Shyvana and Sejani skins. They don't need to be "sexy", I personally hate boob windows. Hate.

My brain actually runs opposite. I was put through the ringer with the Sejuani comments, which I have since reversed course on, and in response created an entire character who's only exposed flesh is her head and fingers, removed any sort of heal on her boots, threw a toilet bowl over her bossoms and put a giant brand on her face amongst other things. Hopefully that absolves me. No, I don't look at a champion and say "How can I make this sexy?" Hell, Diana is the epitome of sexy to me. BUT REMEMBER! I am not the only concept artist here!

Personally, I wish Syndra's alternate skin was her base, but that's simple preference.

Soraka, sorry, I have to disagree with you there. I think she's an elegant alternative to that abomination on hooves we had walking around.

Again, sorry for the short, stern-ish answers, you make excellent points all around, I'm just running out of steam a bit =)
The problem i have with soraka is not the new skin its the same thing i have with the changed cait skins is that she looks like she reversed in age to a teenager for some reason otherwise i like the new look of soraka


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tempnameA461

Member

10-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by GrizlakMonger View Post
Wow, too many pages to ever actually get an opinion in to riot, but honestly many of the women characters are proportioned so ridiculously I don't see how they can even be considered attractive. They look so fake and freakish. They hardly represent a human form and I'd like to see more reasonably designed female champions and toning back on existing ones.
The Internet.
You just won it.


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The Red Magister

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Senior Member

10-07-2012

I always enjoy reading the parrot's posts.


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slowpokie

Senior Member

10-07-2012

Shrug. I don't play games for 'mancandy'. Just like I don't play it for 'cute characters awwz'. That's just demeaning. I play it for the gameplay.

The largest factor contributing to my going more 'underground' is the sexist player base and the dumb bimbos. Yea, I hate the dumb bimbos every bit as much as I hate the whiny ragers ; I don't need more "Don't call me a bro, I'm a girl See me playing a GAME!" thrown in my chat when I'm trying to play than I need a "LEARN 2 PLAY HUEHUEHUE". But more infuriating than that is when someone tells me to go back to playing only supports when I'm having an off-game.

I prefer genderless anonymity. And plus, anyone and everyone can be bros.


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Alice Twilight

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Senior Member

10-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by IronStylus View Post
I get you and you're right. A sexualized pose can defeat the purpose of a de-sexualized character.
I just want to jump in here, as a long time comic book reader, I'm really tired of the broke back ****/ass pose, really tired and I was really disappointed to see that you used it for art reworks of 4 of your champions all at the same time. I've taken some heat for voicing this opinion but also got some rallying cries. They also all look like they're starving to death, save morgana whom I'm always pictured as having bony, malnourished look. It just really bums me out that such incredibly talented artists are relegating themselves to using a pose that isn't actually all that sexy and at least for me creates this really weird uncanny valley effect making them appear much less attractive. Yeah I know sexy is subjective but I think it's kind of clear from trends in the artwork how your artists tend to portray sexy much of the time. (and I know exactly how subjective sexy is as a concept, I find Kayle to be one of the sexiest champions in the game, because I love a woman in full plate. Still I'm not 100% opposed to showing skin, I've complained a lot about Sejuani in the past but truth be told, if she had long untamed hair and a body that actually looked battle hardened (ie covered in scars and more muscular) I'd buy that, and agree that it fits within a subjective aesthetic of 'sexy' as for right now I think she looks like a supermodel in a fur bikini which I don't find appealing (though I'm sure someone does so please don't take this criticism too hard). At this point I think the lateness of the hour is getting to me as I've been ranting for a while and still haven't closed this parenthesis.)

Well that's a bit better I apologize for the rant, but I do get a bit worked up over this sort of thing and it is late, thus I may not be as coherent or restrained as I'd like to normally be. And I don't want to rant either, I'd like a discussion, because this is honestly one of the things that bugs me the most, and uneven portrayal of women especially in video games, a medium that has a history of 'not getting it'. Riot certainly isn't the worst offender, not even close but it's still quite visible. I wish there was a better way to have dialogue on this like have a Q&A about it on reddit, or make a podcast, or hell even have a light interview with me and I'll post it on youtube, just, whatever because I know this post is going to carry a condemning connotation, I don't want it too, but it's a little tough to convey tone through text only and I'm not in the proper mindset to mellow this out, and for all I know you're working really hard to fix this and the next champion is the first step but it just hasn't been communicated to use yet.


