Welcome to the Forum Archive!

Years of conversation fill a ton of digital pages, and we've kept all of it accessible to browse or copy over. Whether you're looking for reveal articles for older champions, or the first time that Rammus rolled into an "OK" thread, or anything in between, you can find it here. When you're finished, check out the boards to join in the latest League of Legends discussions.

GO TO BOARDS


☆☆☆ WHY You Should Click PUNISH For One Bad Incident Out Of Five ☆☆☆

Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

KittyPrawn

Senior Member

07-18-2013

Quote:
JohnnyOmega:
Anyone can post responses and arguments on the threads I've made. Anyone can post counter-argument threads themselves.

If I couldn't push and argue for my opinions, then what would be the point of a forum?

I'll never know what makes you specifically happy if you don't tell me what that is so I implore you to post your opinions about what you want. I can only make an educated guess about what would make the community as a whole happier by what I have observed in Tribunal and the discussions that I have analyzed in both the games and the forums.

Who is terrified of getting banned for commenting? Is that how YOU feel? Then please know that I am just a player with a strongly voiced opinion and I love you.


If you haven't seen posts about people who are terrified of getting banned for commenting, then you don't pay close enough attention to these forums. It's not how I personally feel. I don't make passive aggressive remarks. My posts about how I feel personally describe how I feel.

Again, I don't need you or anyone to consider MY feelings when judging. I judge to consider MY feelings. But, telling people you should punish for one offense gives people the impression that if they say anything and it can somehow be viewed negatively, they will get banned.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

JohnnyOmega

Senior Member

07-18-2013

Quote:
PenguinKillBear:
I have no desire to tell you not to voice your opinions. If you do a search by my name you can see that I have made my own threads about how I decide to punish.

I, like Kitty, think that the way this thread is set up and worded makes it sound like you are trying to tell people, "this is how you need to vote in order to do it correctly." I take issue with that. Maybe, that was not your intent. It is how it came across to me.

Also, that was precisely the reason I gave the example I did. According to how this thread is set up, I would take it that you would want that punished. I feel like your thread is not adequately representing your beliefs as well as it could. As I knew most likely, that you would probably not punish a case. It is, however, an example of a minor infraction across games. Your thread delivers a very different opinion of that case than you do.

I also will punish for any instance of hate speech. So we are on the same page there.



Okay after considering your advice, I will add something to the original post to make it more palatable.

"NOTE: The majority-accepted standard of what makes an incident punishable may vary depending on the shared opinions of the community. It is recommended to discuss a case in the forums and receive potentially helpful feedback if you are unsure of how to vote on a particular case. There may be threads on the forums that favor one perspective or another. It is up to you to decide whether you agree with them or not."


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

PenguinKillBear

Senior Member

07-18-2013

Quote:
JohnnyOmega:
Okay after considering your advice, I will add something to the original post to make it more palatable.

"NOTE: The majority-accepted standard of what makes an incident punishable may vary depending on the shared opinions of the community. It is recommended to discuss a case in the forums and receive potentially helpful feedback if you are unsure of how to vote on a particular case. There may be threads on the forums that favor one perspective or another. It is up to you to decide whether you agree with them or not."

I would prefer if the disclaimer said something more to the effect of:

"Note: These are my opinions. As this is a community driven system that is created by the opinions of individuals, when in doubt simply ask yourself if you would mind the reported player in your game. If the answer is yes, than you punish. If you have no problem with the reported player in your game you press pardon. In the end, you should vote on what you find acceptable."


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

JohnnyOmega

Senior Member

07-18-2013

Quote:
KittyPrawn:
If you haven't seen posts about people who are terrified of getting banned for commenting, then you don't pay close enough attention to these forums. It's not how I personally feel. I don't make passive aggressive remarks. My posts about how I feel personally describe how I feel.

Again, I don't need you or anyone to consider MY feelings when judging. I judge to consider MY feelings. But, telling people you should punish for one offense gives people the impression that if they say anything and it can somehow be viewed negatively, they will get banned.


Could you point to the posts then, if I haven't been paying close enough attention? I will admit that since my participation is not my job in real life, I have limited time to go through threads.

And are you talking about getting banned in the game or banned in the forums? Either way, I find it hard to believe someone would be scared of being banned for making comments in a forum (unless it's something like posting pornographic links) when by its very nature the forums are a place for public argument and we have lots of posts doing just that.

Also, "should" doesn't mean "have to". I also try to provide explanations and arguments to back up my "should". The bulk of the original post here as an example of that.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Just Mid

Member

07-18-2013

Upvoting. Moving on.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

JohnnyOmega

Senior Member

07-18-2013

Quote:
PenguinKillBear:
I would prefer if the disclaimer said something more to the effect of:

"Note: These are my opinions. As this is a community driven system that is created by the opinions of individuals, when in doubt simply ask yourself if you would mind the reported player in your game. If the answer is yes, than you punish. If you have no problem with the reported player in your game you press pardon. In the end, you should vote on what you find acceptable."


But the original post in this particular thread is not just "opinions". It is also an examination of a possibility that genuinely exists because of how the system is designed. I use the words "might" and "can" a lot for that reason.

If you're talking about my "When To Click Punish" thread. There has already been a disclaimer there for quite a while.

I will add your quote except for the first part though.

One might also want take into account when determining whether behavior is acceptable the likely reaction from teammates as well since this is a team game.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

KittyPrawn

Senior Member

07-18-2013

Quote:
JohnnyOmega:
Could you point to the posts then, if I haven't been paying close enough attention? I will admit that since my participation is not my job in real life, I have limited time to go through threads.

And are you talking about getting banned in the game or banned in the forums? Either way, I find it hard to believe someone would be scared of being banned for making comments in a forum (unless it's something like posting pornographic links) when by its very nature the forums are a place for public argument and we have lots of posts doing just that.

Also, "should" doesn't mean "have to". I also try to provide explanations and arguments to back up my "should". The bulk of the original post here as an example of that.


Why would I be saying that they would get banned in the game for talking on the forum when we were discussing Tribunal behavior? That would just be silly. I will try and find you some posts, but as you said, this forum is not my job in real life either. But, there are plenty of people who believe that the only way to play the game is to mute everyone and never type, otherwise they will just get punished. This isn't something I'm making up. This is a prevalent thought among a lot of people who post. They think it is their only solution to not getting banned.

Sure, you use should and might and can. But, you also just said that this thread isn't an opinion, so, I'm not sure how I should consider it.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

JohnnyOmega

Senior Member

07-18-2013

Quote:
KittyPrawn:
Why would I be saying that they would get banned in the game for talking on the forum when we were discussing Tribunal behavior? That would just be silly. I will try and find you some posts, but as you said, this forum is not my job in real life either. But, there are plenty of people who believe that the only way to play the game is to mute everyone and never type, otherwise they will just get punished. This isn't something I'm making up. This is a prevalent thought among a lot of people who post. They think it is their only solution to not getting banned.

Sure, you use should and might and can. But, you also just said that this thread isn't an opinion, so, I'm not sure how I should consider it.


It's not "just" an opinion. The possibility exists and my opinion on how to deal with that possibility. That's the original post summed up. Whether people feel that it's better to help players reform with a warning mail or not is up to them.

I've started working on a guide to avoiding toxic behavior. I hope that a lot of people can pitch in with their views.

http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=3631048