So KZ is basically a Kassadin that actually requires brain cells to play.

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Risemix

Senior Member

10-01-2012

On SR he is underwhelming. Where do you put him? Certainly not the jungle, his build is too expensive and his ganks are mediocre without exhaust.

And his top lane is okay but he loses most trades against players near their creep wave.


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DiscworldDeath

Senior Member

10-01-2012

On lolmatches, his win rates are:
Normal SR: 45%
Ranked: 38%
Dominion: 46%
TT: 46%
TT Ranked: 53%

Now, I'd be more interesting to see him after the next patch, after people really have more time to learn with him, and aside from Ranked SR these numbers have been getting better (he was even lower yesterday), but these numbers aren't too hot.

Not sure why, I think he'd much better on SR than Dominion.


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Catnium

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Senior Member

10-01-2012

ghostblade +brutaliser+ cdr boots is expensive now a days ?

and i keep sayng this but ever sinds he got released on the pbe i kept saying he was made for dominion in my opinion


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Reynmaker

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Senior Member

10-01-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Glumduk View Post
SR players seem to think he's underwhelming. He may get a buff. Can you imagine?

:3
So was Jayce, then came a tourney and a Dyrus. Right now, there is a pro on a smurf somewhere, not streaming and learning this champ, then comes a tourney..........


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AlphaFerric

Senior Member

10-01-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Infirc View Post
His damage is insane though and there's more possibilites of ISolated Targets in Dominion than in any other map.
Just makes me think that an easy counter is to not wander around by yourself, or if you do take the safe route.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Risemix View Post
On SR he is underwhelming. Where do you put him? Certainly not the jungle, his build is too expensive and his ganks are mediocre without exhaust.

And his top lane is okay but he loses most trades against players near their creep wave.
Not sure why you wouldn't put him in the jungle. His ganks can be superb with the right team and he's designed to gank mid and top, plus he has great clear speed.


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Risemix

Senior Member

10-01-2012

His ganks are okay, definitely not the worst, but junglers with mediocre clear speeds like his (I think it's around 3:50) really ought to have more secure ganking tools. If they aren't ridiculously extended you can really only just jump on them from the brush and start hitting them, and he isn't very good at sticking to **** without a phage. He's functional but mediocre. You have to keep in mind he's competing with champions like Maokai, Nautlius, Lee Sin, etc.

His jungle builds suck, too. His best build on SR is expensive and junglers get way less gold. I dunno, I know it's hard to see if you haven't tried him, but I'm not the only person saying this. Stonewall doesn't like him, high elo players don't like him, even gendisc doesn't like him.

He's not the worst champion ever released, he's just mediocre (on SR). He's an assassin without the damage you'd expect from an assassin, builds that require a ton of income to maintain, average or below average clear speed, and no CC. There's not a whole lot to like other than his clean-up (absolutely disgusting) and high constant damage output. And oh, he can't assassinate carries, he gets SUPERPEELED instantly.


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Panwar

Senior Member

10-01-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by AlphaFerric View Post
Just makes me think that an easy counter is to not wander around by yourself, or if you do take the safe route.
.
In this case "Isolated" means a couple of feet from the nearest ally. If you are on one side of the lane and your buddy is on the other side you are both isolated as far as KZ is concerned.


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Infirc

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Senior Member

10-01-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Risemix View Post
His ganks are okay, definitely not the worst, but junglers with mediocre clear speeds like his (I think it's around 3:50) really ought to have more secure ganking tools. If they aren't ridiculously extended you can really only just jump on them from the brush and start hitting them, and he isn't very good at sticking to **** without a phage. He's functional but mediocre. You have to keep in mind he's competing with champions like Maokai, Nautlius, Lee Sin, etc.

His jungle builds suck, too. His best build on SR is expensive and junglers get way less gold. I dunno, I know it's hard to see if you haven't tried him, but I'm not the only person saying this. Stonewall doesn't like him, high elo players don't like him, even gendisc doesn't like him.

He's not the worst champion ever released, he's just mediocre (on SR). He's an assassin without the damage you'd expect from an assassin, builds that require a ton of income to maintain, average or below average clear speed, and no CC. There's not a whole lot to like other than his clean-up (absolutely disgusting) and high constant damage output. And oh, he can't assassinate carries, he gets SUPERPEELED instantly.

Believeing everything the Pros Say is Akin to believing anything that the Tv says a.k.a Not good, i thought you'd have already learned it from the oddone's Ezreal quotes and Elementz's tier lists. They were the same people that said "Jayce UP nids buff" when he was released. the fact he is "underwhelming" in summonner's rift is because he is a Pure assassin: you know those guys who's primary role is to isolate a target and then kill it, well isolating someone is actually hard when their team is around, and Sr players tend to move in pack excepting from that random Noob that goes bot to clean a creep wave when there's the threat of a team fight but nothing happens yet and then he makes his team lose the 5v4 fight.


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BigDaddyDelish

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Senior Member

10-01-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by konfetarius View Post
No where near unkillable. If he doesn't use Riftwalk offensively, he is basically a crappy AP. If he does, then he can be killed in short order because he is still squishy. His damage is nothing special until mid-game, his tankiness is nothing special until he has items, and his mana pool is not big enough to truly abuse his insane mobility or R stack until later on.

Kha'Zix does not get "countered" by stealth reveal. It's not a major aspect of his kit, and he will just save it for duels against heroes without those items.

He is far above Katarina or Talon. He has their advantages without their weaknesses.
Stealth reveal isn't the end-all be all against him, but it's a huge boon that I don't think people yet understand.

You completely nullify his passive after his first attack. That is pretty significant, even though it may not seem so. Also, his ult serves no function at that point if you ever fight vs him, which is important if you are someone who is trying to duel him (which you should never do as you will get annihilated more than likely).


Kassadin isn't hugely known for superb damage output on Dominion, and isn't what makes him especially strong. Ffs, most Kass players rush Frozen Heart, yet he's still considered to be one of the greatest terrors to face on Dominion. Why? Because he's obnoxious, has hard cc with good base values, and is better than Rammus at being anywhere on the map that needs help.



Also, last time I checked, cc + focus fire is the counter to assassins like Talon/Katarina. Why does that not apply to Kha'Zix also?


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Sauron

Senior Member

10-01-2012

Its like comparing two jet fighters in a bicycle race.