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Krufix

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Senior Member

10-07-2012

Riot's plan: http://i.imgur.com/jeZAK.gif


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tempnameA461

Member

10-07-2012

Why do most lesbians try so hard to look like dudes?
Do they really want their partner to have to kiss someone that looks like a dude?


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Encouraging

Senior Member

10-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rauhel View Post
Next, we will talk about the base design of champions. Miss Fortune and Ahri are flirtatious, and while that isn’t really a problem, there are no guys that tease or flirt. The following are champions that are sexualized, not just in skins, but in their default splash art.

• Zyra is technically a plant, but she is using a human body as a vessel; one that she barely covers.
Zyra has a Garden of Eden thing going--temptation is part of her danger. Flowers are meant to attract things, but at the same time many plants use flowers to kill their prey. The beauty/danger thing is reflected in her visual design and in her her squishy/snare/burst damage gameplay.
Quote:
• Syndra’s cleavage is the focal point of her splash art.
• Akali’s rather large breasts are barely covered by those strips of cloth. It’s completely impractical for a serious warrior.
• LeBlanc is barely covered.
LeBlanc is an illusionist and trickster, so it is natural her outfit makes her look like a seductress. It is a bit over the top, but most fantasy/superhero type outfits are over the top in whatever they portray.
Quote:
• Sivir is wearing the most pointless armor of all time. She isn’t protecting any vital points.
• Sona’s boobs. Need I say more?
• Ahri at least has lore to justify her being a flirt.
• Miss Fortune is hands down the most sexualized character in the game. In her new splash art it looks like her clothes don’t even cover her nipples. If we had more of a bird’s-eye-view, this game would probably have an AO title
• Caitlyn should probably not shop in the children’s section and find something that fits.
• Fiora’s skin tight outfit accentuates her ass.
• Evelynn is wearing lingerie. She is literally walking around the fields of justice in her underwear. I guess she is relying on her stealth.
Her name is Eve, she is dressed like a temptress, her lingerie has sharp metal spikes built into it. She runs around in high-heels and stabs them into her enemies. Disarming sexiness is part of what makes her threatening.
Quote:
• Lux used to be a counterexample. She used to be.
Lux's new splash art is very skinny and bendy, but she is still a counterexample in every other element of her design, sans the very gaudy sorceress skin.
Quote:
• Morgana gets thinner and thinner, and her breasts get bigger and bigger. She is also wearing a bra to battle. Smart.
• Cassiopeia may not be human from the waist down, but if you are arguing that that disqualifies her, then you are arguing that mermaids are not a sexual fantasy to millions.
Her lore is all about using sexuality as a weapon for her city state. Then she got turned into a siren/serpent monster who is simultaneously monstrous and sexy.
Quote:
• Katarina screams ***. She has three stripper skins, but the default skin isn’t any less sexualized.
• Nidalee kind of has an excuse, since she is basically She-Tarzan.
• Janna even makes a phone *** reference, solidifying the portrayal of women as adult entertainment workers.
• Soraka’s old art was all about the side boob. Her new art is better, but still very sexy.
• Sejuani seems to be immune to the cold. In fact, everyone from Freljord seems to be.
• Ashe is better than Sejuani, at least.
• Varus. The only male champion that makes the list. More on why, later.
I agree that a lot of these female characters are generally overly-sexualised, but some of the ones you listed are sexy in ways that make thematic sense--sexiness is part of their danger, and in a way that generally conveys information about their gameplay, as you pointed out with Evelynn.


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Dimmu Mikeir

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Senior Member

10-07-2012

I think I might burn for this but what do other people think of Miss Fortune on this subject? Specifically her original skin.

I saw a fan made art/skin a while ago called Ivory Corsair Miss Fortune and it just blew my eyes wide open on the way I look at female champions. My main wonder here is, does anyone else also think it should have been her original skin? To me its a huge example of sexy vs ****ty...

for reference:
Pic - http://melgramn.deviantart.com/art/Miss-Fortune-Ivory-Corsair-183672160

Skin - http://leaguecraft.com/skins/3030-ivory-corsair-miss-fortune.xhtml

Thread - http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/...d.php?t=307132

On other champions like Sej, I really wish she was heavily armored. I was looking forward to a female champion that looked awesome in the way that mordekaiser looks. I know we got Kayle and Diana but they just don't have that look of having some badass armor thats going to wreck your face... (Darius and Mordekaiser LOOK intimidating... NO female in the league does). Thats my opinion anyways...


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Meiu

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Senior Member

10-07-2012

Fail whiteknight is fail.