Why does the support and adc always go bot?

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Best Kitten NA

Member

10-04-2012

why does the support and adc practically always go bot lane?

probably an obvious and easily answered question, but why can't the support + adc go top? i have a theory that it is because drag is very easy to get with an adc + support shields/heals and a junglers smite, but i don't really know .__.

why does the support and adc practically always go bot lane?


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popeyepoop1

Member

10-04-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by MeowNoob View Post
why does the support and adc practically always go bot lane?

probably an obvious and easily answered question, but why can't the support + adc go top? i have a theory that it is because drag is very easy to get with an adc + support shields/heals and a junglers smite, but i don't really know .__.

why does the support and adc practically always go bot lane?
You answered it yourself, Dragon control. Dragon is an important objective to have control over.

Here, I took this from another website.

Ranged carry/support is practically unbeatable bot. It takes a very specific lane setup to beat it, and even if you do you won't scale in to late game. What's more, some lane setups such as Soraka/Graves can just beat pretty much anything, even counter lanes. AP goes mid for three reasons: Gank coverage, the fact that you need ap, and also for fast levels due to AP's are better with levels due to their spells scaling this way. AP champions are also generally bad at laning, and as such they are given the safest lane in order to ensure they don't have imminent destruction. Junglers are tanks cause... junglers don't really get gold and it's easiest to not get gold with champions that are inheritely tanky and rely mostly on CC.

Top lane is bit different. Top lane as it is is the team's main tank for the first 15 minutes. He can't get wards for the first 5 minutes, he's constantly getting ganked, the opposing laner is trying his hardest to kill him. Effectively, the top laner eats all the jungle ganks for the rest of the team because he is the most gankable. What does this mean? Well look above. You send an AD bot because AD/support is really strong, and you NEED an AD for late game. You send AP mid because AP ganks are really strong and you NEED an AP for late game, but because they aren't good at laning they get the safest lane. What I'm saying is that there is a rational reason that people send the bruiser top. There is a general need for someone who can eat all the ganks yet come out alive. However, simply being tanky and beefy is not the only way to survive top lane. In fact, one might suggest that the only reason top laners need to be so beefy is because their general ailment of being "melee" causes them to be so gankable. However don't get carried away, the bruiser's sheer tenacity is what allows them to survive those ganks.


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Mynt

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Senior Member

10-04-2012

It's all about dragon.

But since about the beginning of season 2, the strategy for mid is to wipe the minion wave every 30 seconds, which only works in mid lane. (Since it's closer to the towers.)

I was once on a 5's team where I convinced them to go Support + ADC mid lane, while we had an AP with escapes go bottom. Was good on purple side, less so on blue side.


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Best Kitten NA

Member

10-04-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by popeyepoop1 View Post
You answered it yourself, Dragon control. Dragon is an important objective to have control over.

Here, I took this from another website.

Ranged carry/support is practically unbeatable bot. It takes a very specific lane setup to beat it, and even if you do you won't scale in to late game. What's more, some lane setups such as Soraka/Graves can just beat pretty much anything, even counter lanes. AP goes mid for three reasons: Gank coverage, the fact that you need ap, and also for fast levels due to AP's are better with levels due to their spells scaling this way. AP champions are also generally bad at laning, and as such they are given the safest lane in order to ensure they don't have imminent destruction. Junglers are tanks cause... junglers don't really get gold and it's easiest to not get gold with champions that are inheritely tanky and rely mostly on CC.

Top lane is bit different. Top lane as it is is the team's main tank for the first 15 minutes. He can't get wards for the first 5 minutes, he's constantly getting ganked, the opposing laner is trying his hardest to kill him. Effectively, the top laner eats all the jungle ganks for the rest of the team because he is the most gankable. What does this mean? Well look above. You send an AD bot because AD/support is really strong, and you NEED an AD for late game. You send AP mid because AP ganks are really strong and you NEED an AP for late game, but because they aren't good at laning they get the safest lane. What I'm saying is that there is a rational reason that people send the bruiser top. There is a general need for someone who can eat all the ganks yet come out alive. However, simply being tanky and beefy is not the only way to survive top lane. In fact, one might suggest that the only reason top laners need to be so beefy is because their general ailment of being "melee" causes them to be so gankable. However don't get carried away, the bruiser's sheer tenacity is what allows them to survive those ganks.
thanks that explains it very well! i had a feeling that was to do with it :]


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TheDarkestRaven

Member

01-17-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by popeyepoop1 View Post
You answered it yourself, Dragon control. Dragon is an important objective to have control over.

Here, I took this from another website.

Ranged carry/support is practically unbeatable bot. It takes a very specific lane setup to beat it, and even if you do you won't scale in to late game. What's more, some lane setups such as Soraka/Graves can just beat pretty much anything, even counter lanes. AP goes mid for three reasons: Gank coverage, the fact that you need ap, and also for fast levels due to AP's are better with levels due to their spells scaling this way. AP champions are also generally bad at laning, and as such they are given the safest lane in order to ensure they don't have imminent destruction. Junglers are tanks cause... junglers don't really get gold and it's easiest to not get gold with champions that are inheritely tanky and rely mostly on CC.

Top lane is bit different. Top lane as it is is the team's main tank for the first 15 minutes. He can't get wards for the first 5 minutes, he's constantly getting ganked, the opposing laner is trying his hardest to kill him. Effectively, the top laner eats all the jungle ganks for the rest of the team because he is the most gankable. What does this mean? Well look above. You send an AD bot because AD/support is really strong, and you NEED an AD for late game. You send AP mid because AP ganks are really strong and you NEED an AP for late game, but because they aren't good at laning they get the safest lane. What I'm saying is that there is a rational reason that people send the bruiser top. There is a general need for someone who can eat all the ganks yet come out alive. However, simply being tanky and beefy is not the only way to survive top lane. In fact, one might suggest that the only reason top laners need to be so beefy is because their general ailment of being "melee" causes them to be so gankable. However don't get carried away, the bruiser's sheer tenacity is what allows them to survive those ganks.
Thanks, I had that question as well about the certain positions your team has to fill. Thanks for finding that.


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PogoPogoPogoPogo

Senior Member

01-17-2013

Support/ADC can and do regularly go top lane in the tournaments. It just depends. But going top lane and quickly pushing down the tower can be a perfectly effective strategy.


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Shadow Light M37

Senior Member

01-17-2013

No point, the enemy at bot will just swap with top.


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PogoPogoPogoPogo

Senior Member

01-17-2013

They don't always do that. Fact of the matter is, both teams get a 2v1 in their advantage when you swap.

Regardless, even if the enemy team also swaps, it still means the ADC/support isn't bottom, which is the original point of my post.

But the thing is, some teams will swap with you afraid of their 1's weakness, but other teams will choose not to swap if they feel like they have a bigger advantage in the 2v1 lane.



EDIT: In fact, sometimes it might even be to your team's advantage to force the lane swap (force 1v1 in bottom lane).

Let's suppose the enemy support is Nunu and your top lane bruiser is Cho'gath. In this scenario, it would be advantageous, for dragon control purposes, for Cho'gath's team to try forcing the solo"top" bruisers into bottom lane. Not only does this bring an extra smite (Cho's ultimate) into bottom lane (closer to dragon), but it also forces a smite on the enemy team (Nunu's Q) farther from dragon.


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violentdrug

Junior Member

01-17-2013

I remember the old days with AD carries in mid